My Whole-tone Journey

[pamosmusic]

I’ve never spent enough time getting into the whole-tone scale but I’ve been hitting a big Monk phase these last few weeks, so I decided to go all out.

Spent the last ten days or so playing three and four note sequences, ascending, descending, and alternating.

Ive been playing thirds this week, ascending descending and alternating.

I’ve been resolving those little patterns into some little miniature bebop lines, which has been fun.

Working on tunes I’ve been using a lot of triads with added notes lately, so I’ve been using an augmented triad with a #4 off the root of all my dominant chords.

we’ll see … and I will report back.

[bako]

Two cool things about the whole tone scale.

1. harmonically it is 6 dominant chords so any of those arpeggios derived from it, be they triads, 7b5 or 7#5, 9b5, 9#5 function for any of the 6

2. The other whole tone scale resolves to any of the 6 dominant chords and so is excellent approach chord material in fact any chromatic approach note is inherently part of the companion whole tone scale.

[Al Haig]

Whole tone is great. It's an essential color for me. It's easy to make patterns out of too. But then it's fun to try to make more linear ideas out of it incorporating some other notes.

[pamosmusic]

Two cool things about the whole tone scale.

1. harmonically it is 6 dominant chords so any of those arpeggios derived from it, be they triads, 7b5 or 7#5, 9b5, 9#5 function for any of the 6

2. The other whole tone scale resolves to any of the 6 dominant chords and so is excellent approach chord material in fact any chromatic approach note is inherently part of the companion whole tone scale.

Yeah, it's something I've always used in those sort of patterns descending by whole steps, or using on cycles so you can descend or ascend with the same pattern chromatically.

But when I compare it to how much I've really dug into major and melodic minor scales, for example, it's not even in the same ballpark. So I'm going to try to get in the ballpark.

[Mick-7]

Remember that the melodic minor scale has 5 out of 6 notes of a whole tone scale, starting from the 3rd of the mm scale. For example,
Db melodic minor (E-Gb-Ab-Bb-C), played over C7 has the 3rd, b5th, #5th, b7th & root, and over Gb7 it's diatonic + #4th(#11th).

I marked about 3 dozen whole tone patterns in my copy of Slonimsky's Thesaurus, so I may as well list them (there are undoubtedly many more).

Whole Tone patterns: #28, 54, 56, 64, 83, 90, 102, 113, 125, 132, 144, 167, 209, 232, 235, 244, 246, 283, 291, 295, 302, 304, 324, 326, 580, 582, 597, 601.

If you don't have the book, I posted a link to it in my Slonimsky Curiosities thread (post #1).


P.S. - Actually, most of the Slonimsky patterns are too obvious, adding diatonic passing notes will make the whole tone scale sound more palatable.

[ragman1]

Wholetone Journey

I like a man who doesn't do things by halves

[ragman1]

The wholetone scale can sound a little bare because of the same-size gaps between the notes. I think it has to be used carefully.

[John A.]

I’ve never spent enough time getting into the wholetone scale but I’ve been hitting a big Monk phase these last few weeks, so I decided to go all out.

Spent the last ten days or so playing three and four note sequences, ascending, descending, and alternating.

Ive been playing thirds this week, ascending descending and alternating.

I’ve been resolving those little patterns into some little miniature bebop lines, which has been fun.

Working on tunes I’ve been using a lot of triads with added notes lately, so I’ve been using an augmented triad with a #4 off the root of all my dominant chords.

we’ll see … and I will report back.

Just take it one step at a time.

[Jimmy blue note]

These tunes changed my life and listening these favourites over and over made it easy to bring these sounds to my guitar.

[James W]

This is the tune that springs to mind most immediately -

[pamosmusic]

These tunes changed my life and listening these favourites over and over made it easy to bring these sounds to my guitar.

Yeah baby. We love it.

Mine was 52nd Street Theme. I was learning it the other week and was in the bridge and was like … yeah I need to spend some time here.

My monk list is pretty simple now but …

Bluehawk
Blues Five Spot
Blue Monk
Straight No Chaser
Well You Needn’t
Monk’s Dream
We See
Lets Cool One
Think of One
In Walked Bud

Been learning them out of the Cardenas Monk Fake Book and trying to get as much of the piano (at least the right hand) as I can when I do.

[Mick-7]

Juju chart, don't know how accurate it is....

[wolflen]

Juju chart, don't know how accurate it is....

Thanks for this..Immediate application of aug and WT scales . Shorter harmony is sooo cool...

[Mick-7]

Thanks for this..Immediate application of aug and WT scales . Shorter harmony is sooo cool...

You're welcome, that chart is from the Spaces Vol.2 fake book. Wayne's tune Pinocchio also has a whole tone influence, lots of whole tone lines in Wayne's solos on it.

[Al Haig]

So did you hear all the whole tone in my Monk showcase and decide to make a thread?

[Bob_Ross]

The wholetone scale can sound a little bare because of the same-size gaps between the notes.

I would argue that that's its charm ...but that charm gets quickly diluted and tiresome if the surrounding harmonies are also purely whole tone-derived. The trick is finding ways to juxtapose whole tone material over more traditional tonal -- or more non-traditional, non-tonal -- musical fabrics.

[pamosmusic]

So did you hear all the whole tone in my Monk showcase and decide to make a thread?

lol not quite

[pamosmusic]

I would argue that that's its charm ...but that charm gets quickly diluted and tiresome if the surrounding harmonies are also purely whole tone-derived. The trick is finding ways to juxtapose whole tone material over more traditional tonal -- or more non-traditional, non-tonal -- musical fabrics.

… go onnnnnnn …

Gimme your favorites.

Basically I’ve used lots of symmetrical stuff over longer dominant chords and that sort of thing (rhythm changes bridge, G7 in Stella, etc) but trying to get used to integrating it more rather than leaving it just an effect.

[Mick-7]

As I said earlier, the whole tone scale becomes more palatable if you sprinkle in non-whole-tone scale notes.

For example....

[Al Haig]

lol not quite

I think so!

[pamosmusic]

I think so!

sure man. you are my alpha and omega.

[pamosmusic]

As I said earlier, the whole tone scale becomes more palatable if you sprinkle in non-whole-tone scale notes.

For example....

I like the whole tone sound. I think he was referring to finding places for the whole tone scale over different harmonies.

dominant is the big one, but I was interested in hearing what he was getting into.

[Al Haig]

sure man. you are my alpha and omega.

I thought we were just pals. :P

[Mick-7]

I've found that the only way I can get a particular sound into my playing is by improvising with it. So if I wanted to play more whole tone phrases, I'd take tunes, compose whole tone oriented phrases and solos for them, and write them down and practice them when necessary. Just keep doing that with various tunes and chord changes until I can make music with the scale in real time. If I don't work out an idea musically like that, it doesn't show up in my playing.

[wolflen]

I've found that the only way I can get a particular sound into my playing is by improvising with it. So if I wanted to play more whole tone phrases, I'd take tunes, compose whole tone oriented phrases and solos for them, and write them down and practice them when necessary. Just keep doing that with various tunes and chord changes until I can make music with the scale in real time. If I don't work out an idea musically like that, it doesn't show up in my playing.

Agree..the Shorter tune Ju Ju gave me alot of ideas... the two aug chords -- they are in the melodic min scales --E and Eb MM so there is alot of WT material there.

Also the six chords in both aug scales can be spring boards in some very hip melodic/harmonic lines.