What did you learn from Miles Davis?

[Mick-7]

Watching Miles' back is a big deal. I'm more interested in the music than the backs of the artists.

Just shy I guess.

When I saw him, he stood off to the side of the stage a lot, I gathered that he wanted to be able to see all the band members as he was conducting them, frequently cued them on when to change the tempo, dynamics, etc. Can't really do that properly with your back to the band.

It is kind of irrational to say "I don't like Miles music" because he had a such a long career, from boppin' with Bird to Post-Bop/Jazz Impressionism to Fusion, etc. So which music do you dislike, surely not all of it?

[John A.]

I saw Miles in the early 80's.He played almost the entire show with his back to the audience.What i learned is not to waste my money going to see him again.

He had been doing that since his earliest days as a band leader. He also often walked off stage. FWIW, I saw him twice in the early 80s as well (with the Miller/Foster/Evans/Stern/Cinelu line-up). At the time I didn't know that he had a reputation for doing this or that it bothered some people. I don't remember taking any particular notice of it. In his autobiography, he said that he did it so that he could communicate with the other players and in order take the audience's attention off him specifically and shift it onto the other soloists. Makes sense to me and strikes me as a complete non-issue. I care about how the music sounds, not about the players' onstage idiosyncrasies. I thought the band was amazing, and I found his minimalism in contrast with the other players' expansiveness fascinating.

[Jimmy blue note]

I saw Miles in the early 80's.He played almost the entire show with his back to the audience.What i learned is not to waste my money going to see him again.

I saw Lenny Bernstein with the NY Phil. He didn't turn around ONCE. It was the ultimate dis.
' saw Keith Jarrett. Only saw his side. And I paid full price. I was so annoyed that I didn't hear a note he played.... or maybe that was his squealing.

[kris]

I actually enjoy a show where the artist can have some respect for the audience.And oh by the way,his playing sucked that night.I remember a newspaper review saying all he did was incessant noodling which was pretty accurate.I could deal with the off night but the whole i'm too good for you people that payed money to see me was just a turnoff.

Do you know how many brilliant albums MD has recorded?

[pamosmusic]

I don't know man. I went and saw Bob Dylan in 2007 or so.

It was .......... what it was.

But I was grateful to see Bob.

[Strat-itis]

I'm kinda over Miles, wouldn't ever voluntarily put on his stuff. I like his different periods like the classic, the late 60s trad mixed with fusion, into the fusion in the 70s. He's just played out for me, plus he was never my favorite player in the first place with his non rhythmic sparse playing.

[James W]

The day I 'get over' Miles is the day I die.

[pamosmusic]

I'm kinda over Miles, wouldn't ever voluntarily put on his stuff. I like his different periods like the classic, the late 60s trad mixed with fusion, into the fusion in the 70s. He's just played out for me, plus he was never my favorite player in the first place with his non rhythmic sparse playing.

Sparse?

perhaps.

Non-rhythmic?

....

[gp5jb2]

Only caught him once in '83 as part of the day long Kool Jazz Festival, I guess cigarette companies don't sponsor jazz fests anymore. It was in support of his Star People lp and of course he played Michael Jackson's Human Nature.
He came out in a pink jump suit, big pink sunglasses w a pink trumpet.
A security guard had his back to the stage and Miles appeared from the back and walked straight to the security guard, put the bell of his horn right over the top of the guards head and blew one of those loud bleats he was known for, scared the crap outta him much to the delight of the crowd.
A young Marcus Miller stole the show, I can't remember if it was Scofield or Stern on guitar.

I saw Miles on the Kool Jazz tour in Atlanta in 1983. Stern on guitar, Marcus on bass. Bill Evans on sax if irc

[nyc chaz]

Do you know how many brilliant albums MD has recorded?

I have over 30 of Miles recordings. What does greatness at doing one thing have to do with calling someone out for disrespectful behavior?

[sgcim]

Only caught him once in '83 as part of the day long Kool Jazz Festival, I guess cigarette companies don't sponsor jazz fests anymore. It was in support of his Star People lp and of course he played Michael Jackson's Human Nature.
He came out in a pink jump suit, big pink sunglasses w a pink trumpet.
A security guard had his back to the stage and Miles appeared from the back and walked straight to the security guard, put the bell of his horn right over the top of the guards head and blew one of those loud bleats he was known for, scared the crap outta him much to the delight of the crowd.
A young Marcus Miller stole the show, I can't remember if it was Scofield or Stern on guitar.

Is your screen name after the Hoagy Carnichael tune or the Laurindo Almeida tune?
A friend of mine emailed me the music the LA "Winter Moon yesterday.

[Strat-itis]

Sparse? perhaps. Non-rhythmic?

He could obviously hang but it seems like he's always slobbing around and not grooving that hard. Not my thing. Especially for someone dubbed preeminent jazz musician.

[kris]

I have over 30 of Miles recordings. What does greatness at doing one thing have to do with calling someone out for disrespectful behavior?

I was at a concert where Miles had a very high respect for the audience/He also had moments when he stood with his back to the audience/.. .
I have to admit that the more I listen to Miles' recordings, the more I like him.
He played with incredible taste and great culture.

[pamosmusic]

He could obviously hang but it seems like he's always slobbing around and not grooving that hard. Not my thing. Especially for someone dubbed preeminent jazz musician.

ur mad

[Strat-itis]

no way

[DC Cornelius]

What caused the fuss was the claim Miles didn't have a major influence on the direction of jazz. That is just utter nonsense.

It is utter nonsense. Who, where did someone claim that in this thread?

[jameslovestal]

It is utter nonsense. Who, where did someone claim that in this thread?

This was already covered and you know it. One of your posts implied that MD didn't have a major influence, but after multiple back and forth posts with Pamosmusic, you then clarified that you only meant that he didn't have an influence to you. Anyhow time to move on.

[pamosmusic]

It is utter nonsense. Who, where did someone claim that in this thread?

this is tiresome.

read what you wrote.

Underestimating a jazz icon is probably very risky.

In what way?

In Miles case you probably just miss a whole through line of the music.

He was a key innovator in pretty much Major trend in the music …

bebop
cool
modal
fusion

and the things he wasn’t spearheading, he sort of defined.

e.g. Ornette was the free jazz dude, and Miles was riding coattails, but Coltrane in his classic quartet and Miles in the second quintet really defined what free jazz would look like in the musics mainstream. Miles called the second quintet approach “time no changes” improvising, for example, which has been enormously influential.

you took a pull quote specifically of where I said "He was a key innovator in pretty much Major trend in the music …"

and you said

To you he obviously was. To me he was not! Don't sound so surprised & shocked that someone feels differently to you about something. You love MD. He's been a major influence in your life. Great, enjoy & have fun.

Due respect, but it's not a "to me" thing ...

We don't really get to ignore the influence that Kind of Blue had on literally every jazz (and rock) musician who came after. We also don't get to ignore the enormous influence that Miles was on John Coltrane, on Bill Evans, on Wayne Shorter, on Herbie Hancock, Keith Jarrett, Chick Corea, and all the others who came through his bands -- and the enormous influence that those guys had on everything around them.

Pretty much anything you play in the blues, jazz, funk, fusion sphere is barely two degrees of separation from Miles.

You don't have to enjoy his music for that to be true. And it is.

fair enough

Then for some reason, you revived it later, quoting the same post, to say that I shouldn't tell you who and what you should like, which is not what I or anyone else was doing.

So please stop acting super offended and stuff when people read this as you saying that Miles was not influential. Perhaps it's not what you meant to say, but I don't think I could fault anyone (myself included) for reading it that way, given the context of the posts to which you were replying. If you were misinterpreted, then just say that's not what you meant. It's fine.

[Hep To The Jive]

Miles had great instintcts finding the right musicians for the right projects. One can learn from that. Also, the attitude! He had tons of it and it reflected in his music. Listening to his early recordings it might have been the case of 'fake it till you make it', but it sure worked!

[DC Cornelius]

this is tiresome.
So please stop acting super offended and stuff when people read this as you saying that Miles was not influential.

Yeah it is tiresome! I said right from the start= Not Influential TO ME!!! Give it a rest mate! Leave it

[pamosmusic]

Yeah it is tiresome! I said right from the start= Not Influential TO ME!!! Give it a rest mate! Leave it

deal. you too, then?

[Christian Miller]

Leave it aht your bang aht of ordah!

Who is Miles Davis?

[GuyBoden]

[kris]

[wolflen]

Here..Miles is teaching the speed bag to sing a Coltrane solo in all 12 keys