Two Sides of One Coin: “So What” Grant Green/Wes Montgomery

[pamosmusic]

Firstly, the opening piano chord is C-Eb in the left hand and A-D-F in the right hand directly above that. I suggest anyone who has a piano/keyboard handy to try it out. So, a C-6/9 with no 5th and an added 11th (!). As a few people have pointed out, that's x6776x but with a C in the bass. I hear it as a F13 and there's a reason for this that I'll get to in a moment.
Attachment 116614

Well I’ll be goddam if I didn’t have that voicing right after all.

Barry Harris (who was no fan of modal music or its terminology) would think of this melodic figure as 'V minor'. In modal terms, it's based around an upper structure of F7 from the 5th degree - (F), (A), C, Eb, G. Similarly, the line played by Paul Chambers in the intro to the original version by Miles Davis suggests an Am figure resolving into Dm. His line opens with a 5th from the tonic (D-A) rather than the 4th employed by Grant Green (G-C or E-A when transposed) but the outlining of strong beats of the V resolving to I remains.

Seems reasonable

[pamosmusic]

I vote PMB the winner.

[PMB]

I vote PMB the winner.

Cool, do I get a new guitar?

[pamosmusic]

Cool, do I get a new guitar?

No you just get that slightly sick feeling that comes with knowing you cared enough to actual comment on this dumpster fire.

[mr. beaumont]

If you listen to Tucker's bassline, he implies i ii V quite a bit...Cm, Dm7b5, G7.

It's the head being played up a 4th that's screwing with people's ears, and that m6/9 chord without the expected movement.

[pauln]

beato has that one covered. sheer comedy. he probably swears to this day that the first chord of ipanema is Ab6. take that, barry harris.

Why is he playing it in Db?
I like F with vanilla chords.
Nine of them, not just five.

x 8 10 9 8 x FM9
x 8 9 9 8 x G6/F
x 8 8 7 6 x Bb/F
x 7 8 6 x x Edim
x 5 5 5 x x F6sus2
x 6 6 6 x x F#6sus2

x 9 8 6 6 x F#M7
7 x 7 8 9 x B13
x 12 11 9 9 x AM7
10 x 10 11 12 x D13
x 13 12 10 10 x BbM7
11 x 11 12 13 x Eb13

x 12 12 12 13 x Aquartal
x 11 12 10 12 x Abdim
x 10 10 10 11 x Gquartal
x 7 8 9 9 x Caug7

[pamosmusic]

OP played Ipanema in Db.

Astrud sang it in Db.

[Christian Miller]

Well as someone who rejects the concept of roots as Germanic theoretical chicanery of the highest order I'm OK with Ab6/9.

Checkmate, Rameau-ite. Rare Beato W!

;-)

TBF, would Db6/9/Ab have been any clearer for a guitarist wanting to learn the song (as opposed to soloing on the changes.)

I dunno. Naming that first chord which is inverted on the original recording is a tricky one. What's the emphasis of the lesson?

Also playing on Ab over the Db is probably what I'd do as a soloist. Brings out the melody notes.

[bediles]

Awesome. Guess I missed the Eb and A. Didn't quite have this sound categorized in my mind's ear. Makes more sense this way. Cheers.

[AllanAllen]

Why is he playing it in Db?

Superiority complex, this way you can learn the song, then put people down for using the realbook instead of their ear and also not be able to play it in F at the session. It's a win win win. The last win is for the other people, who don't have to deal with the big headed newcomer.

[pamosmusic]

Superiority complex, this way you can learn the song, then put people down for using the realbook instead of their ear and also not be able to play it in F at the session. It's a win win win. The last win is for the other people, who don't have to deal with the big headed newcomer.

Maybe I should teach people The Real Way to play the intro to Back in Black, but in like … Ab or something?

Meaning he's doing this for people who will listen to recording and never open a fake book or play the tune with other jazz musicians as long as they live. So it'd be weird to do it in a key other than the recording they'll get with their first google search.

[mr. beaumont]

Ipanema is a singer's tune y'all, you gotta be ready to play that shit in F# or D and a half or just shy of B or whatever the singer wants.

[pamosmusic]

Also (and again) this version is in Db:

I’d play it standing on my head if it meant I got to play along with this groove.

Unreal, Ed Thingpen and Ray Brown on this tune.

[mr. beaumont]

I mean...it sounds REALLY GOOD in Db.

[AndyV]

I responded to GG more than I usually do, but for me Wes' musicality is unsurpassed. Would like to hear him stretch out to include his usual octaves and block chord solos.

[wintermoon]