Intervals

[gordonflash]

I have read this several times in the Jazz guitar chords theory - How to construct Chords section. What am I missing? Isn't C to E a minor third and E to G a minor third? Should it read C to E (3 half steps) and C to G (4 half steps)

[Mick-7]

C to Eb would be a minor 3rd, like E to G, both are 3 half steps or 1 & 1/2 whole steps. I think of scale tones in terms of the latter, i.e., divisions of whole steps. So C to G would be 3 & 1/2 whole steps, or 7 half steps.

It's a good idea to relate theory to the fretboard, e.g., each half step would be one fret higher or lower. So on the 5th string, C to E would be the 3rd fret to the 7th fret, which is 2 whole steps or 4 half steps.

[joe2758]

I have read this several times in the Jazz guitar chords theory - How to construct Chords section. What am I missing? Isn't C to E a minor third and E to G a minor third? Should it read C to E (3 half steps) and C to G (4 half steps)

Mick is right, just to put it another way:

C to E 4 half steps (or easier, 2 whole steps). C to D is a whole step, and D to E is a whole step...it's a major 3rd

E to G is a minor 3rd (note that it doesn't say C to G) a minor 3rd is one and a half steps.
E to F is a half step, F to G is a whole step.

So that is why the theory book is right

[ragman1]

Mick is too complicated. You too, Joe.

Think C major scale:

C to E:

C D E = 4 half-steps.

E to G:

E F G = 3 half-steps.

[joe2758]

Mick is too complicated. You too, Joe.
.

oh knock it off I said the same thing as you lol

[ragman1]

Not in terms of simplicity.

The base of C major is used because it has no b's or #'s. So the number of half-steps between any note and another can be counted easily.

Count half-steps between, say, F# and Bb.

F# G Ab A Bb = 4 half-steps.

F# G 1
G Ab 2
Ab A 3
A Bb 4

[Mick-7]

Mick is too complicated. You too, Joe.

It had better be at least that complicated as we said or you'll have trouble when you try to transpose your C major scale steps to another key.

[ragman1]

There is no other key for counting half-steps, that's the point. The chromatic scale could be used, and is technically correct, but it would make naming the notes difficult. Ascending is all sharps, descending is all flats. Using C major is simpler and clearer.

[pamosmusic]

It had better be at least that complicated as we said or you'll have trouble when you try to transpose your C major scale steps to another key.

Ive actually always done ragmans way.

The upside of counting half steps — it’s always the same answer

The downside of counting half steps — it’s more memorizing if you’re not familiar with a keyboard and it’s downright cumbersome for wider intervals.

The upside of relating it all to a scale — they understand the reason for the different names and there’s a system that’s consistent.

The downside of relating it all to a scale — figuring out C to E is easy, but figuring out E to G is a bear.

You also sometimes get folks thinking E and G are both from the C major scale, so they should both be major intervals. And counting half steps leaves less room for that confusion.

Im not really sure how I’d prefer to teach it if I had a student tomorrow learning it. At the end of the day it’s just memorization but the little tricks are useful.

I usually end up back at the scales … probably because it lends itself a bit more toward spelling chords

[Mick-7]

oh knock it off I said the same thing as you lol

ragman really is completely incorrigible, isn't he?

[Aiq]

The simplest is see the scale intervals.

E is 3. Minor third, Eb.

C, D, E, easy as 1, 2, 3. (hit it, Michael!)

[ragman1]

It had better be at least that complicated as we said or you'll have trouble when you try to transpose your C major scale steps to another key.

I have my own method for transposing, very quick, very easy. Say from Eb major to B major.

Write out the Eb notes:

Eb
F
G
Ab
Bb
C
D

Then line it up with B major:

Eb ------ B
F ------ C#
G ------ D#
Ab ------ E
Bb ------ F#
C ------ G#
D ------ A#

Then just read them off.