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Aging gracefully is still aging. My Stealth 10 will be my "big" speaker cab, once I sell the Boogie Thiele EVM that I haven't moved from the closet since well before Covid. Even at my age, the Stealth is quite manageable if I really need it on a gig - e.g. I can still lift it into and out of my trunk easily. But I'm wondering if a neo speaker would knock off a few pounds at no cost in sound quality. I don't see a Creamback Neo listed in 10". The only neo 10 that pops up with any availaibility is the Eminence DeltaLite, with which I have absolutely no experience at all - I've never seen or heard one. Has anyone used this or any other neo 10 in a Stealth?
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12-13-2021 11:04 AM
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Great question, one that I also would like to hear answered. At 64, my 35 pound Stealth 12ER doesn't leave the house anymore. At 30 pounds, my Stealth 10ER does go to an occasional gig, but if I could shave 5 pounds off with a Neo speaker, That would be appreciated...and in another 10 years likely mandatory
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Jensen 10" Tornado is great. If 25W is enough, also consider their AlNiCo P10R or P10R-F. All in the 4 lbs league.
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Thanks!! The P10R weighs a delightfully low 3 pounds - I didn't realize it was that light. I don't know which driver is in mine, as I've never opened it. Assuming it's an Eminence, they weigh a few ounces over 6 pounds, so even the Tornado should be noticeably lighter at about 3 1/2 pounds. I'm familiar with the regular P10R, but I've never heard or played through the F. I read their description of the two - is the sonic difference between the R and the R-F subtle or grossly obvious?
Originally Posted by Gitterbug
My Superblock (on backorder for 3 months) is reportedly living in a shipping container at the Long Beach port. If it gets to me before one of us dies of old age, it'll be the default power source. Otherwise, I've been very happy with my Elf. Even my Microblock sounds amazingly big through both my Stealth 10 and my RevSound 8RS.
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Not in a stealth, but I have replaced the standard Eminence Beta 10 in a UK mambo amp with the Deltalite 10, saving a few pounds. I realise you may not be familiar with the Mambo amp, but it's still relevant, in that the standard speakers in RE cabs and of course Hendriksen10 amps, Evans amps and AI combos are - or were, at least - Eminence Beta 10s. It's an 'industry standard" jazz speaker. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
The Deltalite sounds as near as makes no difference in any gigging sense, although I suppose a determined corksniffer might find some. I have compared side by side, and I don't hear any significant difference. The cones look the same, and may indeed be the same. And a few pounds matters to me..
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Wow - the Deltalite series 2 is only 5.7 pounds! That sounds like the one I want. I’d love to be able to compare it with the Tornado and P10R, but that’s not going to be possible short of buying them all and returning two (which I won’t do to the vendors - they’re having a hard enough time right now). Originally Posted by Franz 1997
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The speaker in my Stealth 10 was also an Eminence Beta. I replaced it with an Eminence Cannabis Rex and I much prefer the tone. I don't think the weight changed much though. I haven't bothered to worry about saving a couple or three pounds because mine seldom moves, other than occasionally across the room. I bought a pair of the CR speakers to put in my Vibrolux Reverb, and discovered that putting the Beta from the RE cab in the VR along with one CR, and the other CR in the RE cab improved both units. Neither goes further than across the room, sometimes into the closet. The DV Little Jazz gets used the most, even at home.
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That's the shipping weight; the speaker alone is 4.5 lb I think. I know, not much difference, but it all counts when lugging stuff around Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
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…as does mine. It’s on the countertop / console of my apartment sized studio behind an Alesis Q88 keyboard. But I keep an amp in each room in which I might want to practice or play. The Stealth sits under our piano, and I have an Eminence 8-15 in a small vented cab for use on our enclosed patio. My Superblock (assuming I ever receive it) will live on the RE and the Microblock lives on the little 8” cab. I keep the Elf and RevSound RS8 in a gig bag in the gear closet since I got the Li’l Jazz. But that RevSound is sooooo good that it was hard to decide whether to take it or the RE on a gig if I remember gigging correctly Originally Posted by sgosnell
. My weekly solo and trio gigs dried up with Covid and have not restarted.
When I use the Roland synth, I run a stereo rig with the RS and RE. Even the B3 patch with Leslie is pretty convincing. No one would confuse it with our XK5 Pro and 3300 Leslie at the club, but it holds its own.
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Having a number of amps I usually defer to a Blu6 for
indoor use, and perfectly adequate for a small gig
One of my friends here suggested pairing the Clarus
( super lightweight ) with my Stealth cab which produces
a very good Jazz tone. just my 2p.
Silverfoxx
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About the two Jensen AlNiCos: I haven't done an A/B but the F version is said to be a tad darker and rounder, with less treble spike. A German singer-guitarist-teacher has it in his TOOB 10S and is super happy. The Deltalite II is a bass speaker by gender, although the 60-4kHz range makes it ok for jazz guitar. Not necessarily the best solution if you do any overdrive. I'd really look at the Jensens if every ounce counts.
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Thanks! I've been looking at the Blu 6 online now for a while. But I must be getting old, because I can't even justify another $1k amp to myself. They say that after many years of marriage, husband and wife begin to look alike. In our case, I appear to have started to think like her! Originally Posted by silverfoxx
I already have several great little amps (including a Li'l Jazz) that will cover any outside gig. And most of my ad hoc dates have dried up. I had a great gig playing the cafe at our local Whole Foods (one of the biggest WF in the country) once or twice a month with my trio and once or twice as a solo. But that ended with Covid, and they haven't restarted the program. So I get no more than one outside date a month these days, and the Li'l Jazz has been more than enough on every date I've done with it since I got it.
Fortunately, I lead a house band gig at a local club and play twice a week - but I have a DVM Jazz 12, a Vibrolux, and a CS PR on stage there as a backline. And I've started plugging into the Leslie 3300 that goes with our Hammond XK5 Pro. I truly do not need another $1000 amplifier, as much as I want a Blu 6. Maybe if I successfuly sell the stuff I've posted here and on Craigslist, I'll splurge, assuming there are any available when I'm ready.
And I almost forgot that I've had a Superblock US on backorder for 3 months, with a real possibility that I'll actually receive it by January. I think I'll just throw a neo into the Stealth for now.
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Piggybacking on this, what would be a good neo 12" option to put in my Fender Pro Peverb? Currently it has two JBL something-120s which must weigh about 20 pounds apiece, from the size of a magnet. Altogether that amp must weigh close to 80 pounds, heavier than a Twin because of the speakers. I haven't been able to pick it up without risking hurting myself in years. It probably hasn't been out of the house in at least 15 years. Even putting speakers similar to what would've been OEM would trim quite a bit of weight off of it.
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Here's the current spec sheet from Eminence: Originally Posted by Franz 1997
That's the shipping weight; the speaker alone is 4.5 lb I think. I know, not much difference, but it all counts when lugging stuff around
Net Weight 5.1 lbs, 2.31 kg Shipping Weight 6.8 lbs, 3.08 kgs
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I have an old Clarus Series I which I use with my Stealth 10, along with a GK MB200. I can't even justify a $500 additional amp. All mine live in the same room, and I almost never play anywhere else. If I do, I can easily move the Little Jazz there. The Clarus/RE cab marriage was once the gold standard for jazz guitar amplification, and it still sounds very good. I still have a jones for a RE Luna, but I just can't justify paying that much money for another amp. I could try to sell all I've got, but it's a hassle. The Vibrolux Reverb should bring more than enough tor a Luna, but finding a buyer and shipping that ton of iron is more than I really want to do. If someone walked up with cash I would let it go in a heartbeat, but the world isn't beating a path to my door.
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It’s a universal problem. The thought of selling another piece of equipment is nauseating to me. I recently sold my Carvin 727 to a delightful buyer who’s a JGO regular. He was so accommodating that he insisted on sending me an extra $20 to cover an unexpected increase in shipping fees that I told him I’d cover. Originally Posted by sgosnell
Even with a great buyer, it was a real hassle and the process of properly packing it, getting a shipping estimate, etc took 3 days. He paid shipping, so I got an estimate from shipguitars.com - and they don’t include “fees” in their estimates. He chose it, and they use UPS. UPS lost track of it for a few days. It finally reached him days late and still showing as in transit on their tracking site.
So I’m sitting on a pile of big, heavy stuff I want to sell so I can get a Blu 6 and an El Rey 7. I have a pair of Bag End 12s with magnets like an MRI machine, a 40 pound closed back Boogie EVM cabinet, a heavy tube head, a Gigrac 300 powered mixer, etc. Just advertising is a pain, and protecting yourself against theft, fraud, and other unscrupulous practices is a full time job. I don’t want strangers coming to my home, and meeting on a parking lot is no longer safe. Fortunately, I can meet local buyers at the club in which I play.
It wasn’t that long ago that I shipped a big and heavy commercial Crown open reel tape deck from Philly to Minnesota by USPS priority in 3 days for $75. The times they are a’changin’ for sure.
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Jensen N12K (100W, "Fendery") is what big F is using in their Black Tone Masters. It became available for the public just as Covid struck. The Blondes have Celestion Neo Creambacks (more for shredding, a calculated risk at 60W). The Jensen N12/100 TR, i.e. classic Tornado, sits between these two tonally and is widely used by boutique cab makers and private builders, Mad Professor and Yours Truly included. I've installed some 250 - not one lemon and very consistent tone. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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I had thought about that for one of my Stealth 12-ERs, but I think it would still be too much to lug. The cab itself is big and heavy, even without a speaker. I am getting by with Henriksen/Quilter/Genzler for gigs. Easy lift in and out. For now the two REs stay in the home studio. But they do sound GLORIOUS.
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I’m very happy to hear that. Marcwhy has graciously sold me a 10” Tornado neo he wasn’t using. When I get it into my Stealth, I’ll make before and after videos and we’ll all see how it sounds. Originally Posted by Gitterbug
Meanwhile, I’m praying for my Superblock’s early release from bondage.
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i did and hated it. In fact, I haven't found a single neo speaker I've ever liked for guitar. They all seem to have a spikey mid range quality to them. Your ear can get used to it but if you hear it next to a relatively equivalent non neo speaker, it will cleanse your aural palette. Ironically, I do like the neo speakers for bass but those are typically in closed back cabinets specifically designed for them based on their characteristics. I have a pair of aguilar 12 cabs with neo speakers that sound amazing for bass, pretty good for acoustic/nylon string guitar but for electric guitar or archtop, my open back cabs with Celestion alnico 90 speakers sound 100x better.
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Raezer's edge makes a "lite" open back 12" cab that even with a ceramic magnet speaker weighs only 23lbs.
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Ummmm - “only” 23lbs? But seriously, that’s tempting and good info for young ‘uns and anyone who needs a new cab. But when I passed 70, I went from my acquisition phase to my dispersion phase - 2 items have to leave home for every new one that arrives. I’ve had my Stealth since soon after Rich started making them, so we have a thing going. At her age, she can stand to lose a few pounds and still keep her charm Originally Posted by jzucker
If I were still young and bulletproof (and in retrospect maybe a little dumber than I am now), I’d still be abusing my body with my long loved 40 pound closed Boogie EVM. Given what most feel is its great sound quality and versatility, the fact that it’s still not sold after many weeks on Craigslist and JGO tells me I’m not the only one shying away from heft.
If I don’t like the neo Tornado in my RE cab, I’ll try a P10R. But neos are the default in loaded RevSound cabs, and I love my RS8. It does justice to both of my archtops, which sound quite accurate and are readily distinguishable from each other through it. It may be that (as you suggest) cabs need to be designed for neo to get the best from them. If so, I hope to be lucky with this transplant and will move on to a P10R if I’m not. If that’s not as pleasing as the original speaker, I’ll just gig with the RevSound and Elf when I need more than the Little Jazz can deliver and leave the RE under the piano for practicing in the living room. Following my rule, I’m thinking about a Blu 6 when the next 2 items fly the coop - but I know I don’t “need” it.
And we can add my incoming speaker to the “will it ever arrive” list, right in front of my Superblock. FedEx tracking says it’s on time and already in PA for a scheduled Monday arrival. Unfortunately, that’s the same FedEx that just helped tomvwash’s S400 go through the Bermuda triangle for 3 days on its way to him.
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Either the FedEx gods read this forum or a terrible accident has happened: the Tornado neo just arrived, 2 days ahead of schedule!!! It appears to be completely intact from outer box to inner detail, although a large part of that is surely thanks to Marcwhy's stellar packing job. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
I won't have a chance to swap it into the Stealth until Monday at the earliest. I'll make before & after recordings so we can all hear (or not hear, as the case may be) the difference between it and the stock speaker.
Stay tuned and stay safe!
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My Henriksen Combos (Blu 6 and Blu 10) have become my gig amps, but I have three RE Cabinets: Stealth 12ER made by Rich (35 pounds), Stealth 10ER Made by Rich (30 pounds) and a NY8ER Made in Wisconsin (25 pounds). I still carry the two lighter ones with my Clarus head on some gigs, but the 35 pound Stealth 12ER has not left my house in years (perhaps I should consider letting it go?). Reducing the weight of the heavier ones with a Neo speaker might be a winner for me (I don't like carts or carrying anything over 25 pounds these days). Looking forward to the recordings. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
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In younger stronger days my go to was the Boogie Thiele cab and an EVM 12L. Great jazz sound. (Tal used a Bose 901, plenty of running jokes there about his half-stereo system.)
According to the techie audio sites there was a major development in neo tech in the 2000’s. Supposedly they say anything built without that change is worth ditching. But they sniff corks too.
I’ve been using the first gen series DeltaPro 12” in the Thiele cab, in my Twin, and my PR. Been gee 12 years! No midrange spike at all. There is on the graphs a spike up in the 3-4,000hz range. But it is near identical to the spike in an EVM12L so it cant be bad, right?
As mentioned aomewhere, I picked up a Quilter block dock it has the Celeston Neo BN12-300S. (19.5lbs box and speaker). In comparison to the Delta it is a very dark sound, jk is not happy.
sitting next to me is a brand new DeltaLite II 2512 which when im up to it will go in the block dock.
Will report on that.
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