Tunes you like- Cool melodies vs Cool chord progressions...

[princeplanet]

I'm talking about Standards where a lot of the tunes have cool melodies but lame chord progressions, or vice versa.

Of course there are many where you like both, but personally, that's rare for me. I suppose I'm particularly interested to know which tunes do you love to improvise over because of the chords, despite not being too crazy about the head?

[mr. beaumont]

Nuages always drives me nuts...it sounds so good during the melody, and then I get into improvising and it's like "why bother, the best thing that could have been played over these chords was already played."

[AllanAllen]

I've recently come out of a Dunning Kruger valley and realized the head is usually the best sounding part of my playing.

[Banksia]

Ridin' High by Cole Porter


edit: I didn't read the O/P correctly. This song has very simple tune and chords but if you listen to the Ella version (can't remember which one, probably Ella sings Cole) you can hear a very cool song is the product.

[pingu]

i’ve got you under my skin

[Otterfan]

All the Things You Are has a terrible melody.

[Christian Miller]

All the Things You Are has a terrible melody.

it’s better in three

But yeah it’s like an exercise.

[grahambop]

Possibly that’s another reason for all the contrafacts written by jazz musicians (as well as to get their hands on some composer royalties). E.g. Tristano, Konitz and others seemed to be forever writing stuff on ATTYA etc., I guess they liked the changes a lot more than the melody, so wrote new ones.

Here’s a good one by Konitz. I didn’t know this tune until I saw Howard Alden playing it recently (which surprised me a bit!)

[AllanAllen]

I like ATTYA

[bako]

Yeah All The Things is not particularly expressive if you just play what's written but it has many wonderful recorded readings of the melody (jazz and otherwise) and none just play what's written.

[mr. beaumont]

Yeah All The Things is not particularly expressive if you just play what's written but it has many wonderful recorded readings of the melody (jazz and otherwise) and none just play what's written.

Hell, half of em can't play it right as written anyway.

[Bobby Timmons]

One where I like the melody but not the changes is Scrapple. I don't like the rhythm changes-y a section.. so I changed it! I hate rhythm changes.

One where the changes don't bother me but the melody and solo material give me fits are more straight up jazz blues tunes that are idiomatic to organ like chicken shack or midnight special. Something about the technique of the chordal blues riffs and the phrasing kills me lol. I'm more of a standards-y type guy. I'm still trying to get the hang of it tho. And still dying.

[Triple_Jazz]

There are ballads where I love the progression and the melody but do not like it as a vehicle for improvisation. Darn that Dream and Everything Happens to Me come to mind. Autumn in NY is one where I think all aspects work, but this is all my preference.

[Maroonblazer]

I hate rhythm changes.

What is it about rhythm changes that you hate?

[Bobby Timmons]

That they're quick and hokey sounding. It's tough to outline them but playing diatonically sounds lame. I like the bridge.

[AndyV]

With tunes that have changes that repeat in whole steps, like "How High the Moon" or Charles Lloyd's "Forrest Flower", the chord changes seem to dictate - or at least lead you a bit more - than tunes that don't have that kind of repetitive structure.

[John A.]

I'm talking about Standards where a lot of the tunes have cool melodies but lame chord progressions, or vice versa.

Of course there are many where you like both, but personally, that's rare for me. I suppose I'm particularly interested to know which tunes do you love to improvise over because of the chords, despite not being too crazy about the head?

ATTYA and Bluesette come to mind. Both pretty much just arpeggiate the changes and don't do much rhythmically, but are fun to solo over because of the root movement. There also tunes that I think are great compositions, but I don't enjoy as improv vehicles. I'd put Lush Life in that category, which I think is a great vehicle for melodic expression and interpretation, but I find it almost impossible to solo over. Obviously, John Coltrane does fine on it, but he might have been a somewhat above average jazz musician.

[John A.]

There are ballads where I love the progression and the melody but do not like it as a vehicle for improvisation. Darn that Dream and Everything Happens to Me come to mind. Autumn in NY is one where I think all aspects work, but this is all my preference.

I actually really like Darn that Dream as an improv vehicle. But in general 32-bar ballads can be a long and winding road.