Twin reverb, which one?

[asafasadi]

Hello everyone,
I am undecided over which twin reverb to get, but first a quick gear overview so you understand the situation better.
Guitar is a es-175 with 0.14 flatwound thomastick strings. I play it in aroom where alsoa sm7b with a dynamite dm-1 is present to pic up my voice and a little bit of the acoustic sound.
I have a Motu 896mk3 hybrid as an audio interface.
In another room that is very close to a vocal booth in size and full of various junk, I have a roland jazz chourus 40, micked with an sm57.
I was thinking about upgrading to a twin reverb, the question is, which one? I can't hear the JC40 amplifier at 6/7, in the main room, so isolation is pretty good.
I live in italy and these are the current options:
Fender twin 65 reissue
Fender twin ii (riviera era)
FENDER TWIN in Amplificatori - Combo per Chitarra - Mercatino Musicale
take a look for yourself to what the options are! I would prefer to go and grab it on my own, because shipping something this delicate it's not a good idea.
I looked also into princetons, but I came to the conclusion that it's better something definitive.
Let me know what you think and if you have any tips!
Thanks,
Frankie

[asafasadi]

Salute. I will begin by saying I play mostly blues music and my preference in gear and sound are old school. For amps that means tubes and hand-wired preferably.

This being said, of the choices in the link provided my first choice would be one of the two Fender Custom Shop ‘57 Tweed Twins selling for €1750 and €2100. Warm,clean tone at lower volume settings while adding nice bluesy grit to the tone at higher volumes.

My next choice would the 1965 reissues. Will get you close to the vintage “blackface” tone without all the worries of maintaining a vintage “blackface” amp. Clean and clear tone from low to high.

I owned a Fender Super 210 red knob “Riviera” era amp I bought brand new in the late 1980’s. I played through it for over a decade. It was a reliable,nice sounding amp. Its sound was more low wattage Mesa Boogie than Fender to my ears. The Super is the only “Riviera” era amp I have played though.

Best wishes on your search.

Thank you for the reply, Blue J, I am myself inclined for the 65, because I don't need the bluesy grit and they are a little bit cheaper.

[Average Joe]

The black panel Twin is THE benchmark clean platform imho. I even like them better at lower volumes than a Princeton or Beluxe turned up further. A Twin is just a lush sounding thing. My back otoh doesn't like them one bit


I remember the red knob twin as more strident, but it's been ages since I played one.

[asafasadi]

do you mean these ones? FENDER SUPER TWIN REVERB BLACKFACE - #7607620 - su Mercatino Musicale in Amplificatori - Combo per Chitarra
or this one? FENDER TWIN REVERB AMP BLACKFACE - #6284191 - su Mercatino Musicale in Amplificatori - Combo per Chitarra
Thanks for the info, average joe!

[jads57]

So just some random thoughts at 68 years old and having played through just about all of the Fender Twin models old and new.
My favorite was a non master volume Silver Face circa 1968 version followed by an earlier Black Face version

But since then I would opt for the TM Twin due to much lighter weight and very similar tonality plus superior direct output ability and overall wattage level control.
But since I discovered Quilter Aviator Gen 1&2 and TB 202 I’m actually happiest!

Dont believe all the tube hype B.S. Due a blindfold test for yourself! I say this having owned just about every amp imaginable,including Dumble OD Special.

[garybaldy]

Not a Twin reverb but you can't go wrong with a Pro Tube Series Twin Amp (still twin spkrs and a reverb!).
There's the 1994 model which, sort of, has 3 channels (know as the Evil Twin NB. the red knob TR is not the Evil Twin as some say) and the later 2002 model which is more retro with the vibrato.
I have the 2002 model and its' clean is beautiful and gain very usable (I always used pedals with mine). It's too heavy to take gigging though. They can be got quite cheaply as they don't have the kudos of the older Fender amps.

[asafasadi]

Thanks everyone for the information!
A couple of addendums.
Weight is not an issue, I will use my JC40 to gig around
I am looking to buy something that doesn't lose value. I will take a look at the quilters!

[GuyBoden]

Black Face Twin Reverb is one of the best Amps ever made IMHO. (If you can carry the weight.)

Two speakers make a big difference to my ears.





65 Black Face Twin Reverb Reissue

[2bornot2bop]

So just some random thoughts at 68 years old and having played through just about all of the Fender Twin models old and new.
My favorite was a non master volume Silver Face circa 1968 version followed by an earlier Black Face version

But since then I would opt for the TM Twin due to much lighter weight and very similar tonality plus superior direct output ability and overall wattage level control.
But since I discovered Quilter Aviator Gen 1&2 and TB 202 I’m actually happiest!

Dont believe all the tube hype B.S. Due a blindfold test for yourself! I say this having owned just about every amp imaginable,including Dumble OD Special.

tube hype bs? You’ve just alienated half the forum. You’re obviously not an audiophile.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

I"m with jads57. I have a beautiful '71 SF Twin that hasn't left its home under my piano in a very long time. My "big gun" is a Quilter OD202 head in a BlockDock 12HD. The Twin's second speaker adds some dispersion in a live setting. But for the use you describe, you're only going to be mic'ing one speaker anyway even if you get a Twin. The Quilter is as big and powerful as a Twin in a more compact package, and it sounds great.

I also have a DV Mark EG250 head that makes more raw RMS power than a Twin and sounds every bit as good - it has a tube in its preamp. Drive a 2x12 cabinet with one of these and you have a new, reliable amp that'll do anything a Twin will do for less money. Italy is the home of DVM, so you should be able to get one easily.

[Stringswinger]

I have a Quilter Mach 3 Combo, their flagship amp. It is a fine amp, but having had a vintage P2P Twin Reverb, I can say that the only amp that sounds like a vintage Twin is a vintage Twin. The 65 Reissue, the Tonemaster Twin and all the other solid state amps out there will not get you the sound of a vintage P2P Fender Twin. They might get you close, but sometimes, the real thing is the only thing to scratch a particular itch.

[asafasadi]

I did try a couple of dvmarks, didn't like them much

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

I did try a couple of dvmarks, didn't like them much

If you haven't tried the EG250, I highly recommend that you do. It's not like the other heads they make - it's just a pure and simple 250W head with reverb. It has a 6205 tube in the front end, which really does make big, warm tone unlike any of the DVMs without it. It's also the simplest and most powerful guitar head they make (unless they came out with a new one since I last looked). There's a Greg Howe version that has 2 channels and a lot more knobs. But the EG250 is the closest modern head you'll find to a Twin in performance.

The simple fact that it's still in their lineup tells you how popular it must be. Almost all of their heads go out of production and are replaced by other models so fast that it makes my head spin.

[vintagelove]

The one that says "super reverb" on it.

I kid...

Anyway, find a non master volume silverface, spend 200 bucks to have a tech do some upkeep, and you have a boutique quality amp for half the price that will last another few decades.

[John A.]

Hello everyone,
I am undecided over which twin reverb to get, but first a quick gear overview so you understand the situation better.
Guitar is a es-175 with 0.14 flatwound thomastick strings. I play it in aroom where alsoa sm7b with a dynamite dm-1 is present to pic up my voice and a little bit of the acoustic sound.
I have a Motu 896mk3 hybrid as an audio interface.
In another room that is very close to a vocal booth in size and full of various junk, I have a roland jazz chourus 40, micked with an sm57.
I was thinking about upgrading to a twin reverb, the question is, which one? I can't hear the JC40 amplifier at 6/7, in the main room, so isolation is pretty good.
I live in italy and these are the current options:
Fender twin 65 reissue
Fender twin ii (riviera era)
FENDER TWIN in Amplificatori - Combo per Chitarra - Mercatino Musicale
take a look for yourself to what the options are! I would prefer to go and grab it on my own, because shipping something this delicate it's not a good idea.
I looked also into princetons, but I came to the conclusion that it's better something definitive.
Let me know what you think and if you have any tips!
Thanks,
Frankie

Between a '65 Reissue and a Twin II, I'd take the '65 reissue. The ones I've played through were very close to the real BF's I've played through, and the Twin II's seem like fairly different amps to me. Between a '65 Reissue, a Twin II, and a Princeton Reverb, I'd take the Princeton (not sure what you mean by "definitive"). I prefer the sound (slightly more mid range-range/tweedy sound, the possibility of overdrive at a sane volume), and the size and weight are much more practical for me. I had one for a long time (after having had a brown Pro Amp for even longer), and it's probably my all time favorite Fender amp. Like others, I switched to a Quilter (Aviator Cub) which sounds great and is even more practical and flexible. I wouldn't try to talk you in or out of a Twin (personally, I have no interest in owning one), but I will say don't buy one based on reputation or other people's opinions online. Buy one because you've played them and you like them. It's a lot of money, and it's big heavy thing that's hard to sell if you decide you don't like it, so try to be as as possible that you do like it before you get one.

[sgcim]

Between a '65 Reissue and a Twin II, I'd take the '65 reissue. The ones I've played through were very close to the real BF's I've played through, and the Twin II's seem like fairly different amps to me. Between a '65 Reissue, a Twin II, and a Princeton Reverb, I'd take the Princeton (not sure what you mean by "definitive"). I prefer the sound (slightly more mid range-range/tweedy sound, the possibility of overdrive at a sane volume), and the size and weight are much more practical for me. I had one for a long time (after having had a brown Pro Amp for even longer), and it's probably my all time favorite Fender amp. Like others, I switched to a Quilter (Aviator Cub) which sounds great and is even more practical and flexible. I wouldn't try to talk you in or out of a Twin (personally, I have no interest in owning one), but I will say don't buy one based on reputation or other people's opinions online. Buy one because you've played them and you like them. It's a lot of money, and it's big heavy thing that's hard to sell if you decide you don't like it, so try to be as as possible that you do like it before you get one.

Yeah, I agree with all of the above. I play regularly with a bass player who also plays guitar and owns one, and my Borys Jazz Solid gets a great sound through it. He bought the Re-issue used, so the reverb has gotten a bit wonky, but if you play around with the tubes and/or wires, it works fine.
Like John A said, it's as heavy as hell, so on our gigs, I bring my Henrikson Jazz Amp, which is MUCH lighter.

[DawgBone]

Salute. I will begin by saying I play mostly blues music and my preference in gear and sound are old school. For amps that means tubes and hand-wired preferably.

This being said, of the choices in the link provided my first choice would be one of the two Fender Custom Shop ‘57 Tweed Twins selling for €1750 and €2100. Warm,clean tone at lower volume settings while adding nice bluesy grit to the tone at higher volumes.

My next choice would the 1965 reissues. Will get you close to the vintage “blackface” tone without all the worries of maintaining a vintage “blackface” amp. Clean and clear tone from low to high.

I owned a Fender Super 210 red knob “Riviera” era amp I bought brand new in the late 1980’s. I played through it for over a decade. It was a reliable,nice sounding amp. Its sound was more low wattage Mesa Boogie than Fender to my ears. The Super is the only “Riviera” era amp I have played though.

Best wishes on your search.

As an owner of a couple Twins I will 2nd everything said here and add that unless you are really cranking there is plenty of headroom with the CS '57 tweed twin. I would gladly trade one of my Twins for one of those without blinking. My '69 Twin has been modded and sounds even better than my stock model so not letting that go but yeah, the tweed is really nice.

As for solid state, I've yet to hear one that didn't sound like warmed over ass and I don't care what anyone says. Buncha junk. Just my two cents.

[John A.]

As an owner of a couple Twins I will 2nd everything said here and add that unless you are really cranking there is plenty of headroom with the CS '57 tweed twin. I would gladly trade one of my Twins for one of those without blinking. My '69 Twin has been modded and sounds even better than my stock model so not letting that go but yeah, the tweed is really nice.

As for solid state, I've yet to hear one that didn't sound like warmed over ass and I don't care what anyone says. Buncha junk. Just my two cents.

Im curious as to how warmed over ass sounds. Different from room temperature ass? Broiled ass? How did you discover this sound exactly?

[ET Music]

Hello. I am a Fender amp tech, and own over 12 vintage Fender brown and black faceplate amps, including a 1966 Twin Reverb and a 1967 Twin Reverb, both with original AB763 "blackface" circuits. The 66 has Utah speakers and the 67 has original JBL D120F speakers.

I would advise skipping the reissue Twin Reverbs or any other variant. First choice: Vintage 1963-67 Twin with black faceplate. Second choice: Drip Edge early Silverface Twin, from Sept. 1967 through late 1969. Third choice: Silverface Twin Reverb, 1970-72 pre master volume and with the original type screwed in baffle.

I know these amps inside and out and will be happy to answer any questions you may have. I am a Fender amp historian and know just about everything important to know about these amps through 1000s of hours of research.

In a nutshell: Original BF Twins from 63-67 were built to last. There is a reason why they are considered in the Top 5 amps designed of all time. They are clean until above 5, then get really gnarly when cranked above 5 in a good way. I use a Fryette Powerstation PS100 to attenuate mine. However clean tones at lower volumes sound amazing with the big Iron transformer and the 2x12 speakers filling the room with warm, lush sound. They also take pedals extremely well. The original designer of the Ibanez Tubescreamer, for example Susumu Tamura used a Twin Reverb when designing and testing the original pedal for Maxon.

The Twin Reverb is probably the most recorded amp of all time (its not the Deluxe Reverb as some sources state). The Twin has been used on 100,000s of hit records because its so versatile and can be dialed in to sit perfectly in a mix. Twin Reverbs have been used by artists as diverse as Wes Montgomery, to James Brown, Rolling Stones, Sex Pistols, The Smiths, Beatles, and thousands more.

Original BF Twins are hand built and can be found at GREAT prices today online, because most people do not want to buy a "big" amp. For example, a black faceplate 1967 sold this morning for only $900 on ebay! I almost bought it. It was almost completely original and very nice, except for the speakers. I bought my 67 with JBLs last year for only $1000 locally!

Just saw that you are in Italy...IT MAY BE TOUGH FINDING AN ORIGINAL IN ITALY, unfortunately. However if you can find a vendor online who can ship you one, buy it.

Right now on GC, there is a 1969 Drip Edge Twin Reverb for only $999. It has a painted black or black grill cloth, which is not ideal but the rest of the amp looks really good.

Look for original transformers if you can.

Feel free to PM me here with any questions. Here is my 1967 with original JBLs. Its extremely clean and is almost mint. Its been re-capped and I added a 3 prong cord. Its good to go for the next 50-100 years.

[garybaldy]

Im curious as to how warmed over ass sounds. Different from room temperature ass? Broiled ass? How did you discover this sound exactly?

I think the differences would be quite subtle.

[Stringswinger]

Im curious as to how warmed over ass sounds. Different from room temperature ass? Broiled ass? How did you discover this sound exactly?

I would bet they all sound "farty". Not what I would want in an amp. YMMV

[jads57]

tube hype bs? You’ve just alienated half the forum. You’re obviously not an audiophile.

So just my 2 cents. I’m 68 and worked most of my life as a professional guitarist. I’m giving background so will understand my opinions about tubes and non tube amps.There are no amps sans a Matchless DC 30 I’ve not owned at some point in time.
That includes Fender,Marshall,Ampeg,Mesa Boogie,Dumble OD Special circa 1980.

Remember there is no one amp that is perfect for every situation from stage , studio,etc. Also even within tube amps to achieve power tube saturation requires different low to high power models
There is some truth to tubes usually being warmer. But there are work arounds with various boosts,eq,tone shaping pedals like an Xotic Sweet Boost,T.C. Jauernig Luxury Drive in front of a non tube amps.

Also remember there have been huge improvements in technology in just the past few years. I think it’s important to actually gig these various amps and pedals. Playing at home or low volume gigs, doesn’t always show the true potential of the gear.
My Dumbles didn’t sound magical at lower volumes or in certain venues. Nor in the studio without a great engineer and proper microphone placement or in a small studio space.

Many of today’s solutions including direct to board solutions also don't sound good in live situations ,although that’s changing as well
Bottom line is try as many as possible,and remember there’s no magic bullet for all situations.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

Im curious as to how warmed over ass sounds. Different from room temperature ass? Broiled ass? How did you discover this sound exactly?

C'mon, John. You know very well that nothing sounds quite like fresh grilled ass. Once you reheat it, you might as well toss it.

[wintermoon]

Hello. I am a Fender amp tech, and own over 12 vintage Fender brown and black faceplate amps, including a 1966 Twin Reverb and a 1967 Twin Reverb, both with original AB763 "blackface" circuits. The 66 has Utah speakers and the 67 has original JBL D120F speakers.

I would advise skipping the reissue Twin Reverbs or any other variant. First choice: Vintage 1963-67 Twin with black faceplate. Second choice: Drip Edge early Silverface Twin, from Sept. 1967 through late 1969. Third choice: Silverface Twin Reverb, 1970-72 pre master volume and with the original type screwed in baffle.

I know these amps inside and out and will be happy to answer any questions you may have. I am a Fender amp historian and know just about everything important to know about these amps through 1000s of hours of research.

In a nutshell: Original BF Twins from 63-67 were built to last. There is a reason why they are considered in the Top 5 amps designed of all time. They are clean until above 5, then get really gnarly when cranked above 5 in a good way. I use a Fryette Powerstation PS100 to attenuate mine. However clean tones at lower volumes sound amazing with the big Iron transformer and the 2x12 speakers filling the room with warm, lush sound. They also take pedals extremely well. The original designer of the Ibanez Tubescreamer, for example Susumu Tamura used a Twin Reverb when designing and testing the original pedal for Maxon.

The Twin Reverb is probably the most recorded amp of all time (its not the Deluxe Reverb as some sources state). The Twin has been used on 100,000s of hit records because its so versatile and can be dialed in to sit perfectly in a mix. Twin Reverbs have been used by artists as diverse as Wes Montgomery, to James Brown, Rolling Stones, Sex Pistols, The Smiths, Beatles, and thousands more.

Original BF Twins are hand built and can be found at GREAT prices today online, because most people do not want to buy a "big" amp. For example, a black faceplate 1967 sold this morning for only $900 on ebay! I almost bought it. It was almost completely original and very nice, except for the speakers. I bought my 67 with JBLs last year for only $1000 locally!

Just saw that you are in Italy...IT MAY BE TOUGH FINDING AN ORIGINAL IN ITALY, unfortunately. However if you can find a vendor online who can ship you one, buy it.

Right now on GC, there is a 1969 Drip Edge Twin Reverb for only $999. It has a painted black or black grill cloth, which is not ideal but the rest of the amp looks really good.

Look for original transformers if you can.

Feel free to PM me here with any questions. Here is my 1967 with original JBLs. Its extremely clean and is almost mint. Its been re-capped and I added a 3 prong cord. Its good to go for the next 50-100 years.

Nice example, I have factory Jensen C12NA's in my BF Twins although one has JBL's

[ET Music]

Nice example, I have factory Jensen C12NA's in my BF Twins although one has JBL's

Original C12NAs are fantastic speakers. I have a 1966 Bassman cabinet with a set of those.