Chuck Wayne Picking

[NSJ]

I've started making this transition from fingers to pick and fingers . At this point I'm far less concerned about speed than accuracy and also the ability to play block chords with pick and fingers ( basically, Triads, four note open voicings, split voicings and spread voicings ).

It seems to be an elementary proposition that I need to have the pick and fingers at least do with the fingers can do before I can utilize the pick for lines . Still trying to get the C finger in shape , it's coming along slowly. It would help if the goddamn nails in the A and C fingers would stop breaking .

I think the point of using the P and I joints as the loci of control as opposed to the wrist (most Players, I presume) or elbow (Johnny Smith) is it supposed to give you far more accuracy but you have to develop the volume .

It seems to be a classical guitar proposition in so far as it wastes the fewest energy and motion .

[Vladan]

[Alan Davidson]

Here's an article on Chuck Wayne's picking technique from JJG magazine:

Thanks for the link. An interesting read about a picking technique that I hadn't known about.....until today!

[geese_com]

In a limited way, I think I'm having some success with it (i.e. to reasonable effect in applications of my choice).

I think I could explain and demonstrate in a video. I'm out for the afternoon, but I'll prepare one his evening.

That would be awesome if you can make a video. I am usually a wrist rotation picker when playing rock and metal, but the Pasquale Grasso technique interests me to jazz since it can be used to both play chords, picked lines, and hybrid picking easily.

[destinytot]

Has anyone had any success replicating Pasquale Grasso's version of the Chuck Wayne picking technique?

I have been working on it for the past couple weeks and am still having a little trouble. Is just the joint of the thumb moving. I feel like you can't get as much speed that way, but Pasquale seems to get some good speed with it.

Any ideas, help, insight would be appreciated. Thanks!

In a limited way, I think I'm having some success with it (i.e. to reasonable effect in applications of my choice).

I think I could explain and demonstrate in a video. I'm out for the afternoon, but I'll prepare one his evening.

Done - way too long and perhaps too quiet at times, but well intended. Hope it helps:

[geese_com]

Done - way too long and perhaps too quiet at times, but well intended. Hope it helps:

Thank you very much for doing the video. There is lots of useful info in there. I actually bought the Chuck Wayne Chords and Scales books specifically to ready about the Chuck Wayne picking techniques (there is only one page per book talking about it).

The book does mention that the picking action comes not from the wrist but from the hand using the first joint of the thumb for the downstroke and the first finger for the upstroke. Also, that the string is activated by pushing rather than hitting.

After reading that, it made the technique a little clearer.

[Dioxic]

I've been using it exclusively for...a year..? Not sure. I worked on the Benson technique for 1-2 years, and while I got really proficient in it, it just never clicked. I successfully made the transition to picking this way in just a couple of months. I'll See if I can get a video up of me demonstrating the technique.

[destinytot]

I've been using it exclusively for...a year..? Not sure. I worked on the Benson technique for 1-2 years, and while I got really proficient in it, it just never clicked. I successfully made the transition to picking this way in just a couple of months. I'll See if I can get a video up of me demonstrating the technique.

That's great, man - both to know that it's working for you, and that you might be posting a video demo.

I think it would also be great if video examples of members' ideas and playing were exchanged on the forum more often.

I'm glad I stuck my neck out yesterday, but today I feel that I needn't have posted anything longer than these three-minutes:

I

[geese_com]

I've been using it exclusively for...a year..? Not sure. I worked on the Benson technique for 1-2 years, and while I got really proficient in it, it just never clicked. I successfully made the transition to picking this way in just a couple of months. I'll See if I can get a video up of me demonstrating the technique.

Another video helping to explain would be awesome. What amazes me about Pasquale's technique vs Chuck's or Peter Prisco's is that his hand, wrist, and arm rarely move when picking. It is just the thumb and index finger. He does move his hand, wrist, and arm when he does plays single notes on different strings (kind of like sweeping but not exactly).

[NSJ]

It's interesting that you are speaking of his picking technique solely from the point of view of speed within the framework of single-note lines.

I try to think of the whole over a constituent part --the single note lines will take care of themselves if I can figure out how to use the pick in conjunction with the other three fingers to play 2,3 or 4 note voicings, as needed. That seems to me the reason why the pick angle is shifting-to allow for the versatility to play anywhere from 1 to 4 notes at a time at the same time (and not merely strummed).

That needs to be obtained with some level of proficiency, and that's what I've been trying to get at.

[geese_com]

It's interesting that you are speaking of his picking technique solely from the point of view of speed within the framework of single-note lines.

I try to think of the whole over a constituent part --the single note lines will take care of themselves if I can figure out how to use the pick in conjunction with the other three fingers to play 2,3 or 4 note voicings, as needed. That seems to me the reason why the pick angle is shifting-to allow for the versatility to play anywhere from 1 to 4 notes at a time at the same time (and not merely strummed).

That needs to be obtained with some level of proficiency, and that's what I've been trying to get at.

I do like the ability to use it in conjunction with the other fingers of the picking hand for hybrid picking. I have no problem with hybrid picking with a pick and that is probably why I am not talking about it much here. I like the idea of having another useful picking technique. I do also dabble with downward pick slanting, upward pick slanting, and crosspicking (if you are familiar with Troy Grady's Cracking the Code series).

[destinytot]

It's interesting that you are speaking of his picking technique solely from the point of view of speed within the framework of single-note lines.

I try to think of the whole over a constituent part --the single note lines will take care of themselves if I can figure out how to use the pick in conjunction with the other three fingers to play 2,3 or 4 note voicings, as needed. That seems to me the reason why the pick angle is shifting-to allow for the versatility to play anywhere from 1 to 4 notes at a time at the same time (and not merely strummed).

That needs to be obtained with some level of proficiency, and that's what I've been trying to get at.

I'd add 'improvised' to the above.

It would be great if you'd post a video too, NSJ.

Here's my two-minute edit - pick and fingers MAC:

[destinytot]

I do like the ability to use it in conjunction with the other fingers of the picking hand for hybrid picking. I have no problem with hybrid picking with a pick and that is probably why I am not talking about it much here. I like the idea of having another useful picking technique. I do also dabble with downward pick slanting, upward pick slanting, and crosspicking (if you are familiar with Troy Grady's Cracking the Code series).

I think that's crucial - synthesis.

I no longer even attempt to buy into 100% of anyone else's method - but I'll 'take what's useful, and leave the rest aside'.

[oceanslider]

My teacher from the mid to late 90s Sandy DeVito studied with Chuck Wayne. I think Sandy has a style based on what Chuck does. But all hands are different.

From the videos I've seen of Chuck it seems Sandy bends his index finger in more closer to his palm. But Sandy took lessons from Chuck longer than anyone. In fact, Sandy told me Chuck really was not in the business of giving lessons and he was one of just a few.

Sandy still teaches guitar in San Diego California. Sandy Studied with Chuck for 13 years I believe. Sandy is also very good friends with Bob Benedetto and his family.

Sandy was still actively playing gigs also around the San Diego area pre Covid. He might be back at it a bit again now.

I have a couple of guitar study books by Chuck, one on Chords and another on Scales. They are still in print.

Here is Sandy's profile on the Bennedetto website: Sandy DeVito | Benedetto Guitars
And here is a picture of Bob, Sandy, and Chuck


I searched the forum here and there is another thread on Chuck
Chuck Wayne (jazzguitar.be)

My feeling these days... You probably should not think you should copy exactly another's picking style and the way they hold the pick. All hands are completely different. Chuck Waynes hands are completely different than George Benson who holds the pick completely different than Chuck. But observe others style and then try different things out and decide based on your hands and hands mechanics what works best for you.

I have decided after basically following Sandy DeVito's style for years to switch to a George Benson style. I find for solo lines it is making a huge difference in fluidity and preciseness and speed. And I can still do Hybrid Picking but with my hand shaped slightly different than when I played more like I learned from Sandy.