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In my introduction I mention the didactic nature of the complete six suites, going from technically and musically (relatively) simple to complex. This seems to have been Bach’s plan. It was thought that just standard notation would reflect this best. Despite that, I play baroque lute music from tablature, as it was written, so I do not look down on tablature. And, of course, it would have doubled the amount of pages in what was already a large book.
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04-22-2023 05:07 PM
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Hi Rob, thank you!
Before I try may I ask what was your conception of arrangemnet: I mean since it is for plectrum guitar I believe that probably your transcritpion could be more like choosing anothe key for guitar rather than intensive harmonization of the pieces? So is it more about single-note playing as in orginal?
I am asking because recently I played through two complete arrangements for classical guitar - Yeats and Despajl (Despajl transcriptio was brilliantly performed by Petrit Cieku).
I would say that Yeats seems more conventional for classical guitar and Despajl is quite curious, he seems to approach an instrument from non-guitarist point of view using a lot of unxpected sonorities, impolying unsual range (mostly high range) and often quite uncommon fingerings (he is cellist forst of all).
Especially interesting his high range solutions which supposedly should change the colour completely but as a result the effect sometimes seems to me much closer to original than more conventional transcritions... he really hears guitar's sonic qualities in his own way and opens up something in the instrument. His transcritions also require very subtle resonance and dynamics control in my opinion otherwise they may sound awkward occasionally.
However I also played through original score and I found that both transcriptions have often very strange and very arguable solutions in respect of harmonization.
Besides, I noticed that Cello suites texture is predominantly linear and as it happens with melodic instruments (like flutes e.g) the harmony is realized mostly in lines (jumps from one voice to another, 'consequent' voice polyphony instead of simultaneous etc.), not in vertical constructions.
And in my opinion that makes transcriptions for harmonic instrument very challenging and in some cases even impossible: like famous Prelude form the 1st Suite that many guitarists and lutists play, to me it seems that despite seemingle simple arpeggio texture transcrition to lute and guitar dramatically changes the character of the prelude, first of all because of longer sustain of chordal notes that ruins very subtle and ambivalent motivic and plyphonic idea that is quite audible on cello even in poor performance and impossible to deliver on guitar even in great perfomance. Guitar makes this piece much simpler than it really is.
But in other separate cases the music fits guitar quite well.
It is also interesting that Violine Sonatas and Partitas are composed mostle using harmonic/polyphonic texture and therefore (maybe a bit paradoxally) they are easier to transribe to harmonic instruments - the texture involves in original a lot of vertical harmonic solutions.
At the same time I find that Cello suites fit guitar tone and range very well even in orginal with no changes except the key sometimes and sone transpositions.
Guitar baritone range can be very expressive in single note lines in my opinion and becomes somewhat similar to cello even.
Yeats transcription contains 'comparison score' after every suite where he put the original cello part trasposed in the guitar transcription key above the guitar arrangement.
That helps to see the arrangement changes very clearly but..... finally I ended up playing just playing the orginal in more comfortable key)
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As I mention in the introduction, I've played these suites on a variety of instruments over 30+ years. In that time I have seen many editions which are subjected to a personal aesthetic of the editor, which is plastered over all six suites, and not one of those editions did I agree with all the choices made. I also noted that over the years my own understanding of the works has changed as I grew as a musician, and I often would re-finger my early choices.
So, I had two main thoughts in mind when approaching my own edition: 1) do not impose a 'system' that I myself would inevitably disagree with in years to come, and 2) keep to the forefront Bach's didactic development over the span of the six suites. One of the most impressive things I have come to appreciate more and more over decades of returning to this music, is how Bach clearly conceived an increase in difficulty with each suite. You are meant to start with the entire first suite, then the entire second suite, etc, developing your technique and interpretive depth as you proceed to the final suite.
Also, an editor has to deal with the history and variety of interpretive editions by cellists and others over the entire span of sound recordings, and also an audience's expectations. In short, I could only please "some of the people, some of the time". But you can't let that influence your decisions.
So, to get to the point: I did choose keys that would work best on a regularly-tuned guitar. In the early suites I added a little fingering at key points, but that fades out by the end of the 4th suite. The point being that you might need a minimum of help early on, but should soon be making your own decisions - and those decisions will probably change when you return to the suites in a future year. This chimes, I think, with Bach's didactic plan and my personal experience of playing these works. There is no 'system'! These are living, breathing musical works that you can live with for decades, changing as you grow.
For those who take a stance that these works should only be played in their original key, I can only say that Bach certainly wouldn't agree with you. There is plenty of evidence that he changed keys when arranging this and other music for a different instrument.
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Thank you for detailed answer, Rob!
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Started working (again) on this book for my own musical pleasure. I quite enjoy this book because it is standard notation only and the notation is printed clearly and in a large readable font.
I find Sarabande 1007 to be not too difficult as a starting point. I also am dabbling in 1007’s Prelude.
Great right hand workout and yes sight reading practice made enjoyable.
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Good to know, alltunes! Keep at it, and these suites will be your friends for life!
Last edited by Rob MacKillop; 06-29-2025 at 01:50 PM.
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Added bonus: 1007 in the key of D lays out nicely on mandolin too so I get double use out of this book
Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
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Still thoroughly enjoying this book, it’s been sort of a summer project. The first dozen pages can keep one happily busy for a lifetime. I’ve been enjoying sight reading mostly 1007 one a little bit of 1008. Trying to memorize as many measures as I can. I find it quite relaxing.
Since I am new to Bach this might be a stupid question. When I listen to other people’s versions of the Cello Suites they throw in a lot of bass notes which are not in this book nor do I believe are they part of the original scores.
So does everybody plug in their own bass notes or are they using some type of widely accepted version?
Thanks
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Yes, alltunes, everybody adds their own bass line, or more probably they rip off someone else’s. I’ve given you exactly what Bach wrote, apart from a few guitar fingerings and just occasionally a note to fill in a chord. If you need to add a bass line, be my guest, but beware: Bach’s own bass lines in other works are individual and independent voices. To my ears new bass lines are not necessary, but you might think otherwise. Whatever you do, have fun doing it!
Rob
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Thanks for the quick reply. I like them just fine as they are! I suppose I was sort of curious as to why people feel the need to muddle them up with bass notes.
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Beats me!
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And I recommend this book for background to the suites: Amazon.com
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Yes that’s a great book. I love the bit where Casals thought his hand had been crushed beyond repair in an accident, and his comment was ‘thank heavens, I’ll never have to play the cello again!’ or words to that effect.
(of course he recovered and kept playing.)
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I completely understand his reaction!
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I purchased Rob's book and highly recommend it. It is wonderful music and well arranged.
Bravo to you Rob!
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Much appreciated, sir!
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thanks for the recommendation, Rob you’re responding to my post which I had to delete because it formatted weird anyway here is the book that I recently read about the Cello Suites
Amazon.com
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Coincidence?
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I would buy this book but my wife (who plays cello) forbids it.
She shouted at me for playing bwv996 the other day.
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Play them on your banjo and say it's bluegrass. Originally Posted by Christian Miller
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Yeah she’s already done that, and the Elgar cello concerto, which sounded fantastically dreadful. The banjo shares its tuning with the cello and is utterly unlike in every other respect lol. Originally Posted by Mick-7
Rob MacKillop can make it work, but he is an absolute mage, do you understand?
Apparently people played classical works on the 5 string back in the day, which is the modern bluegrass instrument, which is interesting because its tuning is much more irregular, and the tenor has a very sensible tuning unlike the guitar. But then you get the baroque lute and so on, which is tuned to an open chord… so
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I'll send you a cheque, Christian... Originally Posted by Christian Miller
For those interested in Bach on three tenor banjos, here I play the first suite on a regular tenor, the second suite on a cello banjo (same pitch as a cello) and the third suite on a gut-strung gourd banjo: Bach On The Banjo | Rob MacKillop ~ Musician
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Bela Fleck!
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As part of my rehab, I'm slowly reading through this book, and was appalled to see major oversight:
3rd Suite: I arranged it in E, which suits the guitar better than C. All was fine until I came to the last movement, the Gigue, which worked much better in D. I therefore wrote the Gigue out in D, and indicated for a capo to be used on the second fret...but that indication seems to have got lost between various drafts going back and forth to the proof readers. So, please write CAPO II at the beginning of the gigue, and while you are at it, drop the 6th string to D. There are passages that require the fifth string open as a pedal, hence the change of key.
I hope that's clear. Any questions, just ask.
Also Page 69, measure 13: the note before the E#should be c#, not d.
I've already raised these with Mel Bay, and they have changed the scores for the next print run. Any other errors, do let me know asap.
It happens.
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Thank you..will note changes. This book continues to provide musical joy. Originally Posted by Rob MacKillop
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