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What about classical guitars?
In electric guitars there are many possibilities to use the perfect tuning.
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03-06-2026 07:15 AM
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There's no such thing as perfect tuning on any guitar. Equal temperament is impossible, so the question should be, what is the best temperament for a guitar?
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I just tune everything to octaves (using harmonics) on my classical guitar, seems to iron out most of the tuning oddities.
Nylon strings can be a bit annoying sometimes, if the guitar is cold they can change pitch slightly as your hands warm them up by playing. Steel strings don’t seem to do that.
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My Frameworks guitar with nylons tunes very well.Thanks to the movable saddles, each string can be set separately.
Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
This guitar also has no bone nut.The guitar simply has a so-called zero fret.
In this configuration it tunes "perfectly" with nylon strings.
On the other hand, my two traditional classical guitars don"t tune as well as the Frameworks.
Making compensations in nuts and saddles a little bit improves tuning.
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I"ve heard that some Spanish luthier builds guitars that tune very well. Originally Posted by grahambop
These guitars are very expensive because they are simply perfectly made.
There is no compensation of nuts and saddles.
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Maybe there is no such thing as perfect tuning, but the guitar annoys me when it doesn"t tune.My electric guitars tune perfectly.
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My steel strings do. After break I’m sharp, then after the first song I’ll be back on pitch. If I tune after break I’ll be flat by the end of the first song. Originally Posted by grahambop
I try to go up and play with the volume off while the guys get ready. Then I’m not tuning and retuning. But things rarely go to plan, they usually go in a more interesting direction.Last edited by AllanAllen; 03-06-2026 at 12:14 PM.
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I remember seeing John Williams (the guitarist, not the Star Wars guy) perform when I was a teenager. He fine tuned his guitar to every piece he played to compensate for the instrument's idiosyncrasies.
I remember thinking "well, if HIS guitar isn't perfect, then I can't expect any to be."
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Oh, come on guys, some of the greatest music ever performed or recorded has been out of tune. Embrace the demons!
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Maybe you can give specific examples... I"ve been interested in classical guitar for over 55 years and somehow it didn"t bother me. Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
Oh, come on guys, some of the greatest music ever performed or recorded has been out of tune. Embrace the demons!
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He was probably using a new set of strings....Perhaps these strings have not yet adapted to the guitar...nylon strings. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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It was a long time ago, but it seemed more like he was "sweetening" or "tempering" the tuning to suit the piece... Originally Posted by kris
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If it annoys you then have it checked by a qualified technician / luthier (Turkowiak ?) but before doing that : how old are the strings ? Originally Posted by kris
Maybe there is no such thing as perfect tuning, but the guitar annoys me when it doesn"t tune.My electric guitars tune perfectly.
Here is an in-depth discussion and analysis of the problem :
Classic Guitar Intonation | ProGuitar
And here is my solution to the problem :
A New Berlin Luthier Featured at GSI: Introducing Angela Waltner
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The new strobe tuners by Peterson offer "sweeteners" : the tempering for various types of strings and guitars is automatically applied in these digital machines, works really well and FAST . I have the software version on my iPad and iPhone PLUS a clip-on tuner. Don't leave home without it (to quote Karl Malden....) Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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I know that. Originally Posted by gitman
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We're not talking about just tuning the open strings perfectly and then getting a perfect octave at the 12th fret, are we?
As someone said, there is no perfect tuning on a guitar, or on any other instrument with frets, and the only tuning systems (temperaments) that can work on such instruments are by definition not perfect tuning.
Yeah, maybe that on an electric you can get close enough perfect agreement with equal temperament that we cannot hear the errors, thanks to adjustable saddles, an extremely low action height and external amplification (and then there's always AutoTune, right?).
On a classical, your best bet is a good instrument with quality strings where the combination of compensation at the saddle and stretch in the strings keep the error within human detection margins despite the high action.
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Precise guitar frets and the right height of these frets.
They also influence the tuning of the instrument.
Perhaps the technique of theplaying also has an impact on the tuning.
Lately I"ve been experimenting with the nut.
Last edited by kris; 03-08-2026 at 01:02 AM.
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At 4:32 he states,
"... I'm going to play a harmonic on the fifth fret of the E string and then on the seventh fret of the A string that should be the exact same note..."
Technically, they are the same note where notes are defined by their location in the staff; however, within the context of tuning they are not the same pitch, not even in theory.
Fifth fret harmonics are perfect fifths of their string's open pitch; perfect fifths are equal temperament. Seventh fret harmonics are Pythagorean; not equal temperament. One must never use seventh fret harmonics for equal temperament tuning; one will be cycling through the strings correcting forever.
Assuming that intonation is correct (open string lengths adjusted for the scale length), here're thoughts about how to tune.
(With or without a tuner)
When - only tune the guitar when strings are warm
The ideal time to tune is immediately when one finishes playing the guitar, and this should be an indelible habit. The reason is that the guitar is most in the condition it would be when you want it to be in tune - while it is being played; which means the strings are warm (and to some degree other parts).
If you do this, the next time you start playing your strings will start off cool and a little sharp. Most tune it up to correct that and proceed to play it into the warm condition which flattens the strings out of tune. Then they correct that and all is well.
Don't do that. Play the guitar without re-tuning and as it warms up the little sharpness will move down into tune as the strings warm up.
This will avoid long term effects of excessive tuner cranking and motion of strings across the saddles, through the nut, shifting their break angles, and wrap deflections at the tuning posts.
How - here are three methods
For most, this was their first way, still a very good way, easy, excellent for low positions that employ open strings
E string 5th fret = open A
A string 5th fret = open D
D string 5th fret = open G
G string 4th fret = open B
B string 5th fret = open E
As one plays further up the neck the proportion of the strings' width to sounding string length between the fret and the bridge increases, and most so for the fatter strings. This causes deviations in pitch because the pitch math used to set the fret locations for scale length assume the strings are indefinitely thin. It may become useful to accommodate for that by tuning like below; popular with some jazz and other styles where one may desire to hold a higher playing position that will include sounding the fatter strings.
Kind of elegant, not a high speed method because all four tests should be heard before touching the tuners. then proceed low to high... takes a little longer but a really good method.
E string 10th fret = open D
A string 10th fret = open G
D string 9th fret = open B
G string 9th fret = open E
For those that play all over the neck including the dusty frets well above the 12th fret, many come to naturally restrict a part of the finger board. This is an avoidance of choosing fatter strings as one plays further up the neck for reasons of either tone quality or pitch accuracy. It looks like imagining a diagonal line from about the 7th fret low E string to about the highest fret they play on the high E string, and treating it as a boundary separating the nice tone region from the poor tone region, and seeking to stay in the nice tone region.
A similar boundary may apply to separate the finger board into the region where pitch is good and where pitch anomalies arise on the fatter strings played high up the neck. Many guitars express these tone and pitch issues and many players will naturally accommodate their positioning and fingering with respect to an "avoid region".
However, for those that wish to play into these regions there is a tuning method that serves to help for the pitch problem. Like any tuning method it is a compound compromise, in this case one that distributes the compromise of pitch deviation for extending playability into the "avoid region".
This is also a very fast method of both verifying and adjusting tuning (a few seconds) by ear (even on a noisy stage, background music, etc.). This is because all strings tune to the 1st string open E, easy to hear (and on stage you always know the tuning state of your high E string, right?).
B string 5th fret = open high E
G string 9th fret = open high E
D string 14th fret = open high E
A string 19th fret = open high E
low E string 5th harmonic = open high E
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Fifth fret harmonics are two octaves above the open pitch, not fifths.
I often use the fifth fret harmonic on my low E string to tune the top E string against.
I agree that 7th fret harmonics are bad for tuning to, since they are not equal temperament, as you say.
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This page includes a useful procedure for tuning the classical guitar (in fact it should work for any guitar):
Tuning – the Guild of American Luthiers Data Sheet #45 – DrKevGuitar.com
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Yes you're right, inclusion in equal temperament
as well. And still beware that 7th fret harmonic.
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Get one of these
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Once I get my guitar's intonation correct between 3rd and 14th frets.
I tune the notes across the fifth fret and then the 12th fret.
Yes, the tuning is never going to be perfect.
I never use open strings for tuning, so they are different than the fretted notes. And rarely, if ever, used for Jazz.
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You'd be surprised. Originally Posted by GuyBoden
O
I never use open strings for tuning, so they are different than the fretted notes. And rarely, if ever, used for Jazz.
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I also use open strings to play jazz.Especially when playing interesting-sounding chords. Originally Posted by GuyBoden
Once I get my guitar's intonation correct between 3rd and 14th frets.
I tune the notes across the fifth fret and then the 12th fret.
Yes, the tuning is never going to be perfect.
I never use open strings for tuning, so they are different than the fretted notes. And rarely, if ever, used for Jazz.
If these open strings don"t tune in chords, I try to change it.
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