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I am sure the 6-figure guitars will find a buyer in the future. Rich folks always gotta do something with their money. The run-of-the-mill Gibsons and Epis and so on...even the nice ones...I'm not so sure.
Originally Posted by Stringswinger
What Will Be the Collectable Guitars of the Future? | Reverb News
I am rather pessimistic about antique collecting in general though, with some exceptions, as younger people tend to like shiny and sleek (mid-century), not big and ponderous, no matter how well made. The stuff I collect--well I'm pretty young for someone collecting that, and I'm in my 50's. I see very little interest among the general population of young people in such stuff.
As an aside a friend of mine lives in Germany and has been buying pieces for her newly-bought Victorian in Philadelphia. She has been buying piece after piece FOR A SONG. Even Jugendstil and Art Deco. She has probably furnished her entire house for less than $5000. There just is no interest there in anything older than 1960. I see it here as well.
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12-11-2020 05:47 PM
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Every generation develops an appreciation for fine craftsmanship, but unless people are raised with it that appreciation takes time to develop. When you're young, scuffling to get established in a career, to pay off student loans, to buy a house, etc., there isn't much time and attention left over for those things. It is usually a middle aged development to my observation. I think millennials are beginning to transition from their YOLO experience focus and towards more stable things. The houses on either side of us have sold to millennials, both of which were built before 1915, and I see them beginning to turn their attention.
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In the case of Mrs.k and myself, it was an empty nest opportunity to pursue other interests. With the kids grown and out of the house, there were a couple of empty rooms and that eerie silence and time and before you know it, dealers are asking us if we are in the antiques trade. "Not really," I would say. "We've still got a few square feet left." Originally Posted by Cunamara
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A common selling practice on Reverb seems to be starting with a very high price, waiting a few weeks for a buyer, and then cutting the price by a substantial amount: a fifth or a quarter. It might be worth waiting.
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Originally Posted by Litterick
.......Or, at least in the early Reverb days, starting with that high price, selling it for half, and then not recording the sale on Reverb at all.....CME did that with one I purchased.....
.......But for me, when you get to these high end instruments, ( the D'A's & D'Aq's ) and the 'usual suspects' dealers who sell them, final, accurate real money selling prices are hard to come by......all we're allowed to know as 'non-members' of the club is where the prices start..... yes there's the Reverb sold units category but individual instruments can vary - sometimes widely - due to conditions and repairs needed.....
.........I still remember that Guernsey 'auction' of the 'largest collection ever offered of classic archtops owned by ' etc etc.....members here who were actually in attendance had stories that reminded me of that old 'new guy at a poker game' expression: " If you look around the table and don't see the sucker, it's you".....
......MHO of course......and sincere good luck to members who are looking to own one of those classics !
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Doc, I get your point, but I disagree. Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
Many of the vintage Gibson's and Epiphones are out of this world awesome, and there are plenty of folks on the forum that own vintage guitars too. Maybe 'no interest' might be a little strong, and I understand the sentiment, but I expect there is 'some' interest.
Cheers, Steve
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The Gear Page has a notice posted outside its vintage section, which says, "If you don't like older and or collectible instruments, please refrain from posting your disdain!” The men who post incessantly about Eddie and Ozzy have no time for the past. They want bright and shiny PRS guitars and Two Rock amps. They want case candy. They want pedals.
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Give me an acoustic D'angelico with a Dearmond 1100 and twin reverb on low volume, it is a sound to be had. In the event you cannot procure a D'a then a Super 400 or an L5 will do the trick. The beauty of this set up is hard to describe but listening to Kenny Burrell when he used the D'a and always had a twin reverb, is all ear candy. In the event of a power failure, this is not a issue just start start playing lush chord melody. The very last thing you want to mess this set up with is a pedals really of any kind.
The price range for the set up really dictates your situation or practicality. It can go to maybe $50K for a the right cutaway D'a I suppose? But if you are really sharp you can get simply L7 non cutaway and probably not loose any of the electric sound. The key is the pickup and amp.........that being the dearmond and twin. This could easily be done for $4k.
I think the Gear Page would ban me right away from posting.
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Two quick points. One positive one maybe not so?
Visited Rudy’s a few years back in NY probably about 6-7 years ago by now and I got to walk in right off the street and ask politely to play a D’Angelico as I had never seen one in person and I was happily obliged and will always be grateful to be able to have experienced one.
I was just a young man in my 20’s who wouldn’t have been able to afford to repair any part of it if it was damaged. There was also no pressure and I just got to sit and play and experience a bit of history at my leisure. I’ve visited shops that lived on bottom of the barrel gear prospects and felt much less welcome then I was there.
As far as popularity of archtops and jazz while the music will always have someone to appreciate it in some sense I believe(people still enjoy and learn to play ragtime and renaissance lute music). But now being in my early 30’s I never met anyone else my age who knew about Wes Montgomery or Jazz guitar or knew much about the history of archtops at all. Gibsons are the guitar Slash plays but Benedetto, Monteleone not a chance of a glimmer of recognition. While I think there will always be people who appreciate the art form and some of the tools of the medium. And there are younger folks on instagram and youtube who play jazz guitar.
I don’t think there will ever be as large an interest as in the past but again how many high end archtops are consistently made now?
Its possible you may not need to worry about there being a point where there are a glut of instruments out there with no one interested in them and that’s a bit of a demand curve meets supply situation that should work itself out. Then there’s the possibility of more emerging markets if the planet Earth gets to continue to develop hopefully!
But I think as the generations two or three above mine pass away there may be a transition time where extensive collections start meeting the market and we’ll have to see what happens. I think it would be a fool’s errand to try and hypothesize where demand would be by then! I can’t help but think there should be someone there to appreciate them. And I’ve visited very kitschy antique stores from time to time and I’m amazed at how things once fashionable to collect can often sit and collect dust instead as the market to appreciate them fades. How much glassware or vintage tools or such can there be out there with folks interested? There are definitely some and especially for the more unique items. But there are whole stacks of empty coke glass bottles also going uncollected and unappreciated.
But I don’t think handmade archtop guitars ever had that kind of production volume comparatively(compared to coke bottles and glassware at least). It’s quite possible the small builder market will remain to serve their current clientele and whoever else younger remains interested in the future?
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Originally Posted by Stringswinger
I agree with much of what you say, There will always be a solid market for arch tops. Joe V told me that during the early months of C19 he was the busiest he's ever been. We know why.
Also, Gibsons, Epis, DA's will always move, assuming desirable model, shape, and price. Maybe not huge returns over purchase price but generally one would come out even. The years of enjoyment have a price too.
Interestingly, Campy's sell. And they move quick if priced right. Benedettos? Not so sure. I've watched them over the years. Can't figure out why.
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Agree. Also realize that there is a world out there of players and collectors. Not just the US. Originally Posted by skykomishone
I just parted with a 34 L5. Went to a collector in Italy. Bought it from Rudy and sold it for 30% more.
Have a D'A coming. My first. I'll hopefully cherish it and enjoy it during the latter stages of my life/playing career.
In the end, it's what we enjoy. History, tone, vintage, etc.
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he's added even more DA's a DQ and some Monteleones
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Monteleone 1994 Grand Artist #147 (First One Ever Built), excellent condition - $210,00 +$500 Shipping Originally Posted by wintermoon
Maybe one can negotiate free shipping....
I do love Rudy. He's been making me laugh since I first went into his store in 1975.
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Interesting interview with George Gruhn that is overall optimistic about collecting, but does point out that baby boomers have stopped collecting, and their collections will be flooding the market over the next few years, and that it's not a sure thing that young people today will be into (or have the means to be) collecting guitars.
Makers & Shakers: George Gruhn on the State of the Vintage Guitar Market – Acoustic GuitarLast edited by Doctor Jeff; 12-14-2020 at 09:43 AM.
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I remember those days well when I was knocking around NYC as an itinerant guitar player, and I remember Rudi's and Jack Sonni very well- in fact I bought a Roland tape delay from Jack that I still have! Originally Posted by neatomic
not to stray too far from the focus of our thread
mark knopfler (hot off sultans of swing) found rudy when he was still upstairs on 48th st...had rudy make him guitars and took rudys employee- jack sonni- on as a member/guitarist for dire straits! jack was a great guy as well
rudy! with knopfler and monteleone
cheers
Loved hanging in Rudy's and I met one of my best friends in NYC in there!
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I’m envious of you guys who were buying guitars cheap in the 70’s, relative to the cost of today’s guitars. I can only imagine my collection today had I been buying guitars from the 70’s forward.
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And started buying shares in companies like Apple--"An article in Fortune celebrating the 35th anniversary of the IPO noted that 100 shares purchased in 1980 would have been worth $632,800 by 2015 — not including dividends — for a gain of 28,663%." Originally Posted by 2bornot2bop
If I had only known then what I know now...
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I did have the opportunity to buy Microsoft in 1979 at $28 a share when I lived across the street from their first expansion in Kirkland, WA. Did I buy it? Heck no, I invested in cars instead. Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
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I did have Microsoft back in those days for awhile, also Pfizer. Quite a few that I owned and then sold and moved on. I was quite into investing back in the day...never made a big killing, but it was a fun hobby. I decided it would take too much time to study to make real money, and working an actual job was more cost-effective. Originally Posted by 2bornot2bop
I did have the opportunity to buy Microsoft in 1979 at $28 a share when I lived across the street from their first expansion in Kirkland, WA. Did I buy it? Heck no, I invested in cars instead.
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...I found a calculator - S & P / Dow ? ?.....Hopefully accurate
$1000. invested in January 1980, w dividends reinvested
Value in Dec 2020 $61,000.
Return per year of 10.88 %.......
So unless that $1000. Johnny Smith in 1980 is worth even $50K now, which of course it isn't, what's the better deal ??Last edited by Dennis D; 12-15-2020 at 10:54 PM.
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Hard to put a price tag on the enjoyment one might get with 40 years of playing the Gibson Johnny Smith. Other than making a profit from a sale, I have never enjoyed owning any stock myself, even back when they used to send me the certificates. YMMV Originally Posted by Dennis D
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