6 months into jazz - overwhelmed and not sure where to focus. Advice?

[onezeho]

If you can't find someone to play jazz with, or think there is nobody else interested in jazz, go to blues jams or open mics wearing a Miles Davis t-shit until someone talks to you about it.

"Nice shirt, Miles is great"
"Thanks, do you play?"

haha, good advice!

[jazzloverfat]

Yes, I listen to a lot of jazz, but right now it's a pretty chaotic process - I try to listen attentively through full albums but it doesn't always work out. I don't have a favourite artist yet that I could keep coming back to again and again. Trumpet players are what I love most. Here's what resonates with me so far:

1. Kind of Blue by Miles Davis - I love putting it on late at night
2. Kenny Dorham, Gerry Mulligan, Cannonball Adderley, Johnny Hodges
3. Atomic Basie - a big love, I adore it

I listen to others in bits and pieces and enjoy them too, but haven't given them the proper attention yet: Bill Evans, Louis Armstrong, Dizzy, Charlie Parker, Chet Baker, Brubeck, Hancock
I haven't listened to much guitar - it somehow put me off, not sure why. The one thing I love from Joe Pass is Offbeat from Virtuoso #3

When I said "rhythmically falling apart" I meant that when I try to transcribe rhythm, I lose the plot - I can't hear the subdivisions and sometimes can't even lock in with the basic pulse. I recently tried to transcribe the piano melody from Louis Armstrong's A Kiss to Build a Dream On, but when I started putting it into Guitar Pro I got completely lost with the rhythm

Any listening recommendations are welcome!

I can relate to so much of what you said!
Re: listening habits, I LOVE trumpet players and it's pretty much what got me into jazz in the first place (I came to it through rap and hip hop tracks that sampled jazz and I wanted to hear more of that). While I like playing guitar, I feel the same way about listening to jazz so I am VERY picky about what kind of purely jazz guitar music I listen to; oddly I do not have this issue w blues or rock ¯\_("/)_/¯

As for recommendations, here's a couple random things jazz guitar that I could listen to on repeat:
first, from Jim Hall: Jim Hall & Pat Metheny (it's a collab album and one of the best I've heard) and Concierto (for the lineup and for the Concierto de Aranjuez track which is one of my absolute fav pieces for classical guitar)
next, Julian Lage - Live in Los Angeles (songs from his Arclight album, also available as a hi-def YT vod so you can see the magik not just hear it)

[onezeho]

I can relate to so much of what you said!
Re: listening habits, I LOVE trumpet players and it's pretty much what got me into jazz in the first place (I came to it through rap and hip hop tracks that sampled jazz and I wanted to hear more of that). While I like playing guitar, I feel the same way about listening to jazz so I am VERY picky about what kind of purely jazz guitar music I listen to; oddly I do not have this issue w blues or rock ¯\_("/)_/¯

As for recommendations, here's a couple random things jazz guitar that I could listen to on repeat:
first, from Jim Hall: Jim Hall & Pat Metheny (it's a collab album and one of the best I've heard) and Concierto (for the lineup and for the Concierto de Aranjuez track which is one of my absolute fav pieces for classical guitar)
next, Julian Lage - Live in Los Angeles (songs from his Arclight album, also available as a hi-def YT vod so you can see the magik not just hear it)

Thank you for the recommendations, I will definitely give them a listen

[bumblebee]

Thanks for the replies guys! A teacher is tricky right now, but I'll try to sort that out.

Then get a good Method book. I've seen lots of recommendations for Beginning Jazz Guitar by Jody Fisher.

I'm not a jazz guitarist. Never will be. I just can't take jazz for more than 5-6 minutes. At first I'm spellbound by the sheer beauty of it, and then I'm like: Stop it. It's driving me nuts. Can't stand another minute of it. Sensory overload maybe.

I started guitar almost a year ago. I checked out Youtube and playing all-chord songs before even knowing the notes seemed weird to me. Besides, I can't stand most chords unless they're broken. Now that I'm doing Leavitt's Method, I hold the chord shape, check each note, melt with the loveliness of a broken chord, strum, WINCE, break the chord again & decide for the umpteenth time I'm not quitting the guitar despite its vile chords (far worse than piano chords).

I learned the notes and the fretboard cold by doing most of Tom Bruner's Sight Reading for the Contemporary Guitarist (the first 3 out of his 4 fretboard regions, I'm not touching the 4th region before I'm getting a cutaway). Of course I wasn't using the book the way Bruner meant it to be used. It took long months of daily practice because I'm playing without looking, but it was worth it. Then I was at a loss, a bit like you, though you know so much more than I do, so I looked for a method book. Nothing beats a good method book. It takes you by the hand and guides you where you want to go.

Edited to add: Troy Stetina's Fretboard Mastery might be useful for you as well.

[GuyBoden]

So, what does your teacher recommend right now?

Yes as marcshy asks..I would recommend a very good teacher.

Getting a teacher is probably the best advice, and a good teacher will probably just be guiding you through this.

Yes, get a teacher. It will save you a lot of time.

Yes, get a teacher!

When you finally find your teacher, tell him/her that you want to learn how to swing.

Really seek them out, they are world class and good teachers.

I agree with getting a teacher

Having read all the replies, the over whelming advice seems to be: "Get a Teacher"

[CliffR]

I think the OP said getting a teacher wasn't practical for them at the moment. If it's a question of locality, then remote lessons by Zoom worked for me. Otherwise, maybe an online course by one of the better youtube jazz educators. I got a lot out of Jens Larsen's Jazz Guitar Roadmap, which is aimed towards folks just getting into jazz.

[AllanAllen]

I'm not a jazz guitarist. Never will be. I just can't take jazz for more than 5-6 minutes. At first I'm spellbound by the sheer beauty of it, and then I'm like: Stop it. It's driving me nuts. Can't stand another minute of it. Sensory overload maybe.

Why are you here then? It's intriguing that someone who can't stand jazz is taking time to visit and comment on a jazz guitar forum.

I'm not trying to be rude, but just want to know what's the story. For example, we have a regular poster who is a working blues musician that came to cop licks.

[joe2758]

Then get a good Method book. I've seen lots of recommendations for Beginning Jazz Guitar by Jody Fisher.

I'm not a jazz guitarist. Never will be. I just can't take jazz for more than 5-6 minutes. At first I'm spellbound by the sheer beauty of it, and then I'm like: Stop it. It's driving me nuts. Can't stand another minute of it. Sensory overload maybe.

I started guitar almost a year ago. I checked out Youtube and playing all-chord songs before even knowing the notes seemed weird to me. Besides, I can't stand most chords unless they're broken. Now that I'm doing Leavitt's Method, I hold the chord shape, check each note, melt with the loveliness of a broken chord, strum, WINCE, break the chord again & decide for the umpteenth time I'm not quitting the guitar despite its vile chords (far worse than piano chords).

I learned the notes and the fretboard cold by doing most of Tom Bruner's Sight Reading for the Contemporary Guitarist (the first 3 out of his 4 fretboard regions, I'm not touching the 4th region before I'm getting a cutaway). Of course I wasn't using the book the way Bruner meant it to be used. It took long months of daily practice because I'm playing without looking, but it was worth it. Then I was at a loss, a bit like you, though you know so much more than I do, so I looked for a method book. Nothing beats a good method book. It takes you by the hand and guides you where you want to go.

Edited to add: Troy Stetina's Fretboard Mastery might be useful for you as well.

Best first post in history

[GuyBoden]

No excuses, the OP needs to 'Get a Teacher' or they'll be going around in circles for many, many years with very little improvement.

Sorry, but Method Books are great for gathering dust on the shelf, with the occasional visit. IMO.

Edit: My BookShelf


But, it's only my hobby, so what do I know.

[bumblebee]

But a method book IS a teacher. It's the very best of the teacher who wrote it. Letting a method book gather dust on a shelf is like hiring a teacher but showing up for a lesson once in a blue moon. The uselessness of a method book isn't inherent in the book itself. It derives from what you do with the book. I started going around in circles before I found Leavitt, and now I feel I'm on the right path & actually progressing.

[Reg]

Lots of good advice....

Your never going to get very good at playing in a jazz style... or playing jazz tunes...

Unless you get your technical skills together. Your technical skills on the guitar, the fretboard etc...

Takes 6 months to a couple years, depending your routine and time organization etc...

Without technical skills... the best you can do is memorize and play what you have memorized.

Jazz is complicated... soloing is at best 25% of your playing.

Most of the time your comping, so also get your comping technical skills together.

I've posted lots of material ... but I'll try and post some new material if your interested...

[bumblebee]

[AllanAllen]

But a method book IS a teacher. It's the very best of the teacher who wrote it. Letting a method book gather dust on a shelf is like hiring a teacher but showing up for a lesson once in a blue moon. The uselessness of a method book isn't inherent in the book itself. It derives from what you do with the book. I started going around in circles before I found Leavitt, and now I feel I'm on the right path & actually progressing.

Yeah, I agree here.

Get a book and stick with it, Leavitt, Fisher, or my boy Mickey Baker. Just finish any intro to jazz guitar book, the technical skills Reg talks about are covered in them all.

Buying 10 books and finishing none of them will get you GuyBoden's bookshelf.

[GuyBoden]

Lots of good advice....

Your never going to get very good at playing in a jazz style... or playing jazz tunes...

Unless you get your technical skills together. Your technical skills on the guitar, the fretboard etc...

Takes 6 months to a couple years, depending your routine and time organization etc...

Without technical skills... the best you can do is memorize and play what you have memorized.

Jazz is complicated... soloing is at best 25% of your playing.

Most of the time your comping, so also get your comping technical skills together.

I've posted lots of material ... but I'll try and post some new material if your interested...

Listen closely to Reg, he knows how to play Jazz.

[onezeho]

but I'll try and post some new material if your interested...

Yes, please!

[rpjazzguitar]

Listen closely to Reg, he knows how to play Jazz.

Is there a clear list of exactly what "technical skills" are being referred to?

[Strat-itis]

More tunes, less "stuff."

Tunes, and pick stuff to study to add to the tunes.

[AllanAllen]

Is there a clear list of exactly what "technical skills" are being referred to?

Reg's Thread... live at the speed of Jazz

[ragman1]

Keeping time is probably one of them. Getting the guitar in tune helps. After that god knows

[GuyBoden]

I'm climbing Everest, but I'll be ok, because I've bought a "Method Book".

[pamosmusic]

I'm climbing Everest, but I'll be ok, because I've bought a "Method Book".

Worth noting that jazz guitar won’t kill you if you make a wrong step

[James W]

Worth noting that jazz guitar won’t kill you if you make a wrong step

You might develop a fiendish dependency on noodling, however...

[AllanAllen]

Worth noting that jazz guitar won’t kill you if you make a wrong step

Yeah man, like Jimmy Bruno always says "It's just music, it ain't fuckin' rocket science"

[CliffR]

Yeah man, like Jimmy Bruno always says "It's just music, it ain't fuckin' rocket science"

It's not even brain surgery.

[mr. beaumont]

So to distill the pertinent information.

1. First, be able to actually play the guitar. Old guy tip #1, get your picking in order now, or it'll never be

2. Learn a bunch of tunes

3. Learn a bunch of chords. Good news, to do #2 you'll need to do #3

4. Challenge your ear right from the start. Transcribe melodies. If all you can hear right now is the head to C jam blues, that's fine.

5. Yes, there's scales, arpeggios, 50 different books, YouTube channels with good graphics, YouTube Channels from people who actually play well, apps, mystic runes, and tai chi. Old guy tip #2, know a few things really well instead of "knowing about" a bunch of things.

6. Play with others, any chance possible