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Religious cult? Geez, I was going to let that one go. Why would you even say that? More passive aggressive hostility. Nice playing from that Roland guy too. I don't think there's much improv there though. But great playing and concepts.
Jazz is ABOUT improvisation. That's the value I take from it. Being able to play things off the top, more or less, with training, of your head. It requires a LOT of different kinds of training and awareness, - at least it has for me. CULT??? I've never even insinuated such a thing.
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08-31-2014 11:39 AM
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Great. Jay, talk is cheap. We all know that. But keep in mind I'm talking about IMPROVISATION. I haven't confounded anything. I'm a composer and I use Sibelius and have used that program for 12 plus years. You create the arrangements. But I'm talking about improvising. I have no doubt you can PLAY. But can you improvise? Different kettle of fish.
Originally Posted by targuit
Henry - You confound things a bit. When I transcribe, I create my own transcriptions. I also play the music into Sibelius on keyboards. When I offer a transcription, it is my version of the song. Many individuals on the forum have received transcriptions of jazz tunes that I create. So don't fret. I would not send you a transcription of a slacker like John Coltrane.
And for the record, I appreciate your creativity and musicianship. I have listened to your recordings on Soundcloud or whatever that site is. You are a talented player and composer. If I can get a couple of hours of quiet here today, I am recording my version of My Funny Valentine, as solo guitar with a vocal and a second guitar improvising a bit over the basic track. All tracks will be "live" takes in my living room, as I have no editing software, just my Korg D1200 digital recorder, a $69 MXR mic, and my old Eighties vintage Yamaha G 235 classical guitar that I got for $260 in Italy back in the early Eighties. Then you can judge for yourself. And trust me on this, Henry, I can hang at any level you can reach, any day of the week. That is not aggressive - just the facts. I assume that a spontaneous recording will demonstrate not only that I can play jazz guitar, but that I can improvise over Rogers' and Hart's genial composition. If that is not sufficient, than tell me what you require.
I posted that beautiful video clip of Dyen because he is a masterful composer and performer. Classical and jazz. Do you agree?
Jay
I look forward to hearing you in either case. But it's all about improv. That's how you know whether it's brain surgery or not.
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Wow. Just wow. Originally Posted by targuit
Henry - You confound things a bit. When I transcribe, I create my own transcriptions. I also play the music into Sibelius on keyboards. When I offer a transcription, it is my version of the song. Many individuals on the forum have received transcriptions of jazz tunes that I create. So don't fret. I would not send you a transcription of a slacker like John Coltrane. And for the record, I appreciate your creativity and musicianship. I have listened to your recordings on Soundcloud or whatever that site is. You are a talented player and composer. If I can get a couple of hours of quiet here today, I am recording my version of My Funny Valentine, as solo guitar with a vocal and a second guitar improvising a bit over the basic track. All tracks will be "live" takes in my living room, as I have no editing software, just my Korg D1200 digital recorder, a $69 MXR mic, and my old Eighties vintage Yamaha G 235 classical guitar that I got for $260 in Italy back in the early Eighties. Then you can judge for yourself. And trust me on this, Henry, I can hang at any level you can reach, any day of the week. That is not aggressive - just the facts. I assume that a spontaneous recording will demonstrate not only that I can play jazz guitar, but that I can improvise over Rogers' and Hart's genial composition. If that is not sufficient, than tell me what you require.
I posted that beautiful video clip of Dyen because he is a masterful composer and performer. Classical and jazz. Do you agree?
Jay
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can't wait. Originally Posted by targuit
Henry - You confound things a bit. When I transcribe, I create my own transcriptions. I also play the music into Sibelius on keyboards. When I offer a transcription, it is my version of the song. Many individuals on the forum have received transcriptions of jazz tunes that I create. So don't fret. I would not send you a transcription of a slacker like John Coltrane. And for the record, I appreciate your creativity and musicianship. I have listened to your recordings on Soundcloud or whatever that site is. You are a talented player and composer. If I can get a couple of hours of quiet here today, I am recording my version of My Funny Valentine, as solo guitar with a vocal and a second guitar improvising a bit over the basic track. All tracks will be "live" takes in my living room, as I have no editing software, just my Korg D1200 digital recorder, a $69 MXR mic, and my old Eighties vintage Yamaha G 235 classical guitar that I got for $260 in Italy back in the early Eighties. Then you can judge for yourself. And trust me on this, Henry, I can hang at any level you can reach, any day of the week. That is not aggressive - just the facts. I assume that a spontaneous recording will demonstrate not only that I can play jazz guitar, but that I can improvise over Rogers' and Hart's genial composition. If that is not sufficient, than tell me what you require.
I posted that beautiful video clip of Dyen because he is a masterful composer and performer. Classical and jazz. Do you agree?
Jay
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regarding Dyens - am not that familiar with his classical performances, only his original music. agree that he is a masterful composer and great guitarist, but color me skeptical that he is masterful as a classical guitar performer. frankly, i don't think he's going for that. Originally Posted by targuit
Henry - You confound things a bit. When I transcribe, I create my own transcriptions. I also play the music into Sibelius on keyboards. When I offer a transcription, it is my version of the song. Many individuals on the forum have received transcriptions of jazz tunes that I create. So don't fret. I would not send you a transcription of a slacker like John Coltrane. And for the record, I appreciate your creativity and musicianship. I have listened to your recordings on Soundcloud or whatever that site is. You are a talented player and composer. If I can get a couple of hours of quiet here today, I am recording my version of My Funny Valentine, as solo guitar with a vocal and a second guitar improvising a bit over the basic track. All tracks will be "live" takes in my living room, as I have no editing software, just my Korg D1200 digital recorder, a $69 MXR mic, and my old Eighties vintage Yamaha G 235 classical guitar that I got for $260 in Italy back in the early Eighties. Then you can judge for yourself. And trust me on this, Henry, I can hang at any level you can reach, any day of the week. That is not aggressive - just the facts. I assume that a spontaneous recording will demonstrate not only that I can play jazz guitar, but that I can improvise over Rogers' and Hart's genial composition. If that is not sufficient, than tell me what you require.
I posted that beautiful video clip of Dyen because he is a masterful composer and performer. Classical and jazz. Do you agree?
Jay
check out the maestro's performance of his piece Fuoco (means fire), and then compare it to that of brilliant young Russian virtuoso Konstantin Okudzhava. nothing new here of course. this is the age old phenomena of a composer who is a good performer, vs. a non-composer instrumental virtuoso.
https://guitar.mymusictalk.com/video...i#.VANTAfldVikLast edited by fumblefingers; 08-31-2014 at 12:57 PM.
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A modest contrition - I perhaps sounded a little aggressive regarding hanging with you, Henry, but after all I am a pretty fluent reader, player, and I compose a bit, too. In addition to being a physician, which tends to command a lot of your attention. Anyway, I just came down from my recording setup actually to retract that part - it sounds 'too confident' on the nice side and a bit 'snide' on the bad side. I'm having that kind of day and I have to be somewhere late this afternoon, so I'm trying to get the job done. Pardon my effusive self confidence. Anyway, time to record.
Fumble, I actually like Roland's style because I'm not as interested in a 'technical' masterpiece as I am in the heart and the soul. What speaks to me emotionally first, intellectually second. Anyway, when I have a free moment, I want to listen to that other gent's performance you mention.
Jay
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targuit and Henry should have their own show. I'm not sure yet if it should be a music program or a comedy hour. Both maybe. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
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understood. he plays it slower which allows more time to add some expression. but the faster player's rendition is much more evocative of a (sinister) fire, at least to my sensibilities. Originally Posted by targuit
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what's the ETA for the showcase upload? Originally Posted by targuit
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Finally made time to watch the whole video great hearing Herbie talk about lessons learned from Miles. A lot of good nuggest of insight from Herbie. I hope the his other lectures make it to Youtube.
Now I got to work on leaving out the Butter Notes. And loved him talking how Miles made Herbie flubbed chord work. As Miles said there are no mistakes only opportunities. Of course someone asked Miles about some other player once and Miles said.... he's badder than a broke dick dog. No one is sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing.
Thanks for posting the link.Last edited by docbop; 08-31-2014 at 06:41 PM.
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Originally Posted by henryrobinett
The criteria for what constitutes classical guitar may not be as fixed as some would believe; its certainly not as well delineated as it was at one point. These three guitarists have become familiar enough with the canon and the kinesthetics of the classic genre to show more than a passing familiarity.
Not to bring this thread back to Herbie too soon, but one thing I like about modern jazz, in some circles at least, the spirit of exploration has superceded any fixed superficial rules of what jazz should be. If it contributes to the growth of art, and it's offering a technique in the service of the music, it doesn't matter where it came from.
People find membership in a club through talk, some by action. I happen to like these guys as examples of exploring players. The players say all they need to say with the music.
David
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I dunno, most of the serious classical guys I met in college were worse readers than the same level jazz guys... Your mileage may vary
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Monder is a MFer. I haven't heard the clips yet. Just saying.
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I think you mean classical guitarist guys.... Many just read enough to learn a piece of music and read a chart for reference. All the other classical players usually are good readers, sometimes that's the only thing they have going for them. Originally Posted by OPherman47
In music school sometimes got messy with the classical musician that could read anything and the street/ear players who couldn't read note, but could play the hell out of anything. Sad part is many of the ear players would quit out of frustration because they could play, but were in low level classes because they couldn't read and didn't know theory.
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I think this is the guy, he's forum member Sylvain54000, real name Sylvain Courtney. He's got quite a few posts in the showcase, he's a monster and that right hand technique on electric guitar...it sure didn't happen overnight. He seems to usually play an archtop with traditional tone, but this fusiony stuff with a strat grabbed me. Originally Posted by henryrobinett
Last edited by cosmic gumbo; 09-02-2014 at 02:47 AM.
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Sylvain's just too good
I'd like to know his story...I dunno why, but I have a hunch that picking hand is less "classically trained" and more "I picked up the guitar and played with my fingers and I've done it ever since."
There's lots of little things about his style that suggest to me he's worked out his own unique style, solving problems as he went, over the course of many years. But I could be wrong
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I agree is amazing to watch him play his right hand is so relaxed and so much control. I agree he appears to of found what works for him, which is what most teachers/mentors say is the bottom line, find what works for you. Originally Posted by mr. beaumont
Sylvain's just too good
I'd like to know his story...I dunno why, but I have a hunch that picking hand is less "classically trained" and more "I picked up the guitar and played with my fingers and I've done it ever since."
There's lots of little things about his style that suggest to me he's worked out his own unique style, solving problems as he went, over the course of many years. But I could be wrong
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