Microphone suggestions for home recording

[Ray175]

Hi Folks
I'm finally entering into the arena of home recording and have received lots of nice presents for Christmas towards setting this up. I'm looking for input on suitable microphones for recording from my amp (in addition to DI). At the moment the gear I have (guitars aside) is:

• Fender ToneMaster Deluxe Recording with XLR out (plus 2 IRs - Shure SM57 and Royer Lbs R-121 - or none at all). Lawson has written, and posted recordings, extensively on the quality of these outputs on this ToneMaster Twin.
• XLR cable for amp to audio interface
• Audio interface is a Zoom U-44
• DAW is Reaper which I'm going to have to learn
• I also have BIAB 2014 UltraPak (for which I'll probably buy the DAW add-in)
• For practice I regularly use the Digitech Trio+ Band Creator

Electric guitars to be recorded include a 1961 ES-175D (PAFs), 2012 Custom Shop 1962 Strat, 1980 Ibanez AS200, Ibanez 2619 Artist Prestige, Gretsch Electromatic Jet g5220 and the styles I play include jazz, but are extremely wide including blues, rock and pop standards.
In terms of microphones I am totally ignorant and would like to identify something in the 250-350€/$ price range that will give a good rendering of the amp's output using the above-mentioned gear.
I'd really appreciate some recommendations and suggestions for a suitable mike, and more particularly why you like it. Any suggestions on positioning would also be really appreciated.
Looking forward to reading your suggestions - Happy New Year to you all!
Ray

[pingu]

shure sm57 is the classic
guitar amp mic

[Ray175]

Thanks Pingu - I've heard that from several sources and I'm surprised at its relatively low cost - 98€ from Thomann. Looks like an excellent deal !

[ThatRhythmMan]

My personal favorite is the Heil PR30. Millions of recordings use the SM57 though. It’s hard to dispute that.

[Pycroft]

SM57 is many engineers ' go-to ' for loud rock guitar , I think you may prefer something more detailed for Jazz , for home recording I use a Rode NT1 , I think they're about £120 . With your budget you could even go for a matched pair of condensers for stereo ' room ' sound - like these -

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Rode-Matche...c=1&th=1&psc=1

[Ray175]

My personal favorite is the Heil PR30. Millions of recordings use the SM57 though. It’s hard to dispute that.

Thanks Rythm Man for the suggestion - what in particular do you like about the PR30? I can see the built-in pop-screen being useful for vocals or cymbals, but would it add anything for miking an amp?

[Alter]

I think for home use, a mic is only worth it for acoustic and classical guitars, or unamplified archtops. If using an amp, especially one like the Tonemaster, or a multieffect, it is much easier to get a great sound without mics.

If going for mics, make sure the area you record, and your laptop are really quiet, or mics will give you problems. I have used for years with very good results for various applications a sm57 for electric (but hardly ever use it anymore these days with all the great cabinet simulations available), and a Rode NT1-A ldc mic and a pair of Rode NT5 sdc ones for acoustics. Good medium budget mics. I also really like ribbon mics for jazz, but have yet to buy one. And, the better mics you get, the more you need a better mic preamp..

[Ray175]

I think for home use, a mic is only worth it for acoustic and classical guitars, or unamplified archtops. If using an amp, especially one like the Tonemaster, or a multieffect, it is much easier to get a great sound without mics.

If going for mics, make sure the area you record, and your laptop are really quiet, or mics will give you problems. I have used for years with very good results for various applications a sm57 for electric (but hardly ever use it anymore these days with all the great cabinet simulations available), and a Rode NT1-A ldc mic and a pair of Rode NT5 sdc ones for acoustics. Good medium budget mics. I also really like ribbon mics for jazz, but have yet to buy one. And, the better mics you get, the more you need a better mic preamp..

Thanks for the useful suggestions Alter
My music room is above my garage, away from the residential parts of the house, so 90% of the time it's quiet - until someone opens the garage doors....
I'm sure the Tonemaster will deliver excellent sound, but I'm going down a road of exploration (recently retired) to learn a little bit abour home recording and I want to experience the difference sounds available from DI, mikes, and a mixture of both. I'd love a good ribbon mike but that can maybe come later once I've mastered the basics.

[Ray175]

In terms of mounting the mike, I'm looking at the Gravity MC CAB CL 01 (small for 20-30cm cabinet depth) as it offers compactness and space-saving. Anyone used it?

[lawson-stone]

Thanks for the useful suggestions Alter
My music room is above my garage, away from the residential parts of the house, so 90% of the time it's quiet - until someone opens the garage doors....
I'm sure the Tonemaster will deliver excellent sound, but I'm going down a road of exploration (recently retired) to learn a little bit abour home recording and I want to experience the difference sounds available from DI, mikes, and a mixture of both. I'd love a good ribbon mike but that can maybe come later once I've mastered the basics.

With the Tonemaster I'd be very surprised if you get any difference between the XLR out and mic'ing the cab. I have done simultaneous microphone on the cab and direct line out and really got frustrated because I forgot which channel was which and there was no difference I could hear. Mic'ing the cab will pick up a bit of ambient sound. I finally quit on that and just use the line out from my TM. I do mic my Princeton Reverb since it has no line out. That said, I got the Bugera PSI Powersoak and it provides a very solid Direct Line from my Princeton. I was very impressed with how well it worked. you might consider adding that to your arsenal of recording tools.

[fep]

I use an sm57 to mic my guitar amp. I place the mic almost touching the speaker grill cloth and relative to the speaker just about an inch inside the outside edge. The closer to the center of the speaker the brighter the sound, I believe it's most common to have the mic near the outside edge of the speaker.

I also use a sm57 to record vocals sometimes. You can even record acoustic guitar well with an sm57.

I've heard many recording Engineers say that if they could only have one mic it would be the sm57.

These mics are extremely durable, they are directional, and as such they do not pick up a lot of background noise. You generally put a dynamic mic, like the sm57, close to the recording source which is part of the reason you don't get a lot of background noise. Speaking of which, I record my guitar sometimes using the speakers to monitor and I practically get no bleed.

[pingu]

I'm going down a road of exploration (recently retired) to learn a little bit abour home recording and I want to experience the difference sounds available from DI, mikes, and a mixture of both. I'd love a good ribbon mike but that can maybe come later once I've mastered the basics.

how about recording 5/6 simultaneous racks ?
Just for a solo guitar ...
you could do

amp DI
sm57 on amp
Pair of condensers (Rodes or similar) on the guitar
And stereo pair of space mics

Then have a play with phasing them
aligning the tracks , mixing them down
adding ambience etc etc ,till you get a nice sound ....

[fep]

There is now a tool to compare mics (although I think they only have condensor mics). Pretty amazing what they did.

Audio Test Kitchen | Compare the gear. Trust your ears.

[fep]

Hi Folks

• DAW is Reaper which I'm going to have to learn

Ray

Learning Reaper, it's very deep, here is a great resource:

REAPER | Videos

[ThatRhythmMan]

Thanks Rythm Man for the suggestion - what in particular do you like about the PR30? I can see the built-in pop-screen being useful for vocals or cymbals, but would it add anything for miking an amp?

The most basic thing is that I simply prefer the way it sounds to other mics I have used. I’m sure that’s a result of many inherent factors. Some are shared with the SM57, like rear sound rejection and the ability to handle high SPL. I think the Heil has a more pleasing frequency response profile and I don’t hear the sibilance that I do with the SM57. The humbucking coil seems like it makes the Heil more quiet too.

All in all, the Heil seems like the closest thing in a dynamic mic to a nice ribbon mic without the fragility issues of ribbons. The Heil is very durable. My wife uses a PR30 for vocals and it has been carried to hundreds of gigs, always performing flawlessly.

[Ray175]

Thanks Lawson - I appreciate your input, given the time you've taken to share your own experience !

[Ray175]

how about recording 5/6 simultaneous racks ?
Just for a solo guitar ...
you could do

amp DI
sm57 on amp
Pair of condensers (Rodes or similar) on the guitar
And stereo pair of space mics

Then have a play with phasing them
aligning the tracks , mixing them down
adding ambience etc etc ,till you get a nice sound ....

I feel another rabbit hole fast approaching! Some fun ideas there Pingu, thanks
Ray

[Ray175]

Learning Reaper, it's very deep, here is a great resource:

REAPER | Videos

thanks Frank - I’ll certainly make use of this
Ray

[Dirk]

Two other affordable microphones that produce good quality cab micing are the Sennheiser e609 (and e906) and the Audix i5.

[Ray175]

Two other affordable microphones that produce good quality cab micing are the Sennheiser e609 (and e906) and the Audix i5.

Thanks for the suggestions Dirk.

Keep them coming folks!

[pingu]

Get an SM57 anyway ....

+
Audio Technica AT2020 quite good electret for general duties (£70 ish)

or if you wanna push the boat out
AT4040 really nice mic if you can afford it (£400 ish)

just an opinion

[Ray175]

Get an SM57 anyway ....

+
Audio Technica AT2020 quite good electret for general duties (£70 ish)

or if you wanna push the boat out
AT4040 really nice mic if you can afford it (£400 ish)

just an opinion

After lots of reading, and discussions today, it's a near certainty that I'll get the SM57, given it's ability to record a range of different sources more than satisfactorily - voice, amp, acoustic guitar.... It looks to be an excellent first purchase - with maybe a modest ribbon mike when I've got some basic recording experience under my belt.

In the meantime a big thank you to you all for your advice and suggestions.
Ray


PS If anyone has any remarks on the Gravity Cab Clamp about which I posted above, I'd still be interested in reading them.

[fep]

Another nice thing about an sm57, you can take it on a gig or a jam session and not worry much about breaking it... they are durable and inexpensive.

[KirkP]

- with maybe a modest ribbon mike when I've got some basic recording experience under my belt.

The SM57 is an excellent choice for a first mic since it’s so versatile and rugged. But I’d consider a condenser for later, especially if you want to record an unamplified instrument. They generally have a flatter and wider frequency response. Most require require phantom power.

Most mics (including the SM57) are directional and have proximity effect where the bass response dramatically increases as you get very close. So be aware of that when experimenting with mic positions.

[lawson-stone]

Another nice thing about an sm57, you can take it on a gig or a jam session and not worry much about breaking it... they are durable and inexpensive.

Especially in a bar fight with unruly patrons. An SM57 is better than a beer bottle for bashing belligerent bullies. And it will still work. I don't know if they survive dunking in a pint mug of ale...but I would not be surprised...