Guitarists that remind you of Stan Getz

**pcsanwald** · 09-26-2017, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by fasstrack

Saxophonists hardly have copied him---they know better. So guitar...

One of my favorite early Getz records is "Five Brothers": Stan Getz, Brew Moore, Zoot Sims, Allan Eager, and Al Cohn.

Getz unsurprisingly stands out, more due to his sound than note choices or phrasing, but, it's amazing how similar these guys sound on this record and how they all come out of Pres in slightly different ways. I've listened to this record a ton and I still couldn't reliably identify soloing order in a blindfold test.

Honestly I think the guitarist that reminds me the most of Stan is Charlie Christian.

**fasstrack** · 09-26-2017, 01:00 PM

It says a lot about Jimmy Raney that on his date (at 26 years old, with Motion, etc.) that was re-released as Early Getz b/c of Stan's bigger name it seems like Stan was keeping up with HIM as far as being what was then called 'modern'. Another guitarist now in his 70s was telling me Stan was learning bebop from Jimmy---and I agree. Stan was coming from Pres then, Raney from Bird. I thought Live at Storyville a classic (I like Birdland '52 even more) and you really can hear them playing the heads like one mind, but different approaches on the solos. I think that as much as Stan evolved and grew---and challenged himself hiring younger players later he never lost that Pres singing quality and directness. And he had the technique to play way more notes.

Maybe that's why Pres called him 'my singer'...

**teeps** · 09-26-2017, 05:08 PM

I might be completely out of genre here, but the guitar playing which immediately made me think "saxophone" was Alan Holdsworth's playing on the "Feels Good to Me" album by Bruford. Not the whole time but in glimpses. And more like an alto or soprano and not tenor. Has to do with overdrive, some compression and clever use of tone bending.

TH · 09-26-2017, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by teeps

I might be completely out of genre here, but the guitar playing which immediately made me think "saxophone" was Alan Holdsworth's playing on the "Feels Good to Me" album by Bruford. Not the whole time but in glimpses. And more like an alto or soprano and not tenor. Has to do with overdrive, some compression and clever use of tone bending.

The sax playing of Coltrane has inspired people like John McLaughlin. The sax playing of Peter Brotzman has had an effect on Sonny Sharrock. We might even say Boots Randolph and the Yakkity sax influenced Chet Atkins. But, I don't think any of them really addresses the OP question of a guitarist who fits the Stan Getz sensibility. Getz was a real melodic phraser, and not so much a linear sound sheets player, at least in the things he recorded publicly, or that I'm aware of.
Maybe Holdsworth does too, I just don't hear it. Now Wayne Shorter, maybe but Stan Getz? Do you really think Holdsworth fits the Bossa Nova or Kenny Barron niche? Hmmm, Learn something new every day I guess.

Expanding my ears all the time. Thanks!

David

**fasstrack** · 09-26-2017, 05:39 PM

Jim Hall?

Big, saxophone-influenced sound, shorter phrases than, say, Raney, composing rather than licks. Only problem: He sounds so much like Jim Hall...

**teeps** · 09-26-2017, 06:05 PM

OK, then. Sorry, I didn't intend to step on anybody. Charlie Byrd for the lyrical and Jimmy Raney for the melodic phrasing.

**AndyV** · 09-26-2017, 09:04 PM

For my money, a direct comparison to Getz doesn't exist but there are touchpoints. Getz had a lovely singing tone and a huge dynamic range - much greater than a guitar - but the salient features of his playing, IMHO, are his lyricism, natural melodic sense, and ability to phrase on any part of the beat. The guitar player who most has that trait of freely starting and ending phrases anywhere before, on or after the beat was Howard Roberts.

Any number of players use fx pedals to expand their dynamic range (Holdsworth, Frisell, etc) but that lyrical, breathy sound Getz had is really unique to the horn and personally, I like it that way. If I had only one CD on my desert island for the next 30 years or so it would be Getz/Gilberto.

**Cunamara** · 09-26-2017, 11:48 PM

Originally Posted by fasstrack

OK. Cool. I never said he wasn't a great guitarist or musician---just don't think he's on a level as improviser to be named with the people he was being named with on this thread. Especially since the OP was about guitarists that compare to Stan Getz, and to me Pat brought it back to more of a guitar sound and concept. To me he doesn't do an 'air column' like all the jazz guitar (soloists) players since Christian (that I like, anyway)---and I sort of don't hear that. It's a personal thing.

I DO respect him a lot for being original in sound and concept and love hearing him play a song like Cherish on an acoustic. He's pretty unmatched at that, and it can be sublime to hear. I'll leave it like that, on the positive tip...

Well, yes, Pat is pretty "guitaristic" in his playing style. He doesn't play Louis Armstrong lines like Django did or sax flavored lines like Charlie Christian, Tal Farlow or Jimmy Raney. Or piano-ish stuff like George Van Eps or Lenny Breau. I was responding to the statement that he is not on the same level- which sounds like "he is less skilled"- as some other improvisers. But stylistically he'd be nowhere even near a list of guitarists that remind the listener of Stan Getz!

**savofenno** · 09-27-2017, 08:24 AM

Originally Posted by paulcw16

I'd appreciate your thoughts. Thanks.

Grant Green, Jimmy Raney, Pat Metheny, Wes Montgomery, Kenny Burrell, George Benson, Jim Hall...

**fasstrack** · 09-27-2017, 10:03 AM

Originally Posted by Cunamara

Well, yes, Pat is pretty "guitaristic" in his playing style. He doesn't play Louis Armstrong lines like Django did or sax flavored lines like Charlie Christian, Tal Farlow or Jimmy Raney. Or piano-ish stuff like George Van Eps or Lenny Breau. I was responding to the statement that he is not on the same level- which sounds like "he is less skilled"- as some other improvisers. But stylistically he'd be nowhere even near a list of guitarists that remind the listener of Stan Getz!

To be honest, I DO think he's less skilled. Never leaves space, can't swing at all, I don't like his attack or phrasing (8th notes sound more country than jazz), doesn't tell a story for me---lotta things fall way short to my way of listening if you're comparing him to these other guys. But he's great at what he does and I respect and enjoy it for that...

**lawson-stone** · 09-27-2017, 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by Cunamara

Well, that might find some disagreement!

I don't think that his credentials as an improviser can be questioned and he is, I think, the peer of any jazz musician you'd care to name. Whether his playing is to your taste is a different question. I haven't cared for the PMG stuff for a very long time, but love the first 2-3 PMG records. And I like his trios which tend to have more swing feel. But I often find his playing claustrophobic and over-dense for probably the past 20 years, and have come to really dislike that delay-y sound. It's like you can't hear where the note actually is.

Stylistically he is far from Getz, to get back to the original question.

And Jim Hall had a high regard for Pat M. That’s a high accolade. Pat seems to have no technical obstacles to expressing whatever musical ideas he wants on the guitar. I find that very compelling and exciting.

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**gator811** · 10-03-2017, 06:53 PM

To be honest, I DO think he's less skilled. Never leaves space, can't swing at all, I don't like his attack or phrasing (8th notes sound more country than jazz), doesn't tell a story for me---lotta things fall way short to my way of listening if you're comparing him to these other guys. But he's great at what he does and I respect and enjoy it for that...

Yeah its interesting. Skill....I've been up close to Pat a couple of times and he is an absolute master of the instrument and has a massive musical imagination and vocabulary. But at the same time I think all of those critiques are spot on - especially in a 'jazz' context. I dont see him as a Getz like player at all.
I do think when he plays solo guitar he becomes the story teller - and I'd travel far to hear Pat do a solo concert.

Back to the OP . I dont know about Getz-like , but Johnny Smith and Getz seem to have a great synergy. Johnny is present and correct on every note - just like Stan.

**fasstrack** · 10-03-2017, 07:59 PM

And Getz/Raney. Smith was a master guitarist and class act. Raney was more of a jazz player to me...

**fasstrack** · 10-03-2017, 08:02 PM

delete...

**fasstrack** · 10-03-2017, 08:02 PM

Originally Posted by gator811

I do think when he plays solo guitar he becomes the story teller - and I'd travel far to hear Pat do a solo concert.

Couldn't agree more. He can really bring a song out with beauty and feeling. He's a deep musician, even if not always to my taste. When I love him I REALLY love him, and solo playing is my favorite thing he does...