Solo Guitar Tune #3 - Tenderly

**Gramps** · 03-22-2018, 01:06 PM

Music doesn't need tempo and time (a box like tennis?) to be music but I think most people look for that as a reference.

We both agree though, smiling is good for the soul and we'll both take a pass on the liver.

**joe2758** · 03-22-2018, 01:22 PM

we were talking about practicing with a time keeper. good time doesn’t detract from solo guitar. I mean should we at least know when we are switching time signatures?

none of my business i guess

take care

**Gramps** · 03-22-2018, 01:39 PM

Joe2758,

Something tells me that you have come to the realization that the only thing harder than playing to a metronome is playing with someone who can't.

Dan,

Just something to think about.

And please don't let my comments discourage you.

**jazzdan** · 03-22-2018, 01:40 PM

Every Saturday night I go dancing the Texas Two Step and the Cowboy Waltz and the Cowboy Cha Cha, That music needs to be in tempo I agree but a slow ballad like Tenderly, to me, would be more open to interpretation.

**TLerch** · 03-22-2018, 01:43 PM

Hey guys,
I haven't spent much time with this tune but have really enjoyed exploring it. Here is my rendition. It was very late last night so it has a kind of quiet vibe so as not to wake the sleepers. enjoy

all the best
Tim

**alltunes** · 03-22-2018, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by PaulW10

I'm an independent accountant by trade and this is my absolutely craziest busy time of the year.

Ha me too...I'm still tweaking DoWaR on my downtime

**jazzdan** · 03-22-2018, 01:47 PM

I didn't say that good timing detracts from playing solo guitar....I said that playing with a backing track does in my opinion. I love the guitar as a solo instrument but I also appreciate it in a band

**PaulW10** · 03-22-2018, 02:00 PM

Hi All,

Took a break from accounting this morning to record my version. Since the train left the station without me I figured I'd better jump on board!! Sort of all over the place, but I really like playing this song for some reason

**PaulW10** · 03-22-2018, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by alltunes

Ha me too...I'm still tweaking DoWaR on my downtime

Isn't this a wonderful time of year alltunes? I never complain (hardly), but I do whine a lot

**joe2758** · 03-22-2018, 02:14 PM

Tim, beautiful as always.

Paul, loved it! more of a jazz feel than i remember from your last one. The days of whine and taxes will be over soon

**kris** · 03-22-2018, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by TLerch

Hey guys,
I haven't spent much time with this tune but have really enjoyed exploring it. Here is my rendition. It was very late last night so it has a kind of quiet vibe so as not to wake the sleepers. enjoy

all the best
Tim

Tim,
This is a beautifull take.2 minutes with great music.
Best
Kris

**Gramps** · 03-22-2018, 02:44 PM

Paul and Tim,

Both beautiful arrangements. Just a treat to listen to.

You guys are using different keys. Every time I go to steal......I mean figure out something interesting I heard I have to stop and change gears.

**grahambop** · 03-22-2018, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by TLerch

Hey guys,
I haven't spent much time with this tune but have really enjoyed exploring it. Here is my rendition. It was very late last night so it has a kind of quiet vibe so as not to wake the sleepers. enjoy

all the best
Tim

Wonderful version as usual! I was gratified to see that Tim used the same chord voicing as I did for the second one in the melody. (I stole it off a Kenny Burrell record years ago!). Very cool chord, it goes like this for Ab7: x.9.10.10.11.10

**TLerch** · 03-22-2018, 03:58 PM

Grahambop
Yep, thats a nice voicing for a Dom7#11 when the #11 is the melody note. It also functions in a bunch of other ways as well.

tim

**ragman1** · 03-22-2018, 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by joe2758

thanks rags, from my point of view the Ab7 comes from the biii diminished chord and anything in that family is fair game. but that gets into a whole thing haha

I'm still learning. You can enlarge on that if you want. I see biii dim is Ab7b9. What do you mean by 'the family'? How do you get F713b9 from that? Because it works, no question.

sorry to ask, I don't usually

**joe2758** · 03-22-2018, 05:48 PM

Originally Posted by ragman1

I'm still learning. You can enlarge on that if you want. I see biii dim is Ab7b9. What do you mean by 'the family'? How do you get F713b9 from that? Because it works, no question.

sorry to ask, I don't usually

Happy to!

The biii dim is Gb dim. by lowering one chord tone at a time you get a family of 4 dominants:

Ab7, B7, D7, and F7

I started with the biii dim, added the melody note on top (that becomes the "13" of my F chord), and added a bass note which could have been Gb, Ab, B, D, or F

I chose F because that's the direction my bass line was going. then Fb913 is what I came up with as an analysis after the fact.

When I played the sub I was thinking "biii dim"

**ragman1** · 03-22-2018, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by joe2758

Happy to!
by lowering one chord tone at a time you get a family of 4 dominants:

Ab7, B7, D7, and F7

I'd got that bit.

I started with the biii dim, added the melody note on top (that becomes the "13" of my F chord), and added a bass note which could have been Gb, Ab, B, D, or F

I chose F because that's the direction my bass line was going. then Fb913 is what I came up with as an analysis after the fact.

Okay. Analysis after the fact... think I'll use that in court someday, got to be useful :0)))

When I played the sub I was thinking "biii dim"

That's where I got lost. When I see the Ab7 I just see a IV7, that's all. Sort of bluesy idea. I don't know where the diminished comes in.

Oh god, it's not the ubiquitous Mr. Harris, is it?

**joe2758** · 03-22-2018, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by ragman1

I'd got that bit.

Okay. Analysis after the fact... think I'll use that in court someday, got to be useful :0)))

That's where I got lost. When I see the Ab7 I just see a IV7, that's all. Sort of bluesy idea. I don't know where the diminished comes in.

Oh god, it's not the ubiquitous Mr. Harris, is it?

lol that's DOCTOR Harris to you! It is indeed. It takes some practice, but seeing every dominant as stemming from one of 3 dimished chords, each of which represents a whole family of dominants has been so freeing to me.

If we're in C (easier for me to think). Stipulation is that we are NOT modulating, and we're using good voiceleading.

ii dim ( family is Db7, E7, G7, Bb7), You can interchange these. You'll almost always see them pulling to a tonic function chord (I, iii, vi)

bii dim (family is C7, Eb7, A7, Gb 7) you'll almost always see them pulling to a sub dom function (ii or IV)

biii dim (family is D7, B7, F7, Ab7) my favorite because they can all pull to the tonic, sub dom, or dom.

3 families of 4...all 12 possible dominant chords have a function in every key

**PaulW10** · 03-22-2018, 06:56 PM

Originally Posted by jazzdan

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Sounds really nice Dan. I like the open airy chords you're playing and how they sound on your nylon guitar. Nylon guitars are great for this kind of playing!

**PaulW10** · 03-22-2018, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by joe2758

Tim, beautiful as always.

Paul, loved it! more of a jazz feel than i remember from your last one. The days of whine and taxes will be over soon

Thanks Joe. All you jazzers around here may be starting to wear off on me! And I'll never use the real name for DOWAR again. Yours is much better!

**PaulW10** · 03-22-2018, 07:23 PM

Originally Posted by Gramps

Paul and Tim,

Both beautiful arrangements. Just a treat to listen to.

You guys are using different keys. Every time I go to steal......I mean figure out something interesting I heard I have to stop and change gears.

Gramps, if you're talking about PaulD's arrangement, I totally agree with you!

**PaulW10** · 03-22-2018, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by lawson-stone

Guys I'm sorry but I regret to say I have to sit this tune out. I have too much going on and I find this a very hard tune to play, and I want to work on a couple of other music projects. I will read the thread and listen to the clips, since it looks like lots of good work is happening.

See you next tune!

Thanks for checking in Lawson! We're going to miss you on this one. It looks like Shadow of Your Smile will be next based on the poll results if you want to get a jump on it!

**Gramps** · 03-22-2018, 08:30 PM

Originally Posted by PaulW10

Gramps, if you're talking about PaulD's arrangement, I totally agree with you!

PaulD always plays stuff I like but I was referring to PaulW10 in this case.

Looks like I almost blew up your thread. Click tracks indeed! Some peoples kids. lol

Had I known peoples feelings about it I wouldn't have started the thread with that track or mentioned that I didn't see what difference it makes. Since someone said that if the track wasn't an issue more people might get involved I thought....sure more people is nice. Good intentions, bad decision.

Anyway, you sounded great. Looking forward to hearing more.

**grahambop** · 03-23-2018, 05:13 AM

Originally Posted by ragman1

Thought so. Sorry, Joe, me no great aficionado. It's a bit like the Chromatic Lydian thing - useful maybe on occasion but a bit of a headache.

I find the Barry Harris framework very useful for solo guitar (although I haven't yet got into the 'families of dominants' thing as much as Joe has). All my solo things these days contain some elements of it. Very useful when harmonizing a melody or creating additional movement to fill out the structure.

**ragman1** · 03-23-2018, 07:08 AM

Originally Posted by grahambop

I find the Barry Harris framework very useful for solo guitar (although I haven't yet got into the 'families of dominants' thing as much as Joe has). All my solo things these days contain some elements of it. Very useful when harmonizing a melody or creating additional movement to fill out the structure.

Absolutely. As I said, useful occasionally although I'm not a great fan of 'new theories'. I mean, I knew about the relationship between 7b9's and diminished chords, which is fairly obvious. Whether all related dominants can be substituted for each other is another matter.

Can I go on a bit? Say you have the usual 2-5-1 in C. The G7 be seen as a G7b9 and substituted with any diminished chord in the family D,F,B and Ab. They're just inversions so that's simple.

But apparently those notes can be treated as dominants D7, F7, B7 or Ab7 and substituted for the G7. Is that right?

I may have this wrong, of course, so open to correction.