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  1. #451

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    Quote Originally Posted by A. Kingstone View Post
    The great thing is we can still inquire.

    New York this Tuesday (unless he's in Italy already).
    Acording to some facebook pages he’s in russia, and unfortunately was hospitalized for not feeling good. Hope he gets well soon!

    Here’s the text I’ve seen on FB yesterday:

    Code:
     Tuesday, November 27, 2018
    Legendary Bebop Pianist Barry Harris Hospitalized in Moscow
    Legendary bebop pianist Barry Haris, 88, was hospitalized in Moscow, Russia, Sunday early morning. On Monday, November 26, he was out of ICU, but the excellent doctors at the Nikolay Pirogov First City Hospital in Moscow said he should remain in hospital for a few more days before he can fly back to the U.S. Maestro Harris' Jazz Workshop in Rostov, Russia, scheduled for November 26-30, was canceled. Jazz.Ru Magazine is keeping track of the situation. The latest from the 1st CH's Chief Medical Officer, Dr. Alexei Svet, member of the American College of Cardiology, is that their patient is stable but requires treatment before his flight home.

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    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #452

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    i messed around and here is my best guess what he would do. disclaimer: i wouldnt call this a barry harris idea since i haven’t seen it.
    D-Eb-F-G-Ab-Bb-B
    I did!! (Like it)
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  4. #453

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    not sure if it’s harmonic minor, kinda sounds like it, but i’m think Bb7 starting the 3rd to the 3rd of G
    Harmonic major from the 3rd degree.

  5. #454

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    as for the thread I gave up on it since i didnt have anyone following along, so it’s free for all now..
    I think it's a great thread. For me, this is the Barry Harris practice group. We can all share our progress with practicing anything related to Barry Harris. I keep practicing my Barry every week, but not necessarily the way Chris put it. Though I'm learning a lot from his videos.
    I'll try to put up some videos this week, hopefully others will put theirs as well, and we can get this group to continue. We don't have to practice the same stuff, but it's useful to see what other folks are doing.

    I share the frustration raised by @petimar and @rlhett before, about trying to break out from licks and scale practice. Obviously extending the vocabulary by listening and transcribing, and then practice those patterns, is a big part of the process (which I do *a lot*).

    But at the core of Barry's workshop there's the part where he build lines with the horns over some changes. For me, this is the highlight of his videos. His methodical thinking like "you start a phrase on the 2nd of the dominant, put two half steps till reaching the 7, from there play a major7 arpeggio up, now you'r on the 6th, go down the scale to the third of the dominant, then up the diminished arpeggio...etc, etc", this should be our goal, this is how to connect the ABCs (not so much the scale practice, which we end up discussing often when talking about the Barry system, that's important too, but that's not the end goal).
    Currently I think I'm able to build this way strong lines offline, and practice them as licks, etc. I'm still not there trying to do it spontaneously, even in slow tempos... That's where I'm at in my journey.

    Cheers.

  6. #455
    Quote Originally Posted by PMB View Post
    Harmonic major from the 3rd degree.
    damn im fancy!
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  7. #456

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    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop View Post
    Please explain the advantage of thinking Bb7 scale when playing G7 b9 rather than seeing the G7 b9 scale in its own right.

    My understanding of this is it gets you used to using hte same dominant language you already use on a major ii-V-I on a minor Even the connections (diminished) are similar. The main difference is the set of destination tones.

    So your Dm7b5 G7 Cm is closely related to Fm7 Bb7 Eb

    The difference is whether is mostly context. Cm on Eb is of course Eb6. If you use an A, you'll imply Cm6.

  8. #457

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    Quote Originally Posted by tamirgal View Post
    Acording to some facebook pages he’s in russia, and unfortunately was hospitalized for not feeling good. Hope he gets well soon!


    I got word that Barry is feeling better.

  9. #458

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77 View Post
    My understanding of this is it gets you used to using hte same dominant language you already use on a major ii-V-I on a minor Even the connections (diminished) are similar. The main difference is the set of destination tones.

    So your Dm7b5 G7 Cm is closely related to Fm7 Bb7 Eb

    The difference is whether is mostly context. Cm on Eb is of course Eb6. If you use an A, you'll imply Cm6.
    The so-called "backdoor progression" (Fm7-Bb7-C or iv7-bVII7-I) makes sense when seen from this angle.

  10. #459

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    Its the same thing (almost)

    In terms of soloing you wouldn’t differentiate between them much

  11. #460

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    Quote Originally Posted by christianm77 View Post
    Its the same thing (almost)

    In terms of soloing you wouldn’t differentiate between them much
    Particularly when playing over "Cole Porter" ii-V-Is that resolve to the parallel major: Dm7b5-G7b9-C6.

  12. #461

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    Quote Originally Posted by PMB View Post
    Particularly when playing over "Cole Porter" ii-V-Is that resolve to the parallel major: Dm7b5-G7b9-C6.
    That particular progression - although not the backdoor - belongs to the maj6 dim scale. I remember Barry saying you can always play minor ii-V (unless you are comping for the melody and you have a clash, presumably?)

    Interestingly, people seem to have a bit of a bee in their bonnet about the opposite - major ii v into minor

    Dm7 G9 Cm6

    But this progression is actually pretty common in jazz lines and tunes.

    The notes of the chords all belong to the min6-dim

    C D Eb F G Ab A B

    D F A C
    G B D F A
    C Eb G A

  13. #462

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    Minor ii-V resolving to major is something I’ve heard many times in jazz. The first example that come to my mind is all the things you are. I hear Charlie Parker outline it on the bridge, maybe on the A section too.
    Do you have example of the major ii-V going to minor?

  14. #463

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    Sure, check out bar 2 of Blues for Alice

    If you play Em7b5 there you’ll clash with the head.

    In terms of the chords another good example is the middle 8 of invitation

    Charlie Christian on anything, but I Found a New Baby

    I could go on....

  15. #464

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    Thanks. Charlie Christian is not someone I’ve been listening to too much. His on my todo list

  16. #465
    shadow of your smile i think?
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  17. #466

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    Ok. Back to the topic of building lines, and in an attempt to make this thread a practice thread, here goes...

    As a collector of Barry’s licks, I thought I’d share couple of those and share how I practice them.
    Here’s one I grabbed from Barry’s solo on ‘You Can Depend on Me’ with Sonny Stitt:

    Things I learned from Barry Harris Study Group-barry-harris-line-you-can-depend-me-jpg

    Nice and simple line, right? Barry plays a nice relaxed solo on this one. You can listen to the recording here (the line is at 3:00):



    So first thing I do is try to analyse the line in Barry’s style (watch the numbers on the notation):


    1. Barry start the phrase with the important arpeggio found on the 7th of the dominant. I dare to say that out of Barry’s important arpeggios, this is the most important. Or at least the one I think he plays the most. Anyway, that’s a great arpeggio to focus on when practicing building lines on maj ii-V. Here he start the arpeggio half step below the root.
    2. Next, Barry is on the 6th, put one half step between the 6th and the 5th, then continue down the scale to the third of the dominant. Transcribing bunch of Barry’s solos I can say that he fonds the half step between the 6 and the 5 on a dominant. Though his half step rules usually talk about playing single half step between 1 and 7, at least what I’ve seen is that he equally play them both.
    3. Now he’s on the 3rd of the dominant. He will probably now say “on the third of every dominant found the diminished”. So here he goes down the diminished triad, and enclose it up 2 half steps to resolve to the 5th of C maj. This figure here is what Thomas Owens calls M.5B, and this is one of the most used figures used in bebop (his words, not mine). That’s probably a good thing to practice when hitting the 3rd of the dominant. Obviously any diminished line from the 3rd of the dominant would fit here.
    4. Now he’s on the 5th of the I major. Here he plays his ‘4’ phrase. This one is somewhat related to the M.5B figure. They sound good when played together. Obviously here you can just as well play the ‘5’ phrase, which start and end on the same notes.
    5. Now he’s on the 3rd of the I major. Can you tell what he plays here? To me that’s his ‘3’ phrase, but with added note between the G and the B.


    After we understand what Barry is doing, and maybe practiced it on our instrument. A nice exercise is to try to mod and tweak the line while keeping the same structure of the phrase. We can start by first thinking about it offline, then try it spontaneously on the instrument, keep playing the line in loop, but every time change something about it. I think it’s a nice exercise, as we keep frame of the line the same, but add some micro improvisation to it, mostly within Barry’s ABCs. That is either add pivoting, instead of 1 half step put 2 half steps, put in a different diminished line, etc.

    Anyone care to join me trying to tweak this line? You can either post a video, or just write it down.

    Here’s an example of my attempt at it. There are probably endless of other possibilities:

    Things I learned from Barry Harris Study Group-you-can-depend-me-mod-1-jpg

    Can you spot what I did there? Is it essentially the same line idea or not?
    If this is gonna be successful, more licks will follow. Also, I'll try to post a video over the weekend.

    Any feedback is welcome.

    Cheers

  18. #467

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    As promised, a video!



    Any Comment, feedback, coffee, welcome...

    Cheers.

  19. #468

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    Nice work tamirgal...I like this idea ...alot.

    Looking at it I see just a descending G6 dim at your #2.
    Last edited by WILSON 1; 11-30-2018 at 10:20 PM.
    If you can distinguish between rehearsing and practicing...you're better than half way there!

  20. #469

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    Thanks Wilson.
    Let's walk through #2:



    1. I replaced the F maj arpeggio with a pivoted variation of F maj arpeggio (more on that later)
    2. Down the scale from the 6th, stayed the same, but octave lower.
    3. From the 3rd of the dominant, instead of going down the diminished enclosure, I went up the diminished arpeggio, resolving similarly to the 5th of C.
    4. Instead of doing Barry’s ‘4’ phrase, I did the ‘5’ phrase.
    5. ‘3’ phrase stayed the same



    Regarding (1) above, to me this figure is basically F major arpeggio (with added G note). See below example:

    Things I learned from Barry Harris Study Group-fmaj-arp-variations-jpg

    All the above figures are rhythmically similar, all have the sound of F major, and all end on the same note. They are interchangeable, but add variety to our playing.

    Below are more of those kind of shapes that can be used where usually you would just put an arpeggio (can be either major or minor):

    Things I learned from Barry Harris Study Group-triads-jpg

    I think these are important enough so I gave them names , I’ve heard Barry play all of those shapes, but T1,T2 and T4 are the ones I think he uses the most. T4 he will either play like that, or pivot it.
    I you look closely at the '3' phrase (with that added note) that Barry play at the end of the original lick, this is basically a pivoted T4 minor arpeggio from the third of I major.

    BTW, in my video I played another variation of the original line, check it out (the last take)

    Cheers,
    Tamir

  21. #470

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    Am I correct in assuming that the 54321 phrases usually happen on the tonic chords and not on the Dominants much?

  22. #471
    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop View Post
    Am I correct in assuming that the 54321 phrases usually happen on the tonic chords and not on the Dominants much?

    no, i think in the dvd he teaches them on the dominant first. we should practice equally on minor major and dom, though i have to confess i have practiced dominant the most. also jote there really are just small adjustments between them
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  23. #472

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    5 and 4 work nicely on dominant. They land you on the 3rd of the dominant, from there you can play a diminished line.

  24. #473

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    Quote Originally Posted by tamirgal View Post
    5 and 4 work nicely on dominant. They land you on the 3rd of the dominant, from there you can play a diminished line.
    When you say dominant line, I assume arpeggio? Or something else? Just interested...
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  25. #474

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    Quote Originally Posted by Petimar View Post
    When you say dominant line, I assume arpeggio? Or something else? Just interested...
    Something to bring out the diminished. Probably arpeggio, but might be something else.

    Some examples here (these are resolving to minor chord, but you get the idea):
    Diminished Resolution.pdf - Google Drive

  26. #475

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    Tamirgal, Can you tell me what you mean by pivoting?

    Thanks edh
    "Ahhh - those Jazz guys are just makin' that stuff up!" - Homer Simpson

    "Anyone who understands Jazz knows that you can't understand it. It's too complicated. That's what's so simple about it." - Yogi Berra

  27. #476

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    I believe tamirgal is referring to the concept of descending/ascending a scale or arpeggio and at some point before finishing hoping an octave. For example, a chord that starts on the 5-3-root(one octave higher)-6 thus ending actual above your starting point despite descending. In theory you could descend or ascend a scale/arpeggio indefinitely without running out of register on your instrument.

    It is apparently something Barry Harris teaches a lot and is all over the workshop DVD's, YouTube, etc., as well as method books that are based on BH.

  28. #477

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    Right. Pivoting is part of Barry's ABC. Anyone interested in Barry's system need to be aware of it and practice it.

    Here's example of Barry talking about it (talk starts ~minute 12:00, barry suggest how to practice it ~14:30):


  29. #478

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    I think surrounds (enclosures) target chord tones root, 3rd and 5th most of the time rather than 2 4 or 7. Agree?
    I have attached a .pdf of my revised outline for i vi ii V7 drill.
    An also attached a .pdf of 5432 Phrases in C minor, note the "4" phrase using a chromatic triplet

    Cmi.SCALES.pdf
    5432.MINOR.pdf

  30. #479

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    Is this in Alan Kingstone's book?

    Let me see if I understand you correctly. Let's do this in C. Starting on G(5th string 10th fret) you descend to E(5th str. 7fret), then you play Root(C) one octave above(4th str. 10th fret). And Lastly descend to the six A(4th str. 7th fret)...is this correct?

    Is there an example of this somewhere?


    thanks for your help guys.

    edh
    "Ahhh - those Jazz guys are just makin' that stuff up!" - Homer Simpson

    "Anyone who understands Jazz knows that you can't understand it. It's too complicated. That's what's so simple about it." - Yogi Berra

  31. #480

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    What are the bebop changes per Barry for a C minor Blues?

    Please see the attached pdf Minor.Blues.SCALES.pdf

    |: C-6 | D-7b5 G7b9 | C-6 | (G-7b5) C7b9 |
    | F-6| F-6 (G7b9) | C-6 | (Bb-7 Eb7) |
    | Ab7 | G7b9 | C-6 A-7b5 | D-7b5 G7b9 :|
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by rintincop; 12-08-2018 at 10:49 PM.

  32. #481

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    Quote Originally Posted by edh View Post
    Is this in Alan Kingstone's book?

    Let me see if I understand you correctly. Let's do this in C. Starting on G(5th string 10th fret) you descend to E(5th str. 7fret), then you play Root(C) one octave above(4th str. 10th fret). And Lastly descend to the six A(4th str. 7th fret)...is this correct?

    Is there an example of this somewhere?


    thanks for your help guys.

    edh
    Alan's book is about harmony, not single line improvisation.

    BH does not have his own book (at least that I know of). The most complete resource is the Workshop DVD that Howard Reese published. Several other authors (like Roni Ben Hur and "Talk Jazz") have written books teaching or interpreting BH. There are examples of pivoting in both those resources, as well as innumerable YouTubes of Barry Harris including the one Tamilgal already linked to. As Joe said, it is a foundational concept of BH. A little Google and you should have no problem finding examples.

  33. #482

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    Please critique the Minor Blues Scales .pdf attached to this post.
    Thanks,
    rintin

    Minor.Blues.SCALES.pdf
    Last edited by rintincop; 12-09-2018 at 01:56 PM.

  34. #483

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    Has anyone hipped Chris (things I learnt from Barry harris guy) to our threads dedicated to the Harris methods?

  35. #484

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    Chris' latest videos breaking down Bird phrases are really good. I like the process of learning all melodic ideas on all degrees of the scale. I have done this ocasionally but will do this much more now as I bet it leads to freedom to play any phrase at any time.

    Will we ever get a Barry Harris icon at the bottom?????
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  36. #485

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  37. #486

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    Chris' newest 3 videos (#34-36) are all very good talking about how to incorporate everything into lines.
    Pete Martin - just a mandolin guy but loves jazz guitar
    www.PetimarPress.com
    Www.Jazz-Mandolin.com
    Pete Plays Wes free download
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  38. #487

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    As I watch, I am mapping out Chris' videos in PDF files, saying what is where on each video (what time in the vid each idea is shown). I have about 2/3 of them done, concentrating on his single note ideas, not the chording stuff right now. If anyone is interested, PM me with your email address.
    Pete Martin - just a mandolin guy but loves jazz guitar
    www.PetimarPress.com
    Www.Jazz-Mandolin.com
    Pete Plays Wes free download
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  39. #488

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    Quote Originally Posted by tamirgal View Post
    "you start a phrase on the 2nd of the dominant, put two half steps till reaching the 7, from there play a major7 arpeggio up, now you'r on the 6th, go down the scale to the third of the dominant, then up the diminished arpeggio...etc, etc", this should be our goal, this is how to connect the ABCs (not so much the scale practice....


    Cheers.
    Arpeggios
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  40. #489

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    I remember pianist Lonnie Smith on Marian McPartland’s Piano Jazz radio show playing What Is This Thing Called Love. He would play the first 4 bars each time as:
    || G-7 | C7 | Fmi
    I thought that’s a refreshing sounding change. so that’s another example of major ii V to minor i.
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  41. #490

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    Speaking of playing a major dominant where you might normally hear a minor/altered dominant:


  42. #491

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    .
    The "5 4 3 2 phrases" are great.

    How about adding a 6 and 7 and a 1 phrase to the drills?
    I think treat the with the same shape as the 4 phrase.
    Last edited by rintincop; 05-28-2019 at 12:48 AM.

  43. #492

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    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop View Post
    .
    The "5 4 3 2 phrases" are great.

    How about adding a 6 and 7 and a 1 phrase to the drills?
    I think treat the with the same shape as the 4 phrase.
    Things I learned from Barry Harris Study Group-screen-shot-2019-05-28-9-27-44-am-png

  44. #493

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    Thank you. Are those first 6 beats per Barry Harris or is it of your own invention?
    Last edited by rintincop; 05-29-2019 at 01:59 PM.

  45. #494
    Anyone interested in starting this back up? we would be here:

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  46. #495

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    Quote Originally Posted by rintincop View Post
    Thank you. Are those first 6 beats per Barry Harris or is it of your own invention?
    My own extrapolation from the 5-4-3-2 phrase. I’ve used it for years.

  47. #496

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Anyone interested in starting this back up? we would be here:
    I’m in!
    Those examples at the end of the vid are so good. Someone need to transcribe them

  48. #497
    Tamir, How long for this video? two weeks or a month? it’s a ton of material— i’d say a month
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  49. #498

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Tamir, How long for this video? two weeks or a month? it’s a ton of material— i’d say a month
    Agree. If taking it seriously, it means doing more than one key, with added triplets or moving up and down the scale. Then practicing building lines on ii-V. Lots of material

  50. #499
    k cool!
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  51. #500

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    Quote Originally Posted by joe2758 View Post
    Anyone interested in starting this back up? we would be here:
    I'm in. Outline of what is in this video is here:
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Pete Martin - just a mandolin guy but loves jazz guitar
    www.PetimarPress.com
    Www.Jazz-Mandolin.com
    Pete Plays Wes free download
    www.jazz-mandolin.com/PetePlaysWes.xht