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02-09-2018, 10:35 AM #1Dutchbopper Guest
What I have been asking myself for years is why on earth people are buying new Gibsons? For 4-5k (ES 175) you can actually have a great vintage guitar from the 50s. For the price of a new L5 you can buy just about anything vintage ...
I should not only be referring to vintage really. A good late 60s, 70s ,80s or 90s 175 (they exist) will be WAY cheaper than a new one. I am not talking about CME blowouts of course. Heck, for under two grand you can have an ES 125 that will blow away just about anything in the Gibson laminate department today.
I don't get it. I have never bought a new archtop in my life and I never will. I don't like shiny new guitars much and I kind of like guitars that have been played for a number of years and that have outlived quality issues.
So, what's the attraction of a new guitar?
DB
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02-09-2018 10:35 AM
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I think you answered your own question by stating what you don't like. Some people like new and shiny things. They make it become their own over the years and every eventual ding and scratch, etc is their own. They make their own history of the guitar.
Originally Posted by Dutchbopper
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My best guess is that, for some, it's only truly theirs if it doesn't have a history. Perhaps the thought that someone else owned it previously makes it sort of "icky", like wearing second hand pants. Also, people tend to be unduly attached to the idea of a warranty. Thirdly, hunting down a great old guitar takes work, whereas purchasing at the local guitar emporium is easy peasey.
Personally, I'm with you. "New" just doesn't have any special meaning to me. I just want a good product at a good price. This goes for guitars, amps, pedals, (some) clothes, houses, cars, furniture, whatever. (When I was younger, I was amazed that people would go to the local furniture store and buy pressboard junk that would lose 90% of it's value immediately when there was all this beautiful solid wood antique furniture available for the same price that would at least maintain it's value and exuded cool history.) And what could exude more cool history than a 50s Gibson archtop !
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I tried to address the same issue on one of the other recent "Gibson wars" thread. The comment was just shined on.
I am all for used "like new" or close. I will put all the miles on the thing fairly quickly to make it more mine than anyone else's anyway. I don't really want anything that is beat to hell, but I have had guitars like that previously - a old beat up Gibson J-45 and a beat up Martin 00-16. They are gone now though. I do regret not having the J-45. I just purchased my first Gibson in about 25 years - 2013 ES-390 that was hardly played. Glad to be back. Excellent design and construction IMHO.
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Yeah, I bought both my Gibsons used, both actually for €1100 each (‘50 ES-125 and ‘05 ES-333). No way I’ll spent 4-6k for a new Gibson!
But I hardly ever buy new guitars (my €250 Ibanez being the exception
. It’s out of principle. I have a good day job so money’s not even the issue. It’s just that a guitar is a tool to do the job and I am already being silly for wanting a vintage tool of a renown American brand.....
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I have not bought a new guitar in many years. There are so many great used ones to choose from at a lower price. Praise to the internet.
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Why on earth people are buying new Gibsons?
I totally get your points about preferring used instruments but buying new does make better sense in some cases.
I bought a brand new Gibson because it was the exact guitar I wanted, unique in many ways and difficult to find used.
I never thought I'd buy a new guitar, especially online but it turned out to be an easy choice really.
The Musicians Friend Special Reserve guys were really great to work with and I knew I could return the guitar if I didn't like it. (I love it dearly by the way).
I live in NYC so my other options to find this particular guitar would be to either scour local guitar stores here and hope someday one turns up somewhere or I could have tried my luck not getting ripped off in the shady Craigslist or Ebay world. No thanks...
Used makes sense when you can sit down and compare similar guitars but sometimes new is the best choice.
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Very true, especially if you can't find a used one in the config you want. Originally Posted by gggguitar
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I have never owned a new car and mostly buy used guitars. Other people like to buy new. We all have our reasons. I used to think that old Gibsons had a special mojo that new ones could never have, but the two VOS Gibsons that I bought as part of the CME blowout have changed my mind about that.
People like different things. There is often no right or wrong answer to many questions. Questions like "Should you buy Gibson Guitars new or used?".
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Bottom line for me is, if the guitar plays well and sounds good, and "speaks to me" I don't care if it's new or used.
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There are several Gibsons I'd love to own someday...ain't none of them new.
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I can't really afford Vintage instruments and I am not keen on gambling on getting a green wood brand new Gibson that is just warranty for 1 year in Canada. I do the best next thing in my book which is to buy a good '90s instruments that had time to set in and shows its flaws. These '90s instruments are not considered vintage so they are affordable for me.
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The used guitar market is unscrupulous, overpriced and ridden with flippers and internet thieves. Most people would be wise to avoid that.
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I don't think I've bought a new guitar in the last 25 years. I love vintage, and almost all have been in great condition.
Re' cars--same thing, but my last car (Subaru WRX) I bought brand new with an extended warranty, because I was tired of getting nickle and dimed for repairs on my used BMW. You can imagine my disgust when it got near-totaled in a hailstorm...
Seriously, I think the main reasons to buy new are getting exactly what you want, and warranty. Thank gosh I've never had to deal with a used guitar having a manufacturing problem, but if you buy new you can argue with the seller and hopefully have the company to back up the product.
That said, with guitars, unlike cars, you can play one and generally within 5 minutes know if you've gotten a dud or not.
<knocks on wood> I've never had any bad experiences with used guitars even bought on Ebay or with used cars.
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And there's a downside as well... Originally Posted by icr
(Hat tip to Hunter Thompson...)
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The best Gibsons I've played were made in 1928 and 2016. So I'm not sure what definitive lesson can be learned from my experience. Luckily I own both examples.
Can we talk about something besides the non-musical aspects of Gibson guitars? Sheesh.
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I've bought few new gits, maybe 10 or so and all were impulse buys where the stars and planets aligned just right where I had a credit card with zero balance, something really caught my eye, and the price was right.
I feel more comfortable buying used, because "generally" if it's functional to that point in time it's likely to continue to be so. I'm also not a condition freak so boo-boos, oops, F@#K and damn its are not a big deal, other players missed wonderful gits due to their quest for perfection. Also I'm attracted to "odd birds" like the Gibson Vegas, and Howard Roberts, and Pat Matrino that are unusual and not likely to be in the hands of everyone.
On the down side of used, the PO may have changed parts (I generally like stock gits) but, OTOH if the PO installed 57's or MHS pups in say an Epi, Ibanez, or Eastman I'm OK with that. A PO may also have concealed an issue unlikely to be found till you do something like change strings and found the truss rod minimally effective or you play at a louder volume than you normally do and get horrific feedback. So far I've been fortunate in avoiding issues.
After all is said and done, of the many GR8 used gits that I have owned I'm FAaaarrr more likely to buy used as in the long run new may be more likely to present quality issues, and depreciate in value should I decide to sell it sooner than later. Recent CME deals regarding depreciation are not included.
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I have researched this extensively, purchasing 3 used and 2 new Gibsons.
I still have not reached a reliable conclusion, and so have decided I need to do more research. Maybe a Tal Farlow, or an ES125, or an ES275, or ...
I love research!
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Tal Farlow, Tal Farlow, Tal Farlow..
JD
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Hey, somebody has to buy the new stuff or else they'll quit making 'em!
With used guitars I often find myself wondering "if it's so great, then why are you selling it ?!?"
Not every time, but sometimes.
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I would buy a new Gibson...
... If I could go back to 1959 and get an L5 for $700 or so...
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I have a 50s Gibson L-7 and 60s ES-125 and ES-175 and all of them I got from widows. With the L-7 I also got the deceased sheet music. While I never heard this man play, I assume he was 'good' based on the alternative chords he wrote on the sheet music. So I got a vintage guitar with guitar lessons! Originally Posted by Longways to Go
Hey, somebody has to buy the new stuff or else they'll quit making 'em!
With used guitars I often find myself wondering "if it's so great, then why are you selling it ?!?"
Not every time, but sometimes.
I was able to use each guitar for a few days and 'test drive' it. We would go to a Music Store with the agreement I pay 10% more than the store would pay. That was fair to all involved. (the store mark-up being at least 50%).
I guess I've been lucky, but I plan on returning the favor. Each of these guitars are already willed to younger jazz guitar players I know, and my wife loves this idea. I.e. I know she would carry out my wishes.
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Because archtops don't show up used that often locally and I'm yet not ready to buy abroad on ebay.
For the last 5 years I've only seen one or two es175 locally and they where on sale for 2400€ which is too much for a used guitar (I don't think they sold)
I was lucky to find a '97 PM100 for 1350€ that I cherish. There was both a 60s barney kessel and a L5 somewhere in the 3000€ area, but at unlucky times, where I didn't have the cash. Plenty of non-cutaway es125s tho.
But yeah .. after a while that new figured burst ES175 priced at 3500€ starts looking tempting .. especially since you know you can talk the price down a bit.
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I've bought dozens of used guitars since the late 70's. Locally, dealer mail order, and then the internet. In all those years I only had one really bad experience, and that was due more to the seller's naive ignorance than deliberate unscrupulousness. Maybe I ask the right questions, maybe I've been lucky. Originally Posted by icr
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I bought my blonde 2003 L5CES brand new in 2003, had to order it half a year in advance and the deal was that i didn't need to buy if i wouldn't like it.
When it arrived at the importer i took my 1970 L5CES to the showroom, compared the two guitars intensively and found that the 2003 although not even 2 months old was an improvement over the 1970. I didn't play it too much for the first three years as the sound hadn't mellowed yet, but i could tell that it was going to be great.
And here we are, it became my most loved guitar, all my other archtops have to withstand comparison with this one. The reason why i bought it new was that there were simply no blond used L5's around. If there had been, i certainly would have considered buying used, but who knows. I do not regret having spent the extra money as it became such a great guitar.
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