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Hey guys...
Just about to crash out and stumbled onto some voincings I liked for a turnaround. Figured I'd hop on and post it here so I'd be able to remember what it was in the morning... and in case anyone's into it...
Bb(add2)
6X10.766
G7#9
X10.9766
C-11(9)
86X766
F13b9
X6X775
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11-06-2016 04:06 AM
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Dang. I gotta get me one of them decimal fret guitars.
Originally Posted by jordanklemons
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Aw... they're not THAT bad, are they?
hahaha
Honestly though, I am thinking of maybe checking out some shorter scale guitars. Some of the sickest voicings I've found are straight up not possible for me, and I'd love to find a way to make them a reality in my playing. I just don't want something that sounds super dinky and lacks any sense of depth or low end.
Anyone have any experience with short scale guitars? Opinions, thoughts?
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It wasn't the voicings, it was the 10.7 and 10.9 in there. I didn't think you meant for the dot to be in there. Originally Posted by jordanklemons
Aw... they're not THAT bad, are they? hahaha?
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Oh oh oh... hahaha
Yeah I learned that trick here actually. That notation can get confusing when we're talking about the 10th fret and above. Someone showed me the idea of using the "." to separate frets when talking about double digit fret numbers.
01114111211
vs
0.11.14.11.12.11
But still... if anyone has thoughts on shorter scale guitars, I'm curious. I thought maybe "decimal fret" was a joke referring to guitars 1/10th the size of a normal guitar! hahaha
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Oh, gotcha. No, I was musing on the idea of fret 10.7. Microtonal, baby! I've never seen that notation before. It's all good. There's a place around here that's got a set of three guitars one full scale, one medium and one small (I'm guessing 3/4 and 1/2). Pretty cool. Frank Zappa used to use little tiny guitars occasionally. IIRC, he said the lower weight made it easier for him to sing. Originally Posted by jordanklemons
Oh oh oh... hahaha
Yeah I learned that trick here actually. That notation can get confusing when we're talking about the 10th fret and above. Someone showed me the idea of using the "." to separate frets when talking about double digit fret numbers.
01114111211
vs
0.11.14.11.12.11
But still... if anyone has thoughts on shorter scale guitars, I'm curious. I thought maybe "decimal fret" was a joke referring to guitars 1/10th the size of a normal guitar! hahaha
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Hey, that looks like my IP address Originally Posted by jordanklemons
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I was considering a Jaguar recently. I normally play a Tele. I tried out the Jag and didn't really like how it felt. It was ok but I didn't think that it really made anything easier. I lost about 3/8" off the tip of my left pinky over 40 years ago. I've got decent sized hands so it hasn't been a deal breaker and may actually help on the single note work which is hard to believe but when ever I see threads here about the difficulty of using the pinky I wonder why because mine works great although I do miss the reach for certain chords. But I've always been intrigued with short scales and played a Byrdland a while back and liked it, but again it didn't seem to make much of a difference.
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Interesting mrcee. I guess I wonder how short the scale has to be before it becomes noticeably easier to reach challenging (or impossible) voicings on the fretboard... and how crappy the tone would be.
I'm very much a 1-2 guitar kind of guy. When I find one I love, I stick with it like crazy. I don't like collecting or having lots to pick from. I want 1 or 2 that I can seriously get to know. Which means I don't text and experiment and get to know all the different variations available.
And I love both of mine. But I've been thinking about going ergonomic (out of physical necessity) and headless (out of desire to be able to travel easier with it). And with all the harmony stuff I've been practicing (plus the added benefit of even easier travel) I've been thinking of a shorter scale. I might need to just find a luthier that I can sit down and talk with to see what they think and what's possible.
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I've often wondered myself about how short you've got to go to notice a big difference. I liked the Byrdland though and maybe if I'd played it for a couple of days I would have started to notice a short scale advantage. Maybe the Jaguar would have grown on me as well. Everyone's seen the vid of Joe Pass playing a Jaguar. He didn't have very large hands. And it sounded great.
I'm down to 2 guitars myself at this point. I'm just too much on the move to be schlepping a bunch of stuff. A Tele Thinline and an early 60s Gibson LG1 flat top. The LG1 has got some serious mojo to it. I'll never get rid of it even if I don't play it much. Everybody including well known "Techs to the Stars" flip when they get their hands on it.
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Another thing to think about with short scales is how much are you really gaining in ease of play from fret to fret. I'm not going to do all the math but if there's a 1" difference from nut to saddle if you break that down per fret over 15, let's say, frets, or 16 to make the math more even, what's the advantage? A 1/16"? No, actually less because the over all difference of 1" would make it less than 1/16th on a half step because the 15th fret is about half the total scale length. And that 1/16" would decrease towards the higher frets as the fret span gets smaller. I would think. Maccaferri's were between 25 1/2 to almost 26 1/2 and Django did all right although the 2 fingers that he did have were pretty long. He did use what ever was left of the other 2 though so you might think the long scale would have been a disadvantage but apparently not. Or not enough for him to change guitars. I've heard that he used a Gibson (shorter scale than his Gypsy guitar I would think) when he was in the States and didn't really like it and went back to a Selmer or Macc or whatever (electrified). I'm surmising that he didn't play a Selmer with a short scale.
My math etc may be off so other opinions welcome.
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Yeah the gypsy guitars are longer. But tbh, I don't notice the difference much.
I thought the chords were nice
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My missus has one of those. Mojo city as you say. Originally Posted by mrcee
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I don't play the LG1 much these days and it's been in the case. I pulled it out recently and noticed that the top at the bridge was raising up about 1/4" or more. It may have been like that for a while and I just wasn't aware of it. I detuned it, which minimized it, and plan to get it fixed. Any opinions or suggestions as to potential further damage if I tune it up and play it? Or suggestions as to repair. btw the bridge is plastic which is what Gibson used after 1963 I believe. The bridge is not lifting from the top, just the top itself. Originally Posted by christianm77
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mcree, Originally Posted by mrcee
I have a 12" body 24 scale carved spruce top ebony wood travel guitar. Like the Benedetto Andy Deluxe. Joy to play. I also snagged a MT Maestro to gig with when I put a dent in it (hard to sell with blem like that) That has a 24 with a 15" body and 1 3/4 nut.
It scale is cool, the size is cool but it only weighs 6 lbs, which is the coolest point. It is like hefting a feather onto my lap when I play it.
I really notice the difference between 24 and 25 after playing these guitars. I never used to care so much.
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Doc Originally Posted by docdosco
They both sound like nice guitars. I'll have to spend some quality time with a short scale at some point. 15 minutes of play time doesn't really give you a good sense of an instrument. Especially in a music store. I wish I'd bought an Epi Elitist Byrdland when they were more available. I've enjoyed Byrdlands when I've had the chance to play them briefly.
ceeLast edited by mrcee; 11-07-2016 at 03:12 PM.
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mrcee,
I called you mcree, sorry. Funny how the mind reorders little things. Maybe my Scottish heritage saw a you as a highlander.
I usually play a 17" archtop, however, these smaller guitars have their charm. I guess I'll stick with the 15" for now...
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I've got Scottish on my grandma's side. MacAllister. From St. John, New Brunswick. Probably on some other sides to.
Small body guitars do have their charm. The flat tops to. The 00 and 000 Martins are great. I don't know if it's true or not but I've heard that small body acoustics aren't braced as heavy which gives them a nice tone and sustain in the upper and upper mid register. The trade off can be, on my LG1 anyway, that the bass can be lacking. Which could be one reason songwriters like them. They don't get in the way.
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My grandmother was a Ferguson from Beatty Saskatchewn, Welsh and Scottish on me mither's side. Originally Posted by mrcee
The 15" Martin Taylor Maestro has unusual bracing. The bracing is cut out of the spruce top. So there are no glued braces inside. Just speed bumps for braces. It has nice bass for a small guitar and the bracing, which required a larger slab of spruce to make the top and create carved braces, has a very sweet sound.
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That sounds nice. It's the first I've heard of that bracing system.
The LG1 is a nice guitar even though I believe it was considered a budget instrument. You do see pictures of Hank and Elvis with them though. It's ladder braced. I think it's a real sleeper guitar and for the money, $1000 minimum asking price I would guess in this market, it's one of the best values in a vintage flat top. Prior to my owning it, it had been high strung and was on an Emmylou Harris date. The LG2 is another step up and is X braced if I'm correct. I played a friend's early 50s LG2 which was maybe all thing's considered the nicest acoustic I've ever played, and I used to have a 1938 D18. I was immediately sold on small body Gibsons.
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I had an x braced Heritage 575 floater. I liked the sound. However being a Peerlless guy now, I am happy with the ones I have.
I'll have a peek at the LG1 online. I am stuck on an iPad for awhile so my surfing will be abreviated.
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You'll get mixed reviews on the LG1. Mine's good but I've played several that are dogs. I think it's best for bluesy single note lines up the neck. I've used a soundhole p.u. and played it electrified through a 4-12 Marshall cabinet. It sounds fantastic. Not so much for chords or the lower register. The tone has a lot of character and just sounds, well... real, although some people complain that they sound boxy. For me it's the perfect around the house guitar, for serenading a girl friend. It has an intimate romantic quality.
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Ahhh.... Well, each guitar is a world unto itself. Once we get a good one, it's wise not let it get away. I have regretted letting a half a dozen guitars go, 1952 fender broadcaster, 1955 Gretsch, 1974 les Paul, etc. as the song says, you don't know what you've got till it's gone.....
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There is absolutely no reason, in my opinion, for a small scale guitar to have "crappy tone". I have built close to a dozen, and I would say they all have as good a tone as any full sized or long scale guitar. I don't know about a plank electric. Perhaps you would need differently wound pickups. For an acoustic guitar it is all about knowing how to voice a guitar. A smaller acoustic guitar will have less volume (as in db output), but not necessarily poor tone. I think the impression exists because the major factories put out indifferently built low quality small guitars for "kids". Originally Posted by jordanklemons
It will feel different under your fingers. But the effect is easy to preview. If you play in standard tuning, down tune half a step and place a capo on the first fret. Voila a 24" scale (assuming you are starting with a 25.5" instrument).
Here is a picture of three I made and kept over the last dozen years. The one on the left is 24", middle back is 25.5" and the one on the right is 25". I play the carbon fiber one the most (25"), but ever so often I pick up the little one and am blown away at the soulful tone and ease of playability. The picture doesn't do it justice, they really look different next to each other.
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Hi Jordan, Originally Posted by jordanklemons
how do you finger the Bb(add2) ? Do you use your thumb to get the low Bb or is it a barre chord?
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