Selmer Guitars - Like wearing a costume?

TF · 02-09-2019, 03:04 PM

Thanks for the excellent replies, folks. Much insight and knowledge from the experienced musicians who have posted here - I appreciate it.

**BBGuitar** · 02-10-2019, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by archtopeddy

Yes, there's Trigger and there's Selmer 503.

A few years ago I watched a documentary on Django it was said that all his possessions were destroyed upon his death according to tradition.

**archtopeddy** · 02-10-2019, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by BBGuitar

A few years ago I watched a documentary on Django it was said that all his possessions were destroyed upon his death according to tradition.

I've heard that said before too, but to say ALL his possessions were destroyed upon his death, would be incorrect, and Selmer #503 is a clear example.

It is unquestionably the main guitar that Django played at the end of his life and considered by many the holy grail of "Gypsy Jazz" guitars.

Number 503 is one of the few Selmer guitars with "Django Reinhardt" written on the headstock and was used by Django almost exclusively from 1940 until his death in 1953. Django's son Babik played #503 after Django's death and in 1964 Django's widow Naguine Reinhardt donated it to the Musée de la musique, in Paris where it is periodically on public display.

**BBGuitar** · 02-10-2019, 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by archtopeddy

I've heard that said before too, but to say ALL his possessions were destroyed upon his death, would be incorrect, and Selmer #503 is a clear example.

It is unquestionably the main guitar that Django played at the end of his life and considered by many the holy grail of "Gypsy Jazz" guitars.

Number 503 is one of the few Selmer guitars with "Django Reinhardt" written on the headstock and was used by Django almost exclusively from 1940 until his death in 1953. Django's son Babik played #503 after Django's death and in 1964 Django's widow Naguine Reinhardt donated it to the Musée de la musique, in Paris where it is periodically on public display.

Ok I believe it could be real.
After seeing Les Paul’s “log” in 3 different music museums Ican’t help being a little skeptical.

**Easy2grasp** · 02-10-2019, 09:05 PM

I think if you stuck a fake pencil mustache on your upper lip, that would qualify as a Django costume along with a D-hole guitar.

**D.G.** · 02-11-2019, 12:56 AM

You can certainly play gypsy with other guitars, but they won’t sound quite “right”. Especially rhythm. Something about the construction of the Selmac style and the le Pompe technique just works.

**Jim Soloway** · 02-11-2019, 12:14 PM

Some nice "non-costume" use of Django-like guitars.

**Stringswinger** · 02-11-2019, 12:38 PM

Good examples played well are fine jazz guitars to be sure:

**archtopeddy** · 02-11-2019, 05:49 PM

There are many ways to approach a Selmer-style guitar. All the way from Stephane Wremble with distortion and a wah pedal to more conventional sounds like Christian Escoude in attached live YT clip... (Start at around 12:25 for a solo example although there are plenty throughout the clip)

It's the Indian, not the arrow as Stringswinger had noted earlier.

**Robertkoa** · 02-11-2019, 07:11 PM

Not sure...I think people will still recognize you.

**Roberoo** · 02-11-2019, 11:55 PM

Originally Posted by mr. beaumont

Which is crazy as the Ciganos are cheaper guitars, but I do think a lot of folks like them better...

But OP, if you can swing an Altamira, they're soooo cool. Now those oval hole models get it right.

And, something to look out for if you like the Altamira sound-- Manouche "Latcho Drom" guitars are pretty much the same guitars, but they have a fatter, more vintage style neck. If you like that sort of thing, they are awesome, and a used one could be quite budget friendly.

My Cigano D hole is a beast. People have come to gigs because the have heard other people say " you must hear that guitar" (not the guitarist unfortunately!). I love practicing straight jazz on it as it is so musical. Don't worry about posing - the guitars are good - get one if you can. I have a handmade Shelly Park and I am embarrassed to say I enjoy playing my Cigano just as much - no exaggeration....

**geese_com** · 02-12-2019, 12:41 PM

More examples of Selmac style guitars not used just for gypsy jazz:

**Gitpicker** · 02-27-2019, 09:30 PM

I hate to admit it but it is a little bit like a costume I suppose. I think one assumes if you own that type of guitar though that one can execute the technique required to make the guitar sound its best though. I play gypsy jazz as well as lots of non traditional GJ music on my Selmer style guitars and I love the sound. Obviously I have to really change technique when playing my Favinos then switching to the L5.

With my swing band sometimes I feel like playing acoustic, sometimes I want the electric sound so I play an electric. Just play what inspires you to play that day. When people hear the music start, it doesn't really matter what guitar is in your hands. My feeling anyway.

Here's an old video of us playing a Beatles tune in gypsy bossa. Not sure if it would make any difference at all if I was playing a flat top guitar

And here's a festival gig in Shanghai, I'm playing electric guitar. The suits we're wearing are kinda costumes I guess but not because of the guitars so much. So does it really matter much?

**ccroft** · 02-27-2019, 09:54 PM

I'd say it's more like a vestment than a costume. It has some power to it. I'd say the same for classic jazz played on classic jazz guitars. Don't discount it.

You know.... like, the witch-doctor does't put that crazy hat on just cause it looks good :)

**feet** · 02-27-2019, 09:56 PM

never really considered this. now i feel horrible for everyone who ever watched me trot out a gretsch or a byrdland and expected talent to ensue.

**mr. beaumont** · 02-27-2019, 11:38 PM

Originally Posted by ccroft

You know.... like, the witch-doctor does't put that crazy hat on just cause it looks good

Best thing I've ever read on this forum.

**archtopeddy** · 02-28-2019, 12:26 AM

One time at Djangofest, a fella had us all laughing. He told us that while looking at photos of Django, his wife wanted to know what all fuss was about Walt Disney. So there you go -- Play a Selmer, look like Walt!

**Robertkoa** · 02-28-2019, 12:31 AM

I don't know BUT - Some of the Guys who play 'real ' GJ explained to me that hearing it 'Live ' is a different thing than on Recordings because they are picking super hard ( even compared to fairly brisk
Alt Picking on a Gibson Acoustic etc.).
Are they picking much harder than Bluegrass Acoustic Players for example ?

And the dynamic range of the longer scale
of a ' real ' GJ Guitar with the dive bomb Kamikaze Rest Stroke Picking - would be much more than a costume - right ?

I can hear a kind of snarl the GJ Guitars have on Recordings - different from Flat top Dreadnought Acoustics- are they even more different sounding ' live ' ?

I am not really a fan of that Style ..[..harmonically , rhythmically ] I expect the younger Players [millenials] will branch out like Bireli did.

I think it would be more like a costume if they wore those Ronald Reagan masks like in the movie ' Point Break ' for some reason my mind went there ...(even though Coffee is the only drug I use)...

**D.G.** · 02-28-2019, 03:01 AM

Originally Posted by Gitpicker

And here's a festival gig in Shanghai, I'm playing electric guitar. The suits we're wearing are kinda costumes I guess but not because of the guitars so much. So does it really matter much?

Nice! I assume that's the Eastman FV? What amp are you playing through?

**Gitpicker** · 02-28-2019, 05:41 AM

Yes that's the Eastman/Thorell Vignola model. There's no guitar amp! I'm direct into the PA via a Sanamp Tech 21 para driver EQ/DI box.

**Alter** · 02-28-2019, 08:39 AM

I played one for a few years, in a gypsy jazz trio setting. I had difficulty in getting a good electric sound (playing with an AER and a Dtar equinox eq most of the time), finally managed it but it was very different from a standard acoustic. I wouldn't really use it for other styles, but others do with great results. Never could bond with the long scale although it has a sound that fits the particular music style in a great way. (There are some gypsy guitars built with standard scale length.., but if in Rome...

)

I remember meeting the Rosenberg trio in a festival, and they were using pickups, no mikes! Different sound, but i would imagine much easier to control on a stage. And of course you can always use an archtop, they also fit the style very well!