1976 Gibson Johnny Smith

**wintermoon** · 12-01-2016, 04:31 PM

gold frets may look odd on a guitar, but if they were gold from the time frets were invented no one would like silver.
sometime you get used to things being a certain way and change seems wrong.

**Max405** · 12-01-2016, 05:20 PM

Originally Posted by Stringswinger

Dunlop frets are nickle and will wear out. Go with stainless medium jumbos...

SS, Mark Simon told me that's the only frets he does because the Stainless have memory and the tend to pop out. He doesn't work with anything else other than Dunlop.
He only needed my guitar for 4 weeks.
Buzz @ Lark St. told me I needed to drop off and wait 6 weeks! Last month it was 3-4 weeks..

Back to the drawing board..

Vin. Now I see why you only buy new! This is precisely the reason I always used Ronaldo and Brian. They never put me through this crap! Brian would call me and tell me to drop off the guitar tomorrow and come back and pick it up 2 days later.. Ronaldo would do the same thing. But when he got older, 2 days later turned into 7 months later.. And this guitar is too nice to trust Brian with it. Damn..

JD

**vinnyv1k** · 12-01-2016, 05:41 PM

Bro go with the best luthier and deal with the long wait. I don't like Dunlop or Stew Mac frets either. Yes cheap and easy to install but too soft. They have a high nickel content. Every time you go with the quick guy you are dead sorry you did.

Your 175 will see you through the wait time. Go to Steve's guy and be happy you did.

**Max405** · 12-01-2016, 06:07 PM

Thanks Bro.
To me, there is something fundamentally wrong with leaving one of my babies in some shlub's shop for 6 weeks, for a job that will take a couple of days.
Buzz told me the reason for the wait is, sometimes they don't want to do frets, so they do finish repairs. And then, they do electronic repairs.. Then one day they get the urge to frets..
If I ran my business like that, I'd be living next to a dumpster, eating garbage for the rest of my life.
Its just aggravating..

**Stringswinger** · 12-01-2016, 06:14 PM

JD, when luthiers tell you negative things about stainless frets, this is what they are really saying: "Stainless frets are hard to work with and tough on my tools. Can I tell you some BS and get you to choose something that will make it easier for me?"

**JazzNote** · 12-01-2016, 06:36 PM

Originally Posted by Max405

To me, there is something fundamentally wrong with leaving one of my babies in some shlub's shop for 6 weeks, for a job that will take a couple of days.
Buzz told me the reason for the wait is, sometimes they don't want to do frets, so they do finish repairs. And then, they do electronic repairs.. Then one day they get the urge to frets..
If I ran my business like that, I'd be living next to a dumpster, eating garbage for the rest of my life.
Its just aggravating..

Same here. The guy i bring my guitars to usually can tell me beforehand when about he would have time for the job. So i call him a couple of days before the indicated time frame and make the appointment to bring it in. Usually i get it back within a couple of days. Probably he couldn't do it this way with everybody though .....

**Matt Cushman** · 12-01-2016, 06:44 PM

A fretwire with 18% nickel / silver is silver in color and is only slightly softer than the gold fretwire. SS fretwire has a hardness of HV5/ 300 , Jescar gold has a hardness of HV5/ 250 and the 18% nickel has a hardness of HV5/ 200. The 18 % nickel / silver wears very well. I have a guitar I fretted with the 18% wire 16 years ago and they show little to no wear after all these years.

**vinnyv1k** · 12-01-2016, 07:45 PM

Believe me a luthier has no problem doing Strat fret jobs. A JS is high stress for them too.
Hey send it to Matt Cushman. His fret job is the best I have seen.

**QAman** · 12-01-2016, 11:14 PM

Max405,
Another more expensive option instead of Ian at Lark Street is Norio Imai in NYC . He is known to be superb - and used by many collectors and very particular customers with high end guitars .

He did two guitars for me. Laser straight , perfect intonation, polished to perfection , feeler action - ...,,but it's $800.

**Dennis D** · 12-01-2016, 11:21 PM

Originally Posted by QAman

Max405,
Another more expensive option instead of Ian at Lark Street is Norio Imai in NYC . He is known to be superb - and used by many collectors and very particular customers with high end guitars .

He did two guitars for me. Laser straight , perfect intonation, polished to perfection , feeler action - ...,,but it's $800.

Does he do the binding over the fret ends, or recommend it, or ?? Even if were only done on the treble side, I think it'd end the seasonal wood drying /shrinkage - right,wrong ??

Thx.

**QAman** · 12-01-2016, 11:32 PM

Not sure Dennis- it's worth giving him a call. My friend , vintage guitar dealer Larry Wexer uses Norio exclusively for all fret work.

**lawson-stone** · 12-02-2016, 10:23 AM

That's an interesting question. One thing I love about nice Gibsons is the binding over the ends of the frets. Would most fret jobs basically eliminate that feature of the guitar?

**plasticpigeon** · 12-02-2016, 10:54 AM

I bet it is possible, but I haven't seen replaced frets that keep the binding nibs. The real trouble is that the fret would have to be cut exactly to size, and would have to get pushed into the slot in exactly the right place for it not to damage the binding. Also if the fingerboard shrunk at all it would mean the frets would damage the binding. I think I read an article about a fret job where nibs were glued back on!

**Greentone** · 12-02-2016, 11:25 AM

I will echo Vinny1k's string assessment. I have used TI Swing flats for many years now. However, on my Unity I use TI GBs. The Unity is a very JS-like, Citation-like guitar (built by the guy who built the Citations at Gibson).

On the Unity I think the GBs sound best. The treble strings sound a bit more pianistic. This could be simply because they are a wee bit thinner than on the Swing set--for the same bass string gauge. Whatever, the GBs are pretty magic.

**wintermoon** · 12-02-2016, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by QAman

Max405,
Another more expensive option instead of Ian at Lark Street is Norio Imai in NYC . He is known to be superb - and used by many collectors and very particular customers with high end guitars .

He did two guitars for me. Laser straight , perfect intonation, polished to perfection , feeler action - ...,,but it's $800.

$800 for one guitar??

**vinnyv1k** · 12-02-2016, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by wintermoon

$800 for one guitar??

That is what Frank Ford charges for a SS fret job on a archtop with a new nut. You want the best of the best that is the price. You want it perfect with no binding cracks that is worth it in my book.

Joe, the nibs have to go.

**Greentone** · 12-02-2016, 12:43 PM

If you study this picture carefully you will discover that Johnny Smith had this guitar refretted with the nibs sawed off. Goes with the territory when you play a guitar a lot.
1976 Gibson Johnny Smith-smith_03_side-jpg

1976 Gibson Johnny Smith-smith_03_side-jpg

**vinnyv1k** · 12-02-2016, 12:50 PM

I love those marble pickguards.

**Hammertone** · 12-02-2016, 01:13 PM

Originally Posted by vinnyv1k

That is what Frank Ford charges for a SS fret job on a archtop with a new nut. You want the best of the best that is the price. You want it perfect with no binding cracks that is worth it in my book.

Sorry, but this is simply not true. Frank Ford charges what he charges because the market will bear it. His refrets are no better than those of many other skilled guitar techs who charge far less than he does but who are simply less well known.

**Stringswinger** · 12-02-2016, 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

Sorry, but this is simply not true. Frank Ford charges what he charges because the market will bear it. His refrets are no better than those of many other skilled guitar techs who charge far less than he does but who are simply less well known.

Palo Alto real estate values must be factored into the equation as well.

**wintermoon** · 12-02-2016, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by vinnyv1k

That is what Frank Ford charges for a SS fret job on a archtop with a new nut. You want the best of the best that is the price. You want it perfect with no binding cracks that is worth it in my book.

Joe, the nibs have to go.

vinny, I know several guys that can do it for about 1/2 that. perfect w/no binding cracks, etc....
I'm sure NY prices are higher, but that's a bit much imo.

**vinnyv1k** · 12-02-2016, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

Sorry, but this is simply not true. Frank Ford charges what he charges because the market will bear it. His refrets are no better than those of many other skilled guitar techs who charge far less than he does but who are simply less well known.

He charges $400 for Dunlops with a new bone nut.

**Hammertone** · 12-02-2016, 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by vinnyv1k

He charges $400 for Dunlops with a new bone nut.

Fair enough. These typically run @$300-$400 in my experience.
I have seen an upcharge for installing SS of up to $100.

**vinnyv1k** · 12-02-2016, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by Hammertone

Sorry, but this is simply not true. Frank Ford charges what he charges because the market will bear it. His refrets are no better than those of many other skilled guitar techs who charge far less than he does but who are simply less well known.

How many fret jobs has Frank done for you Hammertone ? He has done at least 8 or 9 for me. Always better than perfect and I always get my guitar back without a mark on it and never any lacquer chips around the new nut.
I don't mind paying top dollar for top quality. I have not had SS frets done yet but I may go that route next time.

Frank Ford has also done every fret job on Tuck Andress' guitars. Tuck goes through frets like I go through socks.
His L5's look pretty bad but play like a dream. Frank Ford is not just my luthier he is a friend.

$400 is market price for regular frets and that is what Frank charges. Go ask around and see how many guys will do a SS fret job on a high end archtop with a 12 degree radius and guarantee it to come out perfect with no guitar damage or issues.