What did you learn from Miles Davis?

[sgcim]

1) To hire great musicians
2) To sell out when the you're not making a lot of money when people stop going to jazz clubs and stop buying jazz records.

[EastwoodMike]

play less. You don’t need to fill every waking moment with sound. Space is as important as the notes.

[DC Cornelius]

You must understand that you very much stand out from the crowd by thinking Miles Davis was useless as a jazz influence

I never once suggested MD was useless as a jazz influence!! What are you talking about!? So far it seems folk are putting words in my mouth I've never said!! MD has never appealed to me. That's it, sorry. This discussion has gone past my surreal threshold...It's getting a bit weird now for me

[supersoul]

I never once suggested MD was useless as a jazz influence!! What are you talking about!? So far it seems folk are putting words in my mouth I've never said!! MD has never appealed to me. That's it, sorry. This discussion has gone past my surreal threshold...It's getting a bit weird now for me

Surely you understand that saying "I can't stand Miles Davis" on a jazz website will provoke some strong reactions?

[Jimmy blue note]

I never once suggested MD was useless as a jazz influence!! What are you talking about!? So far it seems folk are putting words in my mouth I've never said!! MD has never appealed to me. That's it, sorry. This discussion has gone past my surreal threshold...It's getting a bit weird now for me

I'll admit it myself DC Cornelius, for a long time I found Mile's sidemen and Mile's story more intriguing than his music. I didn't get it myself. Lee Morgan, I got. Wayne Shorter, We Want Miles, Weather Report, Kind of Blue I got. It was a quiet curiousity that I felt there were more people who knew they "loved Miles" than had actually listened to him (he's a required Like if you're hip) but it took my a while. Then at some point, I realized how hard it was to come up with really good lines, and how easily he seemed to come up with great ones; then I became a life long fan.

Glad to see you've got your own taste. Seems the most important factour in developing a sense of musical identity is a strong sense of personal filters. A nod of respect to you.

[DC Cornelius]

Surely you understand that saying "I can't stand Miles Davis" on a jazz website will provoke some strong reactions?

I'm just stating a personal opinion via replying to the thread topic. I didn't consider it would provoke strong reactions. It's not as if it's the official MD fan club. I'm a jazz, blues rock guitarist. I started playing at the age of 4, 62 years ago.
Many kept on at me to listen to MD in my early days, so I did. I didn't like what I was hearing. I'm just being honest. I don't know what else to say. Maybe I should say nothing from now on & leave you lovely folk to it.. Have fun.

[Doctor Jeff]

Miles... I like how he followed his heart and wasn't afraid of going where his muse took him. He was a tough dude but his playing could be incredibly tender. He didn't play a lot of notes, but the ones he played always mattered. He knew how to use dissonance and playing outside with consonance and playing inside. His tone was beautiful.

I don't think he had a bad period. People like to rag on him for his 80s comeback, but that's what I'm listening to the most right now.

I agree.

He took chances, and the worst thing you could do if you were in Miles band was to play the “same old stuff the same way.”

His later stuff is hit or miss for me, but when he hits…it’s thrilling. Here’s a guy in his 60’s with a gazillion health problems, who didn’t even play for 5 years, a survivor—and he can put out music like that.

For instance—the bootleg tapes 1982-85:

Bad title - Wikipedia

I was a prog rat in the late 70s. Someone suggested I get a Miles album. I got Circle in the Round, with some great alternate versions of certain tunes like 2 Bass Hit and Guinevere. And then I got Bitches Brew. Mind blown.

This was more than mere flurries of notes. This was transcendental. Miles was continuing to push ahead, never content to stand still.

[dasein]

I learned how effective understatement can be. It wasn't just his use of space and silence, but also the way he could wring a lot of pathos out of the music without being hysterical (for lack of a better word). One moment that comes to mind is "Bess, You is My Woman Now" from "Porgy and Bess." At about 2:25, the Gil Evans band works up to a climax, and Miles comes back in. The temptation for way too many trumpet players would be to hit a big screaming high note. But Miles doesn't do that all. He holds back on the volume and the intensity. And it works so much more effectively. I've always been fascinated how he was never afraid to have his playing be vulnerable, something he avoided showing in just about every other area of his life.

I learned how important it is for a band to have a sound. When you think about the first Miles Quintet with Red Garland/Paul Chambers/Coltrane/Philly Joe Jones, you know exactly what they sound like. When you think of the band with Cannonball and Bill Evans, you know what that sounds like. Same with the Shorter/Hancock/Carter/Williams group. Even the electric bands all have their unique sounds.

It's not enough to just have a bunch of great players come in, read some charts, blow some solos, and call it a day. The best bands are instantly recognizable.

I learned the importance of contrast. He started his career playing with Charlie Parker, and he always made he had a sax player with monstrous technique in his groups. I really love that version of "Love for Sale" where Miles, Cannonball, Coltrane, and Bill Evans all take solos, all with a completely different approach to the tune.

I can't say I learned it form him, but I don't think any jazz musician better exemplified the importance of not getting complacent, continuing to evolve artistically, listening to what's going on out there (particularly musicians younger than you) and making it your own.

[ccroft]

... I attended a Miles concert in 1983 and under his influence I became a professional jazz musician.
It was a magical evening.

Saw him at Shelley's Manne-Hole April 1970. Small club. Same result. Probably the highlight of my time in the audience.

I can't say exactly what I learned from him. Everything maybe?

Bill Evans, though sorely disappointed by a new direction, called him the greatest lyrical soloist of all time. Hopefully I learned a little of that.

[Mick-7]

I'm just stating a personal opinion via replying to the thread topic. I didn't consider it would provoke strong reactions. It's not as if it's the official MD fan club. I'm a jazz, blues rock guitarist. I started playing at the age of 4, 62 years ago.

Many kept on at me to listen to MD in my early days, so I did. I didn't like what I was hearing. I'm just being honest. I don't know what else to say. Maybe I should say nothing from now on & leave you lovely folk to it.. Have fun.

Nah, no worries, mate, people have strong feelings about certain jazz icons, that's all.

This is the only time I saw Miles, with Keith Jarrett, Gary Bartz, et.al. Jarrett stopped playing electric piano after this stint with Miles.

[wintermoon]

Only caught him once in '83 as part of the day long Kool Jazz Festival, I guess cigarette companies don't sponsor jazz fests anymore. It was in support of his Star People lp and of course he played Michael Jackson's Human Nature.
He came out in a pink jump suit, big pink sunglasses w a pink trumpet.
A security guard had his back to the stage and Miles appeared from the back and walked straight to the security guard, put the bell of his horn right over the top of the guards head and blew one of those loud bleats he was known for, scared the crap outta him much to the delight of the crowd.
A young Marcus Miller stole the show, I can't remember if it was Scofield or Stern on guitar.

[kris]

I'm just stating a personal opinion via replying to the thread topic. I didn't consider it would provoke strong reactions. It's not as if it's the official MD fan club. I'm a jazz, blues rock guitarist. I started playing at the age of 4, 62 years ago.
Many kept on at me to listen to MD in my early days, so I did. I didn't like what I was hearing. I'm just being honest. I don't know what else to say. Maybe I should say nothing from now on & leave you lovely folk to it.. Have fun.

To tell the truth, it was the first time I met a musician who doesn't like playing MD.
'Strange is this world' as one of the brilliant vocalists sang.

[Cunamara]

I never once suggested MD was useless as a jazz influence!! What are you talking about!? So far it seems folk are putting words in my mouth I've never said!! MD has never appealed to me. That's it, sorry. This discussion has gone past my surreal threshold...It's getting a bit weird now for me

You said it in post #17. pamosmusic noted that Miles was a key innovator in jazz and you replied

To you he obviously was. To me he was not!

And note you selectively edited what I wrote which changed the meaning.

Ah, the fun of a lively Interwebs debate! Takes me back the rec.music.makers.guitar.jazz days.

[jazzloverfat]

Are we really doing this

[pingu]

Space ….
that not saying something
is also saying something

[supersoul]

Are we really doing this

Yes, not liking Miles Davis is a stoning offense.
It is a sacrilege.
Commence the throwing of HTML rocks.

Actually, I don't care if anyone doesn't like Miles. It's their loss!

[teeps]

Watch out for trolls

[jameslovestal]

Yes, not liking Miles Davis is a stoning offense.
It is a sacrilege.
Commence the throwing of HTML rocks.

So far from the truth and a discredit to the members of this forum.

What caused the fuss was the claim Miles didn't have a major influence on the direction of jazz. That is just utter nonsense.

Now if one had said they didn't like the direction Miles help take jazz (e.g. one is really into big-band jazz or New Orleans jazz, or 30s swing jazz), I can understand that. But his influence is part of jazz history. Period.

[supersoul]

So far from the truth and a discredit to the members of this forum.

What caused the fuss was the claim Miles didn't have a major influence on the direction of jazz. That is just utter nonsense.

Now if one had said they didn't like the direction Miles help take jazz (e.g. one is really into big-band jazz or New Orleans jazz, or 30s swing jazz), I can understand that. But his influence is part of jazz history. Period.

It was a joke and a response to a post about a stoning scene from a Monty Python movie.

[nyc chaz]

I saw Miles in the early 80's.He played almost the entire show with his back to the audience.What i learned is not to waste my money going to see him again.

[wolflen]

It was a joke and a response to a post about a stoning scene from a Monty Python movie.

Ever notice..sometime explaining a "joke" makes it "less funny"..

[pamosmusic]

Ever notice..sometime explaining a "joke" makes it "less funny"..

ever notice how someone over-reacting to a joke on the internet kind of makes it more funny?

[kris]

I saw Miles in the early 80's.He played almost the entire show with his back to the audience.What i learned is not to waste my money going to see him again.

Watching Miles' back is a big deal.
I'm more interested in the music than the backs of the artists.

[lammie200]

Only caught him once in '83 as part of the day long Kool Jazz Festival, I guess cigarette companies don't sponsor jazz fests anymore. It was in support of his Star People lp and of course he played Michael Jackson's Human Nature.
He came out in a pink jump suit, big pink sunglasses w a pink trumpet.
A security guard had his back to the stage and Miles appeared from the back and walked straight to the security guard, put the bell of his horn right over the top of the guards head and blew one of those loud bleats he was known for, scared the crap outta him much to the delight of the crowd.
A young Marcus Miller stole the show, I can't remember if it was Scofield or Stern on guitar.

I saw him once around that time. It was on a pier in Manhattan where they built that Little Island. I think it was Scofield on guitar, but honestly I don't remember.

[nyc chaz]

Watching Miles' back is a big deal.
I'm more interested in the music than the backs of the artists.

I actually enjoy a show where the artist can have some respect for the audience.And oh by the way,his playing sucked that night.I remember a newspaper review saying all he did was incessant noodling which was pretty accurate.I could deal with the off night but the whole i'm too good for you people that payed money to see me was just a turnoff.