Wille Thomas Jazz Language System Overview

[Boston Joe]

Have you got it to where you're moving it through ii v's going through different keys? That may help clear it up. Either way, it's just a name. Good luck!!!

No, I just started checking it out. The point is, the name "pentatonic pairs" hung me up right from the get-go. I had to spend a lot of time watching the vids (and then going back and rewatching earlier ones) and reading the materials to figure out that "pentatonic pairs" meant "pairs of notes derived from a single pentatonic scale" as opposed to "pairs of pentatonic scales". It doesn't help that the first thing he introduces is a pair of pentatonic scales.

I think the method itself looks promising. I just have a problem with the name. If I were teaching it, I'd mention that the note pairs were derived from the pentatonic scales, but I wouldn't call them "pentatonic pairs."

[MarkRhodes]

More importantly these "pairs" (which if I had to put into words) pull your ear to the next chord in the cycle

Dm....G7.....C
D-E....G-A...C-D-E (added third of the chord, thats the second step of his system)

This is crucial to Willie's way: the pairs create jazz melodies when lead through changes. In one of his books, Willie credits pianist Wynton Kelly with teaching him this. (I think they were both in an Army band at the time.) I'll see if I can find my copy of his "Making Music" to double-check this.

[matt.guitarteacher]

This is crucial to Willie's way: the pairs create jazz melodies when lead through changes. In one of his books, Willie credits pianist Wynton Kelly with teaching him this. (I think they were both in an Army band at the time.) I'll see if I can find my copy of his "Making Music" to double-check this.

He credits Kelly in something I saw as well.

[MarkRhodes]

No, I just started checking it out. The point is, the name "pentatonic pairs" hung me up right from the get-go. I had to spend a lot of time watching the vids (and then going back and rewatching earlier ones) and reading the materials to figure out that "pentatonic pairs" meant "pairs of notes derived from a single pentatonic scale" as opposed to "pairs of pentatonic scales". It doesn't help that the first thing he introduces is a pair of pentatonic scales.

I think the method itself looks promising. I just have a problem with the name. If I were teaching it, I'd mention that the note pairs were derived from the pentatonic scales, but I wouldn't call them "pentatonic pairs."

The main thing (to begin with) is that the notes are a whole step apart: C and D, F and G, for example (the 5,6, 1,2 of F).
If you went from F to Bb, the notes would be: F and G, Bb and C. (Three of the notes are the same! But now F and G are the 5th and 6, while C is the 2nd or 9th.)

If you hear a riff that works over all the changes of a blues (such as Ellington's "C Jam Blues" or "Happy Go Lucky Local"), it's a safe bet these notes are making the magic.

Lots of boogie riffs are built on these notes. (They usually have the third too.) Also, ensemble riffs can be made of them----this Benny Goodman tune has three of my favorite ones. They start at 2:22, right after Benny's clarinet solo. (An "ensemble riff" is a riff played by the band which is not the head nor a solo--it's arranged, simple, and punchy. Here it gives way to another solo.)

[edh]

A question: So to clarify(for me), to make a pentatonic pair the formula is always R, 2, 5, 6 of the key. Is this correct?

TIA, edh

[vintagelove]

A question: So to clarify(for me), to make a pentatonic pair the formula is always R, 2, 5, 6 of the key. Is this correct?

TIA, edh

more importantly look at a ii v I

Dm. G. C

look how the pentatonic scale fits over that

2-3...5-6...121 (or 123)

those little pairs link together to flow through the changes.

step two is you add the 3rd to each chord

234..567..123

then add chromatic passing tones

then diatonic vocabulary
then descending chromatic vocabulary
then playing the upper structure notes using what he calls the b7setup
then half diminished vocabulary
then diminished vocabulary
playing blues over changes in tunes (hello benson fans)


He does more but that is the core of his system. He does each of those "steps" over each standard. I'll see if I can find a video.

[vintagelove]

https://youtube.com/watch?v=QhUzwhNzPPI


Willie teaches how to play "On Green Dolphin Street"

[vintagelove]

Well I can't figure out how to post the video, a little help fellas

[vintagelove]

The video is exactly how he goes through each tune.

the first chord he plays (in relation to the chord) 56 121 65, 56 121

this is a great example of the sound of the pentatonic pairs. As mark pointed out, it's basically I Got Ryhthm.

Hope that helps.

[edh]

@V, thanks I think I'm getting a handle on this.

thanks

[destinytot]

Fantastic thread!

If I were teaching it, I'd mention that the note pairs were derived from the pentatonic scales, but I wouldn't call them "pentatonic pairs."

+1

[destinytot]

He starts out with pairs of notes a whole step apart. For example, C and D. Then F and G. Those four notes are the 5th and 6th, Root and 2nd of F. Since there is no 3rd or 7th, the pairs work over major (F maj 7), minor (F-), and dominant (F7) chords. Lots of riffy swing-era heads are built on these notes. "I got rhy-thm_" (in Bb the melody notes are: F G Bb C) "I got mu-sic" (C Bb G F) "I got my gal" (F G Bb C) and then the turnaround. Simple. Effective.

Then you add the major and minor 3rd. Then the seventh. Then altered tones....

Fantastic!

[destinytot]

Here is where I think you push too hard. I think Willie is a great player and teacher. But some people have OTHER good teachers now, so they won't sign up for Willie's site and that is no knock on anyone. (I'm enrolled at Jimmy Bruno's Guitar Workshop now; I'm not signing up anywhere else for now because my plate is full. Overflowing, actually.) And some people have learned how to improvise and just don't want to learn a new (-to them) system. There are many good teachers and many methods. If someone is doing well with one or another of them, good for them.

Some people may sample some of this, file it away, and check Willie out later.

My day job is within spitting distance of Berklee Valencia - gratuitous photo and video:

It's perhaps ironic that studying at Berklee is - er - 'beyond reach' (and not only for reasons of cost).

On the one hand, I'm quite content plodding along as I do (trying not to make the band sound bad on gigs). On the other hand, I have a lot to say musically - but not the knowledge and skills to say it all (... yet).

Fortunately, knowledge and skills can be acquired and developed.

I'm signed up to Richie Zellon's online course, which gives me a focus for consolidating fundamentals, and I take occasional Skype lessons. And, like others (probably), I've invested a small fortune in books over the years.

The right guidance and coaching makes a world of difference; I'm signing up for Willie's system, too.