Epiphone "Blak & Blu" Casino - Worst Neck Joint in the History of Neck Joints?

[John A.]

You’re completely right - we should reasonably expect and get a much higher level of quality from a top brand. But reality is that Gibson products have had some serious QC issues for over 50 years. The L-5CN I bought new in 1970 had a very visible splice in the binding, and there was a large (about 4 square inches) patch of raw, unfinished wood on the top starting under the end of the fingerboard (along with other issues that were bad enough in aggregate to prompt my dealer to take it back for a full refund).

Weak quality control, along with the quick fixes and use of random substitute parts on production models, is a major reason for Gibson’s decline and their repetitive financial crises. Epiphone production designs, specs, and methods are Gibson corporate directives. I hope they aren’t doing this to Mesa too.

At least in the last bankruptcy, quality problem were an effect of financial problems caused by Gibson's investments in non-guitar businesses, not a cause of the financial problems. People have been complaining about lapses in Gibson quality for over 50 years. That doesn't mean we shouldn't expect better and stop complaining about worse, but I think we have to concede that it's much less of a financial and reputational problem than it would be in world where substance matters.

[murrayatuptown]

Wow...I was going to chime in that it can't be worse than Harmony neck joints.

But yeah, that is scary. I tried to tell myself it's exaggerated by magnification on my laptop screen...and had the sobering realization that it's NOT magnified.

I just had a neck reset done and someone previously had attempted one on that guitar AND filled the gap with either epoxy or Gorilla Glue (TBD). The luthier said Gorilla Glue (polyurethane) is really brittle & CAN be easy to get out. He didn't confirm how much difficulty he had, but he was happy with the outcome.

You may have already made a decision, but for the sake of future readers...carpenters glue and (rabbit) hide glue 'fail' or soften at modestly high temperatures vs. epoxies (there are countless specialty formulations...too many to generalize). I think carpenter's & other PVA glues somewhere around 190 F/99 C, and hide glue can fail in a hot car under string tension...epoxies (too many recipes exist to generalize) typically need much higher temperatures. So using a traditional wood glue if you are gap-filling is in your own best interest (and any future owners).

In my last electronics job, there were epoxies and something called 'chassis cement' that might also have been epoxy in products that were repaired rather than replaced if at all possible. Occasionally something would be placed in an industrial oven or benchtop thermal chamber after removing circuit boards to soften epoxy for removal at around 350 F/177 C. People liked to tell a story from decades earlier that probably got retold & exaggerated, but someone forgot to remove a lithium battery (the circuit boards were removed) and the door of the heating device was supposedly blown off by the battery's objection to the excessive heat.

Some Yamaha guitars supposedly had necks installed with epoxy, making removal potentially very unpleasant. I've seen people complaining online about encountering that.

[Rocket Roll]

Thanks for the advice. If I were doing things myself, I would have used something like TiteBond and hoped for the best. Things being as they are, I gave the guitar to the luthier friend to work on and he had filled the gaps between the neck and the body with epoxy.

Now, I know that it practically means that the guitar is irreparable without major surgery, but it is what it is - cheap and effective fix.

I do notice the guitar responding "tighter" as a whole, which is to say it vibrates more on certain frequencies. Nothing crazy, just a bit more alive.

As you can see from the second picture here, he tried to polish the guitar afterwards and pretty soon the neck heel finish thinned down to nothing. That makes him suspect some other foul play - maybe a broken neck and an overspray.

Whatever it is, the guitar is stable now. And I really like it. I liked it from the start. But watching it's insides, I do see that there's no comparison with USA-made Casinos.