Well You Needn’t Changes

[Ukena]

Furthermore, a lot of great players DO go back to the original versions of standards...Bernstein is huge on this.

There are a couple of tunes that almost nobody plays as the composers wrote. For All Of Me Seymour Simons wrote the the music (in the original key of Bb) under the final phrase “So why not take all of me” starting with a Cm7b5, rather than the Cm7 that everyone uses; the melody then follows “why not take all” as Bb Gb Bb D. One can hear it in Louis Armstrong’s 1932 recording:

Likewise, at the end of Jimmy Van Heusen’s tune Darn That Dream, the end of each penultimate phrase of the chorus in the key of G (“you’re out of sight” in the first chorus) are the notes G F# A E, over the chords Bm7 Bb° Am7. Most players today use the chords more like Bm7 Bbm7 Am7, and use the melody G F# A Eb, as do the various fake books and available sheet music.

Here's Benny Goodman and Mildred Bailey:

Bernstein and Lage seem to prefer the original, however.

Fun Fact: Louis Armstrong (as Bottom) was the first to sing this song, along with Maxine Sullivan (Titania), Bill Bailey, The Dandridge Sisters, and others when it was introduced on Broadway in Swingin' the Dream (a musical version of Midsummer Night's Dream), with Goodman's Sextet and Bud Freeman's Summa Cum Laude Orchestra.

Also in the cast of the musical that closed after 9 performances: Butterfly McQueen (Puck) and Moms Mabley (Quince).

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

There are a couple of tunes that almost nobody plays as the composers wrote. For All Of Me Seymour Simons wrote the the music (in the original key of Bb) under the final phrase “So why not take all of me” starting with a Cm7b5, rather than the Cm7 that everyone uses; the melody then follows “why not take all” as Bb Gb Bb D. One can hear it in Louis Armstrong’s 1932 recording:

Likewise, at the end of Jimmy Van Heusen’s tune Darn That Dream, the end of each penultimate phrase of the chorus in the key of G (“you’re out of sight” in the first chorus) are the notes G F# A E, over the chords Bm7 Bb° Am7. Most players today use the chords more like Bm7 Bbm7 Am7, and use the melody G F# A Eb, as do the various fake books and available sheet music.

Here's Benny Goodman and Mildred Bailey:

Bernstein and Lage seem to prefer the original, however.

Fun Fact: Louis Armstrong (as Bottom) was the first to sing this song, along with Maxine Sullivan (Titania), Bill Bailey, The Dandridge Sisters, and others when it was introduced on Broadway in Swingin' the Dream (a musical version of Midsummer Night's Dream), with Goodman's Sextet and Bud Freeman's Summa Cum Laude Orchestra.

Also in the cast of the musical that closed after 9 performances: Butterfly McQueen (Puck) and Moms Mabley (Quince).

I play the IIm7/b5 there in the end. Original key is C BTW. Most people also go from IV via #VIo to the I in the second half (Real Book also IIRC), Armstrong goes via IVm like in the original sheet music (not at hand ATM unfortunately).

Do not learn the melody from this recording sung by Pops LOL.

[AllanAllen]

It's ironic to see that Louis Armstrong cut used in regards to respecting the original composition.

[Christian Miller]

I play the IIm7/b5 there in the end. Original key is C BTW. Most people also go from IV via #VIo to the I in the second half (Real Book also IIRC), Armstrong goes via IVm like in the original sheet music (not at hand ATM unfortunately).

Do not learn the melody from this recording sung by Pops LOL.

Real book has IVm

I do both, and sometimes the IIm7b5. Depends on the vibe. You have to play with the other musicians.


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[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

[...] You have to play with the other musicians. [...]

Of course. It takes double concentration when you are used to something else. "Oh shit, they play the diminished!" LOL (my piano playing gipsy buddy with whom I started playing again recently plays the #IVo as well.)

I learned it from shellacs.

ALL OF ME : JACK HYLTON AND HIS ORCHESTRA : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

I found the original vocal piano sheet music I got from Ethan Iverson. Original key is C.

All_Of_Me.pdf

[ragman1]

PS. A lot of tunes benefit from changing a m7 to a m7b5 in certain places. Can't remember them all now. ATTYA is one IIRC.

[pamosmusic]

PS. A lot of tunes benefit from changing a m7 to a m7b5 in certain places. Can't remember them all now. ATTYA is one IIRC.

Also written into a fair number of tunes ... I Love You, My Funny Valentine, What Is This Thing

I love the minor ii-V to major I

[Christian Miller]

Of course. It takes double concentration when you are used to something else. "Oh shit, they play the diminished!" LOL (my piano playing gipsy buddy with whom I started playing again recently plays the #IVo as well.)

I learned it from shellacs.

ALL OF ME : JACK HYLTON AND HIS ORCHESTRA : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

I found the original vocal piano sheet music I got from Ethan Iverson. Original key is C.

All_Of_Me.pdf

Just do what the greats do and play the wrong chord on the wrong chord.*

* only works for soloing


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[PMB]

Also written into a fair number of tunes ... I Love You, My Funny Valentine, What Is This Thing

I love the minor ii-V to major I

Two of the three songs you mentioned are by Cole Porter. I think of that progression as Porter's signature sound. It appears briefly but notably in I've Got You Under My Skin and is implied in a bunch of his other tunes (All of You, I Love Paris, Love for Sale, Night & Day...).

[Christian Miller]

Flat that six baby


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[Ukena]

I play the IIm7/b5 there in the end. Original key is C BTW.

It is certainly most often played in C. Wikipedia says the original key was Bb, but we all know about relying on Wikipedia. Belle Baker was the first to sing it, over the radio in 1931; Ruth Etting was the first to record it, in 1931, and that recording seems to be in the key of E. There is a faint later recording of Belle Baker singing the song in the background in the film Atlantic City (1944), and that also sounds like it is in the key of E.

I can't seem to find anything that identifies the original sheet music, so I don't know how we can know what the original key is. But I play it (and sing it) in C, just like most folks.

[AllanAllen]

It is certainly most often played in C. Wikipedia says the original key was Bb, but we all know about relying on Wikipedia. Belle Baker was the first to sing it, over the radio in 1931; Ruth Etting was the first to record it, in 1931, and that recording seems to be in the key of E. There is a faint later recording of Belle Baker singing the song in the background in the film Atlantic City (1944), and that also sounds like it is in the key of E.

I can't seem to find anything that identifies the original sheet music, so I don't know how we can know what the original key is. But I play it (and sing it) in C, just like most folks.

F for me. It’s hard to hit the notes in C.

[ccroft]

Well... I for one am happy to see this thread still going strong while the colonoscopy thread seems to have thankfully petered out. I think it's a hopeful sign for the forum :)

The tune that started this is one of my ol' faves. I don't know which version I ended up with, learning it off a Monk record that I can't even remember. That one with him in the wagon looks familiar. This thread makes me want to go back into it and explore.

I dig Okazaki's version on Work: #24 here. So... which version is that?!

[AllanAllen]

[AllanAllen]

I dig Okazaki's version on Work: #24 here. So... which version is that?!

This is a great take, he gets the spirit of Monk.

[JazzPadd]

Well... I for one am happy to see this thread still going strong while the colonoscopy thread seems to have thankfully petered out. I think it's a hopeful sign for the forum

The tune that started this is one of my ol' faves. I don't know which version I ended up with, learning it off a Monk record that I can't even remember. That one with him in the wagon looks familiar. This thread makes me want to go back into it and explore.

I dig Okazaki's version on Work: #24 here. So... which version is that?!

Indeed, great take! I love the way Okazaki interprets Monk.

Based on the main theme starting with the G# leading in to A, and the theme on the bridge beginning with Eb-Ab-Eb as per Cardenas, it sounds to me like the Monk version.

The Miles Davis version starts with a B leading in to C for the main theme and starts the bridge theme a half step lower, D-G-D.

Both are cool in my view, although I’ve only played WYN in jam sessions, so we use what’s in the session books: the Miles Davis version, as per the late 1970s Real Book and the more recent Japanese Jazz Standard Bible.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

[...] I can't seem to find anything that identifies the original sheet music, so I don't know how we can know what the original key is. But I play it (and sing it) in C, just like most folks.

I already posted the beginning of the chorus in the 3 posts below the one you quoted from me.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

Also written into a fair number of tunes ... I Love You, My Funny Valentine, What Is This Thing

I love the minor ii-V to major I

I love the original major II V to relative minor in There Will Never Be Another You (meas. 3 and 4). The Beatles' Yesterday has it as well.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

Well... I for one am happy to see this thread still going strong while the colonoscopy thread seems to have thankfully petered out. I think it's a hopeful sign for the forum [...]

This thread is more anal than the colonoscopy thread.

Sorry, I could not resist such a through pass. I recently thought about a comedy program called "20,000 miles below-the-belt" together with a colleague having a similar humor.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

IMO there is something odd looking and uneconomic in your fingering with the position change in the beginning.

Why don't you finger the opening ascending arpeggio like you would finger a "short barred" F major chord (fretted: x-3-3-2-1-1; fingered: x-3-4-2-1-1)?

Hammer middle f. to ring f. for the first two notes, then get move middle f. to the fingering I described above.

Descending you play the tonic with the ring f. in order to free the pinky for the ending of the phrase.

[Christian Miller]

Hey I like the vibe an awful lot! Nice.

This is something I’ve been playing around with for monks line on the A - this bass and tenor line on piano together. I think you could integrate it with your stop chords? I think the repeated F# chord could be opened up a bit.

1 3 x x x x
2 4 x x x x
1 x 0 x x x
2 x 1 x x x
1 x 2 x x x
2 x 3 x x x
1 x 3 x x x

I think you’d have to do every second chord on the A to make room for the melody, but I tried it and I think it sounds hip.

For the B

4 4 x x x x
5 5 x x x x
6 6 x x x x

Etc

Think those will sound cool on your guitar


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[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

IMO there is something odd looking and uneconomic in your fingering with the position change in the beginning.

Why don't you finger the opening ascending arpeggio like you would finger a "short barred" F major chord (fretted: x-3-3-2-1-1; fingered: x-3-4-2-1-1)?

Hammer middle f. to ring f. for the first two notes, then get move middle f. to the fingering I described above.

Descending you play the tonic with the ring f. in order to free the pinky for the ending of the phrase.

I realize I forgot to mention that it sounds really nice.

[Ukena]

I already posted the beginning of the chorus in the 3 posts below the one you quoted from me.

That pdf of a page of sheet music has no indication that it is a reproduction of a 1931-era page of sheet music. If it is, my apologies for not acknowledging it.

Ebay has a number of listings for the song's sheet music from 1931.

It seems like C was the preferred key for the sheet music published by Irving Berlin, Inc. So I retire from the field – I'm happy to go with the flow.

Here is a listing with Paul Whiteman on the cover. It is in the key of C, although Paul Whiteman's 1931 recording starts off in Eb, and modulates to G for Mildred Bailey's solo.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

That pdf of a page of sheet music has no indication that it is a reproduction of a 1931-era page of sheet music. If it is, my apologies for not acknowledging it.

Ebay has a number of listings for the song's sheet music from 1931.

It seems like C was the preferred key for the sheet music published by Irving Berlin, Inc. So I retire from the field – I'm happy to go with the flow.

Here is a listing with Paul Whiteman on the cover. It is in the key of C, although Paul Whiteman's 1931 recording starts off in Eb, and modulates to G for Mildred Bailey's solo.

Here is a full scan with Russ Columbo on the cover.

All Of Me.pdf

The scan you can get from Ethan Iverson is from the same hand-engraved plate with ukele chords. Those hand-engraved scores were often reproduced in songbooks (with replaced titles in different fonts and sometimes replaced chords) until the 90ies and later.

[ragman1]

Well, as we're all doing solos, here's this :-)