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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
John
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01-21-2021 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Lobomov
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Originally Posted by kris
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Finally got a chance to do this late last night, everyone was asleep (!) so had to record direct with my solid-body (Ibanez Artist) to keep it quiet. Backing is BIAB.
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Excellent playing and guitar sound, grahambop!
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Originally Posted by TOMMO
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Originally Posted by grahambop
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Thanks, I really do like these ‘jazz original’ type tunes.
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Originally Posted by grahambop
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We need lure Dutchbopper into this thread before we close it out.
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Originally Posted by grahambop
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Graham -
Useless, completely useless :-)
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And Christian!
I'll have week 2 up tonight. Brevity is where it's at...no planning, we are gonna get these tunes OUT THERE.
Got a midtempo tune with great changes in mind this week...nice short form too. Very accessible, but not a cliche chord progression.
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Originally Posted by grahambop
Played by real jazzman.
Jazzingly
Kris
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And.... a very nice BB background.
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Originally Posted by kris
Re. the guitar I just play it exactly the same way as my 175, i.e. same kind of attack and angle with the pick, and picking near the neck. It does make me think that a lot of tone is in the fingers and the pick technique. (I also have .012 flats on it, same as on my 175).
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Had to make one more run at this, trying for a different feel. I kept trying to think "Jim Hall, Jim Hall, Jim Hall" but by the time it's done, we are who we are I guess! This has been fun and I'm now ready to hit the next tune.
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Originally Posted by lawson-stone
Jim just so happens to have done a great version of this, with Art Farmer--have you heard it?
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Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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have you heard it?
Farmer/Hall on You Tube, Lawson.
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Okay, listened... Jim Hall is just so fresh and unpredictable. That's an amazing solo. I also realize I haven't got the best phrasing on a few passages in the melody. No more clips, but I need to tune up that melody phrasing.
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Great record that, one of the first jazz LPs I bought. Got it about 1980 when it had just been released. I remember listening closely to all the solos, (not just Jim Hall’s), trying to figure out what they were doing!
It’s quite likely that the way I hear the melody of Whisper Not comes from listening to that record a lot back in the day.
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Originally Posted by grahambop
John
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Thanks John!
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Originally Posted by christianm77
Could you explain what you mean by" m3 relationship"?
For me,Cm is the substitution for Em7b5 and Ebm is an upper structure on D7(b9,3,b13),what is called polytonality by superposed triads
All the best
Emil
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I’m guessing what Christian means is for example that you can play a Cm6 chord then just move the same shape up 3 frets and repeat it. This sounds great over Am7b5 going to D7, I use it a lot.
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Originally Posted by emilP
If so, yeah, exactly that; you take the same motif on II and move it up a m3 on V. Classic bop trick. Works in major and minor. Musicians did that for years before they knew what a 'upper structure triad' was. It just sounds right. (And in fact the major version doesn't fit so well into that rationale.)
You also see this move a lot in standards BTW - II-7 to IV-6. So now you know its a II-V in disguise :-) (Or maybe the other way around?)
Nerd's corner: It's not really polytonality. Polytonality is more like playing in C and F# major at the same time; two independent key centres as heard in works by Poulenc etc. Vertically very dissonant, but from the perspective of the listener, may be possible to discern the superimposed keys.
From the POV of CST there's a clear relationship between Ebm and D7, as you say, they form part of the same overall sound (although I actually do think I hear US triads independently, but that's a whole thing.)
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Originally Posted by hohoho
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Yea...the piano is a little to loud.Guitar is a very nice!
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Originally Posted by Ronstuff
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Beautiful lyrical lines, kris!
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Originally Posted by TOMMO
I put my post to Jam Round 2.
Best
Kris
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It’s gonna take me at least another week. It would be my first improv on something that’s not blues, I’m still not hearing all the chords and even not know them all without thinking real hard. Was planning to get to know things today, l could work of what chords I know from Birk’s Works, but cat disappeared 6.45am and just returned at 11pm. Real joy to hear and read all the posts, I’m getting heaps out of this already!
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Originally Posted by Eck
Bars 1-2 are basically the same thing as bars 3-4 except one starts with Cm and the other with Gm. Bar 5 is similar to bar 1 and then it's a i V into Dm followed by that ascending sequence of minor chords.
So, you can play blues in Cm, followed by blues in Gm. Then, in bar 5, more blues, this time in Dm. Bars 7-8 can be played in different ways, but you can probably do okay with thinking of it as a ii V in Cm and if you play a clam, move it one fret in either direction.
The bridge is more blues, Gm, then Dm.
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Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
Apart from that I’m learning the scales better, as I only know the Dorian (played as the Ionian starting from bass string).
I’ve got experience composing and cannot stop myself from having to find those out-of-scale notes that make connections.
So the big challenge is convincing myself it’s ok to play just blues scales. And to know them. Like proper instead of ear-play and a few bigger intervals.
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Honestly Eck, I think you're overthinking it.
I say try it out and post and if anybody says something mean, I'll have them crying for their momma in one post.
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Originally Posted by Eck
Then, think of bars 2 and 3 as a ii V im in Gm. A blues lick in Gm will work.
Bar 4: first two beats are notated as Em7b5, which has exactly the same notes as Gm6. So, if you keep playing Gm licks, it will work.
Bar 4: You can also look at all of bar 4 as a ii V going into the Dm in bar 5. Bm7b5 is the same as Dm6, and those D blues licks will work.
And, you could continue playing D blues licks for bars 5-8.
I'm not suggesting it's great music, although it could be in the hands of a melodic player.
Bear in mind, that this is not my ultimate recommendation for how to play this tune. Rather, it's a path that is worthy, particularly for the intermediate player.
My idea of the goal is to be able to forget about the chords/scales/arps etc, hear/feel the chords in your mind and scat-sing/play a solo to that without thinking linguistically.
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Thanks Mr Beaumont and RPJAZZGUITAR! I’m getting there. Conversion between learning to keep it simple and knowing the scales. Between not getting ambitious and starting to grab an opportunity for a little arpeggio. And between getting less pain in my arms and pushing through. This is a real blessing for my learning.
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Cannonball Adderley play along - Sack of Woe
Yesterday, 10:59 PM in Improvisation