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Binding bleed is very common on '58 & '59 historic Les Pauls with the red stained mahogany backs and necks using aniline dyes. Cherry red historic 335's too. Adds character to the guitar - just like the originals.
Google "Les Paul binding bleed" to see pics of old and newer Gibson's with binding bleed.
There's an explanation here
https://www.thegearpage.net/board/in...osts/23982422/Last edited by MaxTwang; 05-02-2017 at 12:05 PM.
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05-02-2017 12:01 PM
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For what it's worth, I read that thread, and I don't think "binding bleed" is what's going on with my L5. First, it's black, not red. Black. Second, it's not on the fingerboard binding, which matters because it's related (evidently, I'm no expert) to the way the mahogany is treated. But there is no mahogany on an L5 except the two thin lamination strips in the neck. Third, the binding stains are not under the clear coat, but definitely on top. I know this because a couple of little very superficial dings in the clear-coat on the binding (identified to me honestly by the seller) occur in the darkened area, and the binding is white in those spots. Fourth, the staining does yield somewhat to attempts to polish it out, but I'm aware how thin the clear coat is and decided I don't want to risk damage to it, since I never even notice it unless I'm looking for it. I never look at the guitar on the stand and say "Yikes, what's with that?" Last, the staining is at points where the guitar would have been in contact with a player's clothing, or perhaps in the case sitting in one position for a long time (???).
Originally Posted by MaxTwang
So I think it is some kind of contaminant that contacted the guitar either in the case or while being played, that somehow stained the binding slightly in a way that worked it into the clear nitrocellulose coat. Maybe some dye in someone's clothing who played it? Maybe a problem in the case?
At any rate, the whole "binding bleed" thing isn't what happened to my L5ces. I can find nothing about this guitar suggesting any problem with the wood, build quality, or finish. I have gone over it very carefully, and I also have two plans for the L5ces that I'm checking at the same time. I find this guitar to be a marvel of workmanship, a heart-stopping beauty, and it plays and sounds exquisite. It's all I hoped an L5ces would be, and I didn't hope for enough because it has exceeded my hopes. It has defects, however trivial, but it has come by its defects honestly.
So I do not think my L5ces should be considered an exhibit in the "Gibsons from 2013-1015 have problems" argument. The issues with mine are superficial and the result of some unpredictable event during use or storage.
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Lawson, IMO, that L-5 is in the right hands. May you have an incredible musical journey with her for many years to come.
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I expect you're correct on the cause - some combo of clothing dye and/or cologne, lotion, etc. stained the finish over the binding. Solvent based nitro is sensitive to chemicals, including those produced by, or used on, our bodies. Originally Posted by lawson-stone
That's a beautiful one of a kind L5 you have, the color is stunning.
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Lawson,
your guitar is no good. that binding bleed or whatever it is ruined it forever.
I'm PM'ing you my address so you can just send it to me and get it out of your hair.
'problem' solved.
I'm not a newer guitar guy but that's still the nicest modern 5 I've ever seen...
btw, have you tried some Virtuoso cleaner on the binding?
if it's just on top maybe you can remove it.
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Hey I'll send that right out. After all, I still have my Aria Pro II PE180... which... is a pretty decent player! Originally Posted by wintermoon
Seriously, yes, I've tried a little with the Virtuoso. I'm hesitant to apply the elbow grease, though, because I know that lacquer is a thin coat and I don't want to damage it. Maybe I'll try again.
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w/ elbow grease you could go down to the binding which isn't necessarily a bad thing imo.
back in the day Gibson used to scrape the binding after lacquering.
I have a guitar from the 20s and the binding is still white.
the only issue I could see is that if you go down to the binding it'll be white like the rest of the guitar, but over time the binding might not yellow in those spots. but I don't even know what type of nitro they're spraying with these days and how much it'll yellow.
if it did remain white in those areas, I'd probably rather that than the 'bleed' it would be less noticeable.
just a thought...
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I love hearing how happy you are with the L5, Lawson. Even though it wasn't the right guitar for me, I knew it was very special.
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I truly am delighted with it. I'm in two study groups that post video clips each week and I love seeing this beautiful guitar on those clips, the two dark streaks in the binding are hardly visible in normal use, and I love hearing this guitar even after YouTube has finished degrading the audio... Originally Posted by ThatRhythmMan
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OK, digressing. No bleeders with Natural.
For some inexplicable reason, I like the binding bleed on the back of lawson-stone's L5CES. It makes it feel...alive in a Japanese wabi-sabi way. It is also on the backside and who looks at backsides anyway?
There is a warmth to the way the colour bloomed and bled into the binding. I can sense the human being behind it; it is not environmental but human.
I guess that is why I like it.
It is a beautiful plum-red cognac burst. I like it and wish Gibson did more of it.Last edited by Jabberwocky; 05-04-2017 at 01:57 AM.
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The red aniline dye is fugitive. It fades after prolonged exposure to UV so, yeah, just leave it alone, maybe...
Pretty funny to read about guys buying their first Historic Les Paul and then going online to complain about the binding bleed after a fortnight's play. I don't care either way.Last edited by Jabberwocky; 05-04-2017 at 02:46 AM.
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Here in the states we might translate "wabi-sabi" as shabby-chic .... in some circumstances Originally Posted by Jabberwocky
OK, digressing. No bleeders with Natural.
For some inexplicable reason, I like the binding bleed on the back of lawson-stone's L5CES. It makes it feel...alive in a Japanese wabi-sabi way. It is also on the backside and who looks at backsides anyway?
There is a warmth to the way the colour bloomed and bled into the binding. I can sense the human being behind it; it is not environmental but human.
I guess that is why I like it.
It is a beautiful plum-red cognac burst. I like it and wish Gibson did more of it.
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The color of Lawsons L5 is my favorite guitar color that I've ever seen.
It really is the most elegant guitar ever made. We are happy for you Lawson.
And once again, based on my conversations with Vinny, we were in awe of you when you bought it. What a guitar..
Joe D
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Shabby-chic aka Grunge is so 90s. I thought that it went out with a fellow named Kurt. I belong to the era before that: Big hair, men wore make up, glitter and Dayglo Spandex. The 70s are roundly criticised as the decade that taste forgot but I think the 80s are the era that taste died. Miami Vice, anyone? Originally Posted by Bluedawg
Here in the states we might translate "wabi-sabi" as shabby-chic .... in some circumstances
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Music wise you may be right .... Originally Posted by Jabberwocky
My mom runs an antique store in Tennessee .... shabby chic is alive and well in that business
Here in Arizona it's "rustica" .... where people pay big bucks to make their house look like poor Mexicans live there ...
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It's just not old enough yet. My V necks and pastel blazers will be SOOOO cool, soon. You just wait. Originally Posted by Jabberwocky
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Frankly, I scared myself. I pulled the trigger on the purchase in a kind of daze, but I absolutely knew that I would not find such an L5ces in that condition, at that price, on such a trusted venue of sale as this forum, for a long time. Originally Posted by Max405
I love the color too, though I also love my two other L5-clone guitars for their color as well. Actually, the 70's burst of the Aria, kind of a faded cherry burst, is my favorite, though the traditional burst of the Elitist Broadway is also beautiful.
Still, the finish on this L5ces is not like anything I've seen before and I really love it.
Still agonizing over the possible sale of the Epiphone Elitist... I need to recover the cash, but I just love that guitar so much.
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Jumping in late here, so sorry if this has been addressed already. When you say 2013-15, are you implying that they corrected the problem (whatever the cause) around 2016?
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Ok I may have a answer on this soon.....btw the Crimson shop is back in business.
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Originally Posted by vinnyv1k
And there was much rejoicing .....
We'll have to see how the dealer situation works out ....
if I have to roll the dice with an internet purchase to get a Gibson .... that makes brands like Heritage and Campellone a little more attractive to me
Then again I'm well stocked with Gibbie archtops ... maybe a Tal Farlow is in my future ... but I'm just as interested in a Heritage Super Eagle
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Even fine guitars need some down time, just to chill and hang out, you know? Are you giving your guitars some unstructured time just to get in touch with their feelings, talk to their friends, read some books, and grow personally?
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The guitars are lovely, as one would expect, but it really warms my heart to see a home with a library.
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Originally Posted by Klatu
Next time I take guitar pictures, I'll put my Kindle next to them .....
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This is actually my office, but it feels like an extension of my home. Lotsa books at home too, but this is my workplace. Everything from Archaeology to ancient languages and texts to Zoom pedals and guitar stuff. Originally Posted by Klatu
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Hey Lawson, I'm curious, do your guitars reside at your office? Is that where you practice? I'm also a professor, and I can't imagine doing that! Originally Posted by lawson-stone
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