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  1. #1

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    Hi guys!

    I looked around a bit at my home town, which is lacking of a guitar teacher, to start my guitar school for beginners (well, I am also a beginner in many ways...), and realized, that they all want to learn rock. I never learnt rock, dont know how to play/teach that. I know the minor pentatonic and the power chords are the most important, and some technique, like hammer-on, pull-off, slide, vibrato. I dont know the tapping technique.

    So after I got that feedback from some guys who want to learn, I decided to give this teaching one more year, or rather to give one more year to myself, to learn a bunch of things before I start teaching.

    Nevertheless, I wont give up learning jazz, my fauvorite, I am planning to visit another official jazz guitar school, but this is a bit "off topic" of here.

    So my question is how do you learn/teach rock if you ever do that? What are the most important elements of that?

    Thanks a lot.

  2.  

    The Jazz Guitar Chord Dictionary
     
  3. #2

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    If it's old school "classic" rock, it's all about blues guitar actually (my opinion). Select some classic rock tunes and go from there, I'd say...

  4. #3

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    Sorry, but as a teacher, if you say you are a beginner yourself, teaching something you don't know how to do is a pretty bad idea.

  5. #4

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    I didnt say I am absolutely a beginner at guitar. I said I am a beginner in many ways. I am beginner at teaching, and in rock for example. Thats why I said I am going to give one more full year for myself. I think 1 year will be enough to learn the rock thing plus to put a teaching material together.

    I just want to know what are Your thoughts on teaching rock guitar.

    Thanks

  6. #5

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    study the early sounds of rock guitar..early 50's..chuck berry is the template for this kind of stuff..his riffs are still used today by some of the best players..some songs that have great "rock" flavored guitar stuff that almost every beginner learns:

    rock around the clock-classic guitar riffs
    honky tonk part 1 & 2 - Bill Doggett - great guitar stuff

    Walk don't run, perfidia - ventures

    Sleepwalk- santo & johnny..and others that covered this - larry carlton is one

    You cant sit down - phil upchurch..very tasty guitar work-

  7. #6

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    Yes. But the young guys want to learn Tool, Rage Against the Machine (old), Death Cab for Cutie. Done Zeppelin still. Not Eagles so much. Classic for sure. But you gotta learn some more recent stuff and sneak in some blues scales and riffs.

  8. #7

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    Blues for some older beginners. Ive found most youngsters don't get blues.

  9. #8

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    transcribe it for the young dudes in front of them. I did that for some kids I was teaching when I was back home from college. It was like they'd seen a ghost. I think I transcribed some Iron Maiden for them, both guitar parts. I was teaching two brothers. They loved it!

    Now the only guitar teaching I do is in a guitar club for my school. It's all good. Whatever gets a kid to pick up an instrument instead of a damn iPhone is good in my book.

  10. #9

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    Honestly, if you're asking those questions, you really shouldn't be teaching.


    Transcribing in front of a student is one of the biggest rip offs and time wasters in teaching. Once in a while is fine. Basing your whole teaching approach on it is stealing a kids, parents money. How about teaching the tools necessary for them to transcribe themselves..... I'm sorry but I taught next to too many teachers who's method was, "what do you want to play "?

  11. #10

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    It was just once, to hook them in. I once studied with a metal guy who had me sight read twinkle twinkle little star... and didn't give me anything else to work on. It was in a method book, that got me to quit guitar for 3 years after... THAT was a rip off and it was harmful to my development. He would take smoke breaks as I drudged through the sight reading.

  12. #11

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    Yeah, but sometimes they ask for a specific song that I have to learn. The choice is theirs from my point of view. I can teach it to them next week, if I remember or learn it right then. I ask. It normally doesn't take long. I make it as a reward. Do the lesson and I'll teach it to you, type thing. Normally, as I said elsewhere, I don't do the al la carte brand of teaching.

  13. #12

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    I like the idea of the song being the incentive. Teaching a kid who wanted to learn more Tom Petty and Beatles songs how to sight read little kid melodies wasn't the right idea. If he did the sight reading and maybe a song or two at the end of the month, I would have stuck with it. But he ran my curiosity and drive dry with the Method stuff, and he didn't even look interested. If I saw that guy today, I'd give him hell and get him fired from that little music store. I lost 3-5 years of play time because of that ass head.

  14. #13

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    To vintagelove: I asked those questions, because later I want to teach. Not now, as I stated before. No one is born as a teacher, this is also a learning path. Of course I wont teach until I know all the stuff needed, I made a good teaching material stuff, and tried that method on a few students to see whether I am a good teacher or not.


    Thank You guys for all the good inputs! Keep sharing Your teaching experiences here, please!

    Thanks again!

  15. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by Irez87
    I like the idea of the song being the incentive. Teaching a kid who wanted to learn more Tom Petty and Beatles songs how to sight read little kid melodies wasn't the right idea. If he did the sight reading and maybe a song or two at the end of the month, I would have stuck with it. But he ran my curiosity and drive dry with the Method stuff, and he didn't even look interested. If I saw that guy today, I'd give him hell and get him fired from that little music store. I lost 3-5 years of play time because of that ass head.
    It was my experince too. I was stuck with a Classical guitar teacher, and I was really interested how play and strum chords of my fav. songs at the time, but he would always say nooo, study scales and prepare to play Bach. I hated the guitar for a few years after that.

  16. #15

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    Berklee online has some courses. True Fire as well.

    for Berklee you can drop 4,500 and audit 3 courses at the same time. or, take the classes for credit and really learn.

  17. #16

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    My point with that was in this day and age, just about everything is available online via a video, tab, sheet music, etc. Why not tell the kid to print it out and bring it the next week. Or better yet teach them to find the lesson on YouTube and figure it out themselves (obviously you will assist if they have problems). There is so much more important material to cover in a lesson. If you save five minutes in the lesson by having them print out the tab, that five minutes can be used to sing/play intervals, read, rhythm excercices etcetc.

    of course when teaching there are times when figuring out stuff for students is appropriate. Taking ten minutes to figure out the riff to a meaningless tune, is a waste of time. Also, if you do teach a song, make sure to go the extra step to discuss what's going on musically, chord progression, what scale the melody comes from etc etc. teaching them to put x finger on y fret is like 1/5th of the battle.



    I noticed a couple people complaining of teachers making them read. Reading is extremely valuable, but again just one of many things a student needs to learn and work on. Reading should be a small portion of every lesson or 2 until the student gets it. From there they can determine how far they want to go. That being said, if they are spending 3/4 of the lesson making you read, and even worse, not recognizing the student has zero interest, they are probably a terrible teacher.


    to the op, if you really want to do it, step 1 imo is learn to play the sh@t out of a blues. Then pick a few classic solos, learn them perfect. Meanwhile, learn the 12 or so chord progressions that make up rock/pop/country. Once you can improvise well over a blues, a I bVII IV I, and a Mr Crowley'esqe/classical chord progression, you're probably good to get started.

    That is if your theory, ear training, technique, reading, understanding of music, etc etc is up to par. The truth is you'll probably be a mediocre teacher for the first few years. But every year you'll get better. Trust me we all wish we could go back and do things differently. However, there is a famous quote (who's creator slips my mind) that goes something like a great teachers job is to inspire students enough that they begin to study on their own. So as long as you're doing that, you're halfway there.

  18. #17

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    Yeah. To those complaining that teachers made them read and almost quit altogether. Yeah quit. I have no need for sniveling whining students. Quit quick. Guitar is a MUSICAL instrument. You think if you were learning clarinet you could get away with the teacher not teaching you how to read, but instead teaching you Smoke in the Water by finger positions?

    I get of tired of spoiled entitled little guitar wannabes. Learn the instrument. In fact what I tell some folks is to take beginning from someone else. The problem is I'll probably have to re-teach you.

    Sorry. Another rant. Lol.

  19. #18
    "Print the tab/lead sheet" is my default as well. Usually ask for a couple of options. "Pick a couple of things you think are reasonable and we'll look at them", and, yes it's kind of a reward. I don't work on that stuff off the clock though. it's a reward for them anyway.

    there are some decent lessons to be learned from correcting the mistakes in everything you get off the Internet. talk about form and counting , as opposed to just looking for which word goes with which chord etc.

    I do some chords and note reading to start, with anyone, but that's just me. Every teacher has to do what is right for them I suppose. Can't imagine doing only note reading for weeks on end with a beginner.

    I think, as a teacher, it's really valuable to be upfront and honest with the student about what you're doing and who you are. If someone wants to learn to really shred heavy-metal or play jazz, I'll probably refer them to someone else. Teaching things I'm not as skilled with isn't good for my brand and my reputation.

    I don't think there's anything wrong with the teachers that only taught reading from the beginning, but they should have at least said that's what they were about. If the student really wanted to learn to strum chords or work riffs, he should've referred them elsewhere.

    Doesn't help to preach about what real music is , whether your classical or rocker.

    If you're patient enough, regardless of your level, your schedule fills with students who take value from the way you actually teach. It's a big world. You don't have to teach every body. Find your niche. That's just my two cents.

  20. #19

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    Yeah. I always tell them. First lesson is indoctrination into what I do, how I teach, what I expect of students. But first I ask what they want. I ask them why they want to play guitar? What inspired them to take lessons? Guitar Hero? I see if we can be a match.

    Generally I inspired them. Sometimes they last a lesson or two. And that's fine. But most are with me for a year or two. I'm not really in the business of teaching guitar. I'm in the business of making musicians. So I don't expect to have a bevy of guitar students. That's not what I want. I'd go crazy.

  21. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by henryrobinett
    Yeah. I always tell them. First lesson is indoctrination into what I do, how I teach, what I expect of students. But first I ask what they want. I ask them why they want to play guitar? What inspired them to take lessons? Guitar Hero? I see if we can be a match.

    Generally I inspired them. Sometimes they last a lesson or two. And that's fine. But most are with me for a year or two. I'm not really in the business of teaching guitar. I'm in the business of making musicians. So I don't expect to have a bevy of guitar students. That's not what I want. I'd go crazy.
    I found myself in the situation where I have to teach anyone the school gives me. I cant really do private lessons on my own due to a small apartment I live in with someone, but even before when I could, the students drove me crazy by canceling last min. So I work in small music schools now, where most students are kids, and some of them I would tell to leave, if I could.. But I cant, or I will be fired. I have to teach them regardless, its a torture!

  22. #21
    Firming up policies re. cancellation , repayment etc. really helps with not getting upset about that kind of thing.

    I've been in the school setting as well, and all I can say is that it's still about mindset. you still have to let them OWN their part of not practicing or whatever. Much of teaching is about training them on how to practice anyway. But with a lot of those kids you're basically directing the only practice they'll get that week... during the lesson .
    Ha! If you need it to pay the bills, you can make it work, but it's not a forever thing. Taking a water break while they practice it for the 10th time is a real thing. Seriously!

    Long-term, it has to be your show, on your terms, though. Only way to keep your sanity. Best thing for your reputation and business is often to fire a student. It's not all about money in the short term.
    Last edited by matt.guitarteacher; 09-29-2015 at 01:16 PM.

  23. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by matt.guitarteacher
    Firming up policies re. cancellation , repayment etc. really helps with not getting upset about that kind of thing.

    I've been in the school setting as well, and all I can say is that it's still about mindset. you still have to let them OWN their part of not practicing or whatever. Much of teaching is about training them on how to practice anyway. But with a lot of those kids you're basically directing the only practice they'll get that week... during the lesson .
    Ha! If you need it to pay the bills, you can make it work, but it's not a forever thing. Taking a water break while they practice it for the 10th time is a real thing. Seriously!

    Long-term, it has to be your show, on your terms, though. Only way to keep your sanity. Best thing for your reputation and business is often to fire a student. It's not all about money in the short term.
    When i was leaving in a small studio appartment by myself, teaching next to kitchen sink never felt like a professional situation. Its almost impossible to enforce any kind of firm policies. I couldnt. Just the reality of living in a big city.

    Yeah, its all about paying bills and keeping your sanity in schools. They want to make money, its a business. If i tell them or parents a kid is not showing any talent/interest/no doing hw etc. wouldnt change a thing. Im sure there are teachers out there who going out of their way to motivate, bring out the best, never give up, have patience of an angel, and God bless them! If I see a kid dropping his pick into the sound hole of his guitar on purpose like 5 times in half an hour, thinking he actually tricks me, i have bad news for ya- IDGAF.

    The funny thing is, when i started working i was enthusiastic, excited, and working extra hard trying to find a way to motivate. I would get upset if a student didnt do hw, and have a talk and try to push harder. Guess what, the drop out rate was much higher! I learned my lesson, now everybody seems happier.

    All this being said, some of the students i teach are amazing, and make it all worthwhile.

  24. #23

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    My teaching method..if I have one..is let the student tell me what they "think" they want to learn..this is for basic beginners..the ones that want to learn "speed" playing and have no knowledge of music history or care to find out..I tell them I cant help them..I don't want to..and I don't have to (that took some time for me to discover)..I like to teach what I like..whats the cliché-do what you like and you will never have to work..

    My choice is an intermediate student who knows the basics and really wants to advance..showing them how to learn is the long range goal..then they can choose for themselves what to learn

    One of the most rewarding things for me..when someone is "stuck" .. they reach a plateau and cant find a way to move on from it..often it is showing them how to connect two unrelated things they already do know..and connecting them..if that makes sense..and then show them something new on top of that..like how to connect two unrelated chord progressions or solo lines and make them "one" .. and then show them something that will extend (inversions of their own chord progression) what they already know..seeing progress while the lesson is happening..not after several weeks of "practice this and THEN you can do THAT" .. then break it down in theory terms..so the material is theirs and they have interest in it already..so learning more about it is a plus..rather than teaching theory first and not have any idea how or why the knowledge fits in their music studies..

    often showing students to play what they already know in different keys opens up some new avenues as it challenges them to play what they already know and like to play..and in doing so many discover some insight into the fretboard they never thought of before..
    Last edited by wolflen; 10-01-2015 at 12:00 AM.

  25. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by henryrobinett
    Yeah. To those complaining that teachers made them read and almost quit altogether. Yeah quit. I have no need for sniveling whining students. Quit quick. Guitar is a MUSICAL instrument. You think if you were learning clarinet you could get away with the teacher not teaching you how to read, but instead teaching you Smoke in the Water by finger positions?

    I get of tired of spoiled entitled little guitar wannabes. Learn the instrument. In fact what I tell some folks is to take beginning from someone else. The problem is I'll probably have to re-teach you.

    Sorry. Another rant. Lol.
    virtually every student i taught learned how to read. i would explore other things with them too, but they all got the "Book 1" routine from me. :0

  26. #25

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    Thanks to you all guys!

    You helped me a lot!

  27. #26

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    I try and set goals with students and set several shorter term goals on the way to the major goal.

    Having said that I've never had a student stick around long enough to achieve their major goal. Don't they know it takes practise, desire and work to reach major goals?

    I charge a basic fee for the first session and then ask them to pay for 3 sessions in advance if they like it (this is generally discussed before the first lesson). This helps to get rid of cancellations and no shows.

    Edit: Just to add that I like teaching AC/DC riffs to rock beginners. Plenty of I, IV, V chords and pentatonics and fairly easy to play.
    Last edited by Liarspoker; 04-05-2016 at 02:58 PM.