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Danny W could write a history book on all the Gibson archies that have been through his hands and I would buy it!
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10-12-2025 09:54 PM
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I have been playing professionally for my entire adult life, thousands of gigs, so I tend to view guitars as tools that have to do the job.
I would think that most people who post on guitar forums don’t fit that description. So they go along with the majority opinions and consider themselves experts on guitars on the basis of what they’ve read.
Anybody with a history of buying and selling vintage guitars will tell you that some are special and most are average.
I’ve owned (and sold) many vintage guitars, including some mediocre ones that are now worth a fortune. The guitars I play now are all “vintage”, but so am I. After a lifetime of trading up, they’re all special.
But I could do a gig just fine with any decent guitar.
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And again there always some stellar guitars both new and old that ring like a bell. My problem is when did an average old Fender Tele or Strat become worth more than a seriously built,hand carved Archtop?
One is a basic plank,or upgraded one. As opposed to a person who spends way more time and has infinitely more luthier skills involved.
And I understand the allure, but even a modern Toyota Camry is more pleasurable to drive daily as compared to a 1950’s Hot Rod,Lol!
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When rock n' roll became popular.
Originally Posted by jads57
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I remember that in the 70's, a pre CBS Strat or Tele cost a bit less than an L-5CES or a Non-cut D'Angelico Excel from the same era (Especially the Teles). Rock music had been more popular than jazz for quite some time. IIRC, it was around the mid 90's that Pre CBS Strats became more valuable than the archtops and by the early 2000's, the Telecasters joined the Strats at those high prices. Pretty much about the time that Boomers hit their peak years to spend disposable income. Originally Posted by Mick-7
A great pre CBS Strat or Tele is a great guitar, but so is a great vintage L-5CES or a DA Excel. Demand being what it is, the planks are more valuable. IMO. vintage archtops are still a good value, vintage Strats, Teles and Lesters are too rich for my blood..
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So along those thoughts, it’s really about resale $$$$$$$ Value!
Again Leo Fender was trying to offer a solution to the musicians who needed a cheaper cost alternative for I believe it was $16 in parts in 1948.
And then Gibson with Ted McCarty got in the game,albeit a bit more refined. I believe he was worried about using the Gibson name on the headstock originally.
Thus came the Les Paul Signature silk screened.
And please don’t get me started on their worth over an Archtop or Hand Carved Archtop.Lol!
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Interestingly, Fenders first guitars had no truss rod with Leo thinking that if a neck warped or the frets wore out, a player would just buy a new neck. That turned out to be a bad idea when necks warped while still being offered for sale by his dealers. Fast forward to today and it is actually cheaper to buy a MIM Fender replacement neck than it is to have your Fender guitar re-fretted here in the USA. Originally Posted by jads57
In this whole discussion, we need to differentiate guitars being bought as tools to make music and guitars being bought as rare, collectible art. I think both are equally valid reasons to purchase a guitar. Though if you are looking to speculate on something for a profit. I submit that securities, real estate and precious metals are a better bet than guitars.
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I’ve tried doing that on both posts here and as well at TGP. I definitely see the difference and motivation. But as a musician again I’m not greedy,Lol I got used to being underpaid for a living.
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For some unknown to me, my browser recently started blocking me from accessing The Gear Page
I've tried different browsers to no avail.
The good news is I've been spared viewing all of the silly, petty, ignorant, ridiculous discussions related to music and musical gear.
Amazing!Last edited by Gitfiddler; 10-13-2025 at 03:00 PM. Reason: clarity
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Again, the vintage forum on TGP is for discussing the vintage stuff, not for debating whether they are any good, exceeded by modern guitars, etc. There are other places where you can debate that stuff. Originally Posted by jads57
Sure, any guitar player can be professional for a lot less than vintage guitars go for. But if new ones are so much better, then why do so many guitar players focus on vintage or older guitars for their sound? Because they believe they are getting that last 5-10% out of a them. And I totally get that, a really good vintage guitar can often do that. I'm sure most of us have heard Julian Lage playing his '54 telecaster, now mostly replaced by a replica. You should search out the Youtube video of him playing a '50's gold top LP, it might be his best sound. Peter Bernstein is totally about one guitar, which, while not strictly vintage. is an older handmade guitar with a vintage Gibson pickup. So there must be something in it, for some players.
Regarding the so-so vintage guitars out there, I wonder where they all are, because I have not played many of them. Usually they are in need of a good set up, new frets etc. Some are just plain worn out though. Most of the ones I have played are in private collections put together over many years, so maybe they got all of the good ones.
BTW, I got most of my old guitars when I was an underpaid player- I was just lucky enough to be able to keep most of them! Some people are just into flipping guitars for the sport of it; I have a friend who has been through an entire collection of great vintage guitars- and then traded them all away! Now he just has mostly run to the mill guitars.
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Well sorry to disagree with the above post. But as a player I have found better reissues than just about any vintage guitar I ever owned or tried. Amd for me that also goes with recent Phillip Wharton, Jamie Culbertson Gibson Archtops.
I kid you not saying I’ve owned and traded over 500 guitar from age 13 to currently 68 years of age. I’m actually not proud of that fact.
But again remember these vintage guitars were not the ridiculous prices they fetch in the last 20 years.
The good news is they spurred Gibson and Fender to make some seriously new great reissues. Especially in the last 10 to 15 years.
The consistency between them is much better.
And again sure old wood is dried out more,and therefore lighter in weight.
But the real test of any good guitar especially electric solid bodies.
Do they ring out acoustically and can I actually bring to a gig without a Bodyguard,Lol!
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Well, maybe if I went out and played telecasters and Stratocasters for a few wmonths I would find some that beat my old ones, but I doubt it, and I don’t have the time! I do sometimes think about moving them on, but then I play them. And no, over many years they have never been beaten by any that I have played. And I played those old guitars in bars for years without a bodyguard. You probably don’t need one if you ever played baseball and can swing a telecaster.? Originally Posted by jads57
I agree that Gibson and Fender have finally been spurred to make good guitars again. I’m not sure about the consistency, especially Gibson. I have yet to play a 335 that gets me to open my wallet for instance.
And BtW, I am totally happy with recent arch top builds that I have acquired. So I’m not totally addicted to the old ones.
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My point in making this thread was only to speak truth to mythology. Easy to make up stories when many are not able to try many vintage pieces for themselves.
I can see why the Wizard of Oz is on to every year.Lol!
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TGP is only a good place to lurk around when you need a good laugh.
As to vintage guitar related stuff, the fact is most of vintage guitars are already declining in value post Covid after adjusting for inflation, so the owners of them don't anyone tell anything negative about their prized possessions, which could contribute to decrease in value even more.
There is one member on TGP who ALWAYS magically appear whenever someone posts not so favorable comment to vintage guitars, which is hilarious. I'm sure that guy is a vintage guitar dealer, or a flipper.
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They are obsessed with finishes and bobbins on that forum.
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Sadly, i think this ship has long sailed.. Musicians today are priced out of vintage gear, unless you're rich. Pity that all these great guitars and amps end up not being played, but it is what it is. In the end Bonamassa will buy them all!And again this is pertaining to their actual use as a musical tool,not an investment strategy perspective.
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We are living in a time when people are no longer judged simply on their talent and abilities alone. But also by their acquisitions as well.
And while this has always happened in the past, it never seemed to be as prevalent as it currently appears to be.
Im guessing it’s due to social media explosion, as well as narcissistic tendencies,Lol!
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Regarding TGP specifically, it’s a turf war over there with a lot of trolls patrolling the boarders.
The reason the vintage sub forum was created was because you couldn’t talk about vintage guitars positively in the ‘guitars in general’ forum without it immediately devolving into a caustic argument about old guitars being crap and overpriced etc, etc etc. It was brutal for anyone who wanted to just chat about vintage in a positive way…
If you encounter a strong police-state vibe in the vintage section it’s because people tend to aggressively protect the space from that type of conversation topic. As was mentioned above, probably best to have that convo in the guitars in general section. Everyone there is just sick to death of that same topic so they will shoot it down immediately. It is what it is.
That said, I think most folks there in a one on one convo would admit modern guitars can be quite good especially if you are talking about them pragmatically as tools to use live or in the studio.
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As a tool you can buy a Campellone guitar and I believe it would work as good as an Original D'angelico New Yorker from the early 1950's. The question to me is not if one is better than other but what else is in the picture? If you can afford it and want it the original DA is cool but frankly a Campellone is cool too, it is all about this thing called supply and demand. There are guitarist spending money to buy new guitars that are "relic'd." I cannot understand this at all and makes no sense to me when I buy a new guitar I want it to look new and shiny. Originally Posted by Marker
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I myself don't spend much time at TGP, having little interest in electrics. But a couple of years ago, I caught a discussion of what turned out to be about a 1945 Epiphone Triumph, found by the OP, cheap, at a yard sale in California. In terrible condition, in pieces, obviously stored and forgotten for years in very damp conditions, the OP was unsure what to do with it.
After back and forth discussions, over a year, and selling the Dearmond FHC which came with the Triumph(to cover his purchase), the OP gave me the Triumph: I'm a full time luthier, with NY Epis being my drug of choice.
After a considerable amount of effort, the Triumph is again whole, and has become my most favorite guitar. Toneful, whether played hard with a flatpick, or finger style. A plain jane, no-figure, celluloid inlaid workhorse.
So, I'll always be slightly fond of TGP, given my good fortune. But I don't spend much time there.
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