a GOOD preamp for plugging into PA

[joel65201]

My search on this subject turns up discussions all over the map, so apologies if this has been beat to death, but...

I do a straight, warm, archtop jazz sound. Fat bodied archtop through an amp like an Evans (closed back, clean) or my AI Corus (basically a straight PA, but in a cabinet that is designed more for archtops). On some more cramped gigs, it would be a lot easier to go straight into the PA. So this question goes to those who know how bad magnetic pickups sounds in a PA as opposed to a guitar amp.

Any recommendations for a small preamp that is designed to work with magnetic pups straight into a PA and not sound like crap? Not interested in multi-effect pedals.

Thanks

[medblues]

Budget ?

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[David B]

Hi Joel,
Options at three different price points for you:

Tech 21 Blonde: TECH 21 - CHARACTER SERIES

Kingsley Squire BF: Kingsley Amplifiers

Effectrode Blackbird: Blackbird Vacuum Tube Preamp | Effectrode

[sgosnell]

Not technically a preamp, but the GK MB200 might work. It's sold as a bass amp head, but it works well for guitars as well. It's small, light, powerful, and the XLR out can be switched between pre and post, to either send the guitar signal before or after the amp controls. I use the post position mostly, so I can use the amp's tone controls to get the sound I want. It also sounds very good through a small speaker cabinet, which you can use as a monitor if you prefer.

[ptchristopher3]

Tech 21 Para-Driver DI.

Do not worry about the “driver” part. It is a great direct box even for clean sounds.

The “Character” serious could be even better. But I mention what i know to be great.

[neatomic]

Not technically a preamp, but the GK MB200 might work. It's sold as a bass amp head, but it works well for guitars as well. It's small, light, powerful, and the XLR out can be switched between pre and post, to either send the guitar signal before or after the amp controls. I use the post position mostly, so I can use the amp's tone controls to get the sound I want. It also sounds very good through a small speaker cabinet, which you can use as a monitor if you prefer.

yes..any small footprint amp these days with an xlr output is capable of going direct into a pa...and will give you the choice of using a cab as well..more flexible than just a direct box

cheers

[Danny W.]

My search on this subject turns up discussions all over the map, so apologies if this has been beat to death, but...

I do a straight, warm, archtop jazz sound. Fat bodied archtop through an amp like an Evans (closed back, clean) or my AI Corus (basically a straight PA, but in a cabinet that is designed more for archtops). On some more cramped gigs, it would be a lot easier to go straight into the PA. So this question goes to those who know how bad magnetic pickups sounds in a PA as opposed to a guitar amp.

Any recommendations for a small preamp that is designed to work with magnetic pups straight into a PA and not sound like crap? Not interested in multi-effect pedals.

Thanks

I usually gig with an AI Corus, but I have an older AI Clarus SL-R that works well for this, and as a backup head (which I've never had to use for that purpose). It's two-and-a-half pounds and has an XLR output that sounds fine through FOH. On many gigs I'm just using the Corus as a stage monitor, so the audience is hearing the direct out through the venue's sound system anyway.

Danny W.

[ptchristopher3]

If you want to go completely “trailer park”, I have used nothing more than a Danelectro “Fish and Chips” eq as a direct to PA solution. The output impedance is far lower than the guitar - a good thing - and the EQ is more than enough to win the battle with the brother-in-law sound man at any venue - and make your guitar sound fine even though he has EQ’ed to make a piezo flat top sound good, in his opinion.

[Spook410]

IMHO the best made is the Grace Designs Alix. Expensive at $625 but worth every cent.. Has great EQ and filters designed for guitar, boost, 500Ma/9V pedal power, and the best input stage you'll find. I run archtops with Armstrong hand wound and Sunrise pickups through it's big brother the Felix. Grace Designs makes amazing stuff.

[joel65201]

Folks, I really appreciate all of these very good and quick replies. I have a few things to look at closely. I'm fine with expensive to "trailer park" if it sounds good. THanks!

[feet]

if the alix is a little much for you, i've been using the fishman platinum pro eq and i have been very pleased with the litany of sounds it offers and the litany of solutions that are built in. cme will accept an offer of $200 on reverb, which is a steal. i primarily use it with my electrics into a vox these days, but i did buy it for use with acoustic and line array amps and it works just as well for that.



analog eq with sweepable mids, boost, tuner, compressor, di, feedback notch filter, high pass filter and more. this, a zoom ms70 and a telefunken di is my entire pedal board for acoustic and archtop playing, into a line array or amp. heck, i don't even need the second di, but i can split it into different amps. very highly recommended.

[Frank67]

I think that probably even more important than the preamp is a good speaker simulation. The Torpedo CAB comes to mind. It is expensive though. The Mooer Radar also has Impulse Response capabilities, is tiny and will only set you back 140 bucks or so. Combined with a decent preamp, this will sound great with a PA. The IR’s are much better than the speaker sims that many pedals have and that, for the most part, just cut some high frequencies. High quality commercial IR’s can be loaded, e.g. from Ownhammer.

Kingsley is great, but they are manufactured by a single man with a huge waitlist. I got on it last spring and I still haven‘t heard from him. There are many other companies including Tech21, AMT, Torpedo, Mooer, Seymour Duncan etc.

The alternative is full amp modeling. This has come a long way. The Kemper profiler (not really modeling), Axe Fx and Line 6 Helix are all considered to be top notch with different strengths and weaknesses.

While todays technology makes it easy to get a great and authentic sound to the front of the house, I have to confess that to me nothing beats the ‚amp in a room‘ feeling.

[Spook410]

.. fishman platinum pro eq and i have been very pleased with the litany of sounds it offers and the litany of solutions that are built in. cme will accept an offer of $200 on reverb, which is a steal..

These are like $300 on Amazon. Seems to be a pretty good deal.

[BigToe]

Along with my Kingsley Jester I use a Logidy EPSI for IR cab sim. Makes a huge difference toward sounding like an actual guitar amp and cab. This setup gets a lot of different tones from different levels of clean to OD. Maybe too much if you’re going for just one sound.

[newsense]

I think that probably even more important than the preamp is a good speaker simulation. The Torpedo CAB comes to mind. It is expensive though. The Mooer Radar also has Impulse Response capabilities, is tiny and will only set you back 140 bucks or so. Combined with a decent preamp, this will sound great with a PA. The IR’s are much better than the speaker sims that many pedals have and that, for the most part, just cut some high frequencies. High quality commercial IR’s can be loaded, e.g. from Ownhammer.

I agree with Frank. A cab simulator has recently become the most important pedal on my board. I play a lot through phones and direct recording to a PC and have had a two year battle to counter the unmusical, high frequency fizz that accompanies even the mildest of overdrives when not playing through a real guitar cab. Even some highly respected digital amps (e.g. Boss Katana) do a miserable job of cab simulation through the line out or phones out. A cab sim is proving to be the answer for me.

The Torpedo is expensive, so I considered the Mooer, but actually bought the relatively new Digitech CabDryVR (see what they did there ?) (CabDryVR | DigiTech Guitar Effects). It is a very good budget-friendly solution for tailoring a cab-like response after a preamp and before going direct into a PA, phones or recorder. It has several cab-types on board and claims to model impulse responses. Plus you can continuously vary the "depth" of response, which is allegedly related to the physical size of the cab. It also has 2 channels so can be run in stereo. I'm using it after a Joyo American Sound, which is supposed to include cab simulation, but on its own doesn't banish the fizz of slightly overdriven sounds.

[feet]

These are like $300 on Amazon. Seems to be a pretty good deal.

right? they are three hundred everywhere. cme had some listed for less than that, I sent in an offer and they countered with $200. one of the more significant pedals I've purchased. I bet the Felix and Alix are great, but that is a huge difference and this does more. being battery powered and letting me build a sparse board for easy travel was huge for me.

as far as ir's go, I haven't felt the need. I doubt they make things worse but I get plenty nice tones right out of the pa. I use them for recording, though. gotta have them for that. I suppose that proper eq and the speaker/ box that a PA supplies is sufficient. one of the benefits of the more involved eq is being able to compensate for a speaker you don't love. I know it has saved me a few bucks with speaker and pick up swaps.

[jorgemg1984]

You do need a cab emulation (and reverb). I would use a Logidy EPSI pus a preamp plus a reverb pedal (or a multi-fx from Zoom, in my case). For preamps, the Kingsley Squire should be hard to beat. Good luck!

[joel65201]

if the alix is a little much for you, i've been using the fishman platinum pro eq and i have been very pleased with the litany of sounds it offers and the litany of solutions that are built in. cme will accept an offer of $200 on reverb, which is a steal. i primarily use it with my electrics into a vox these days, but i did buy it for use with acoustic and line array amps and it works just as well for that.



analog eq with sweepable mids, boost, tuner, compressor, di, feedback notch filter, high pass filter and more. this, a zoom ms70 and a telefunken di is my entire pedal board for acoustic and archtop playing, into a line array or amp. heck, i don't even need the second di, but i can split it into different amps. very highly recommended.

I thought i saw somewhere that this is designed for piezo equipped guitars which, of course, already have an eq. No?

[Papawooly]

Kingsley is great, but they are manufactured by a single man with a huge waitlist. I got on it last spring and I still haven‘t heard from him..

You may need to "ping" Simon... My Kingsley Squire D (clean Dumble sound) was ordered on 12/16 and it arrived, 6/17, so about a 6-month wait.

Great preamp!

[medblues]

It's not a classic multi-effects pedal so I will remind you about the Line 6 Pod 2.0, they are very practical and adaptable into many scenarios into a PA or power amp. $50-130 any day of the week. I still use mine in spite of having a real tube-based preamp pedal (Damage Control Womanizer), Line 6 HD500X, TC Electronic Mojomojo, Fishman Platinum ProEQ etc etc

It looks like it is still being sold as new at Sweetwater so I find that very interesting and think it may be because of its utility.

[redwater]

The Boss GT100 works fantastic as a preamp, but it does so much more...by the way it is one of the few modellers that pairs well with archtop guitars.

[feet]

I thought i saw somewhere that this is designed for piezo equipped guitars which, of course, already have an eq. No?

i don't know. i know it has an input trim to accommodate active and passive pickups. maybe that's what you mean?

i don't know what the design intent was but i have used it in front of tube amps, solid state acoustic amps and pa's with both electric and acoustic guitars, featuring magnetic, floating, piezo, internal mic and soundboard transducers. always sounds awesome. i can get a great tone quickly and it is surprisingly easy to operate.

[lawson-stone]

I like the DV Micro50 and my old model still has the XLR out. That's what I've always done.

[jads57]

BOSS - FDR-1 | Fender '65 Deluxe Reverb

[Doug B]

Hi Joel,

Kingsley Squire BF: Kingsley Amplifiers

FYI: The kingsley product has a huge waiting list-I think it's something like a year or more long now.