Anybody put a neo speaker in a RE Stealth 10?

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

In younger stronger days my go to was the Boogie Thiele cab and an EVM 12L. Great jazz sound.

Sure is! But I interpret the total lack of interest in mine on the sale forum as a sign that it’s no longer the grail. Since I’m the original owner and it’s decades old, I don’t feel at all bad about keeping it - it’ll be fine under the piano next to the RE.

With those two seriously great speakers in the living room music alcove, I think I’ll look into a stereo effects pedal for fun! Of course, my rule means selling two other items. Then again, there are probably a few candidates on the closet shelf behind the Boogie cabinet…..

[jazzkritter]

Yes from watching them on sale they do seem to have lost lustre. I thought it might be due to most going through boards and PAs now and depending on the amp/speaker chain playing live. In wine country (a very large gig scene in MD and VA as you know). I recall seeing only two or three not direct to board and power speakers. Solo jazz players of course. Lots of those Bose towers. I can’t blame them!
OTHO the EVM12L speakers of the right vintage sell really well!
jk

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

OTHO the EVM12L speakers of the right vintage sell really well!
jk

I hadn’t thought about selling the EVM as a raw driver. I just weighed the cabinet - it’s 37 pounds loaded. The EVM12L weighs 19 pounds, of which 16 is the magnet, and the Creamback neo 12 weighs 4.2 pounds. So a Crreamback-loaded Thiele cab weighs 22.2, which is even manageable for a crusty old curmudgeon like me. That sounds like a plan!

I hope it also sounds like a great speaker.

[This is covered by a codicil to my 1-for-2 rule. It is not mandatory to sell 2 items if a newly acquired one is a replacement component and the item being replaced is either nonfunctional or going to a new home.]

[sgosnell]

Codicils are very useful, and easy to make up on the spot.

[Woody Sound]

Getting a bit OT here, but for a 12" neo look at the Celestion BN12-300S neo. It's what Quilter puts in the lightweight HD combos. Celestion markets it as a bass speaker, but it's pretty full-range and powerful, close to an EVM, but at ~6lbs.

[jazzkritter]

FWIW Im taking that Celeston BN12/300 out of my Block Dock. This afternoon it so happens)
Way too muddy. My old DeltaPro is much more balanced. The BN does sure sound like a bass speaker to me. Putting in a new version DeltaLite II. That series has a very 12L sense to me.
But….. thats to my ears and who knows what they’re hearing anymore?
will report in after the operation.
jk

[jzucker]

I was never a fan of the 12L. To me , it also has a mid spike that is painful. They are designed for loud use and the response seems to even out when you crank them but at low volumes i hate them. I've tried most of the newer neo speakers including the jensen tornados and they all are unpleasing to me. I'd like to try a JBL out again.

In younger stronger days my go to was the Boogie Thiele cab and an EVM 12L. Great jazz sound. (Tal used a Bose 901, plenty of running jokes there about his half-stereo system.)

According to the techie audio sites there was a major development in neo tech in the 2000’s. Supposedly they say anything built without that change is worth ditching. But they sniff corks too.

I’ve been using the first gen series DeltaPro 12” in the Thiele cab, in my Twin, and my PR. Been gee 12 years! No midrange spike at all. There is on the graphs a spike up in the 3-4,000hz range. But it is near identical to the spike in an EVM12L so it cant be bad, right?
As mentioned aomewhere, I picked up a Quilter block dock it has the Celeston Neo BN12-300S. (19.5lbs box and speaker). In comparison to the Delta it is a very dark sound, jk is not happy.
sitting next to me is a brand new DeltaLite II 2512 which when im up to it will go in the block dock.
Will report on that.

[jazzkritter]

Its OK the 12L is no speaker for light thoughts)
Not to use a four letter word from a thread not long ago here (wine lol) we went to a seminar on taste given by some smithsonian research group that was working on the DNA effects on smell/taste. They pretty well proved via a wine tasting that darn near everyone finds their individual taste to be quite personal. Hence the DNA link.
I have to think that is true with ears. Not at the awake level (as in I like my TF) but at some subliminal level where our ear circuits are different than others but perfectly accurate to us.
it does explain why we can get some crazy arguments started about what sounds “best”. Not to mention what wine tastes “best”. Lol!
jk

[jzucker]

Its OK the 12L is no speaker for light thoughts)
Not to use a four letter word from a thread not long ago here (wine lol) we went to a seminar on taste given by some smithsonian research group that was working on the DNA effects on smell/taste. They pretty well proved via a wine tasting that darn near everyone finds their individual taste to be quite personal. Hence the DNA link.
I have to think that is true with ears. Not at the awake level (as in I like my TF) but at some subliminal level where our ear circuits are different than others but perfectly accurate to us.
it does explain why we can get some crazy arguments started about what sounds “best”. Not to mention what wine tastes “best”. Lol!
jk

There is also confirmation bias, dunning-kruger and psychoacoustics at play here. There was a study a while back about how our ears normalize timbre and i firmly believe that what most people call speaker break in or a soundboard "playing in" is actually our ears normalizing what we hear. A while back, I bought a pair of jensen jet tornado 12" speakers and put them in my mojo cab. I thought they sounded pretty good, maybe not as good as the celestions I was using previously but dropping the cab weight down to 17lb was a winner. However, once I started gigging with them it was a different story. At louder volumes, I thought they mushed out really quickly and the mid spike caused severe ear fatigue. Every gig I did with those speakers was extremely disappointing and dissatisfying to me as the sound bothered me to the point where I could not get lost in the music. When I switched to the Alnico 90 Celestion, I felt like I could just play and not be continually psyched out by the sound of the speakers. I tried a couple other neo speakers and decided they just didn't work for me.

However, I have them in bass cabs and think they sound great. It may be that they work better (for my ears) in a closed back cabinet so maybe in a stealth cab they would work well.

Another thing nobody has mentioned on this thread is that almost every neo speaker including the jensens are very inefficient compared to their ceramic brothers. So, in my case I was turning my amp up much higher with the neo speakers and that also introduced some unpleasantness...

If you're using a 400w clarus, probably not an issue.

[jazzkritter]

Good answer Jack). Most i have is the TB200.
The breaking in idea is interesting. I had a classical prof at Peabody who insisted students with new guitars puem next to a speaker playing orchestra music. Always wondered about that idea cause it takes years to break in wood. At least i thought it did.
Now, if we had a new guitar being broken in by a new non broken in speaker….

[jazzkritter]

promised an update, well…..
Grrrrrrr
Went to install the Eminence DeltaLite into the block dock.
no sound.
check everything, assume I screwed up somehow.
(not a lot here to screw up)))
DOA … cone is frozen in place!
And i even bought it from a five star pro audio dealer on reverb at new price “brand new”. Waiting to see how they handle this.
jk

[JazzNote]

The speaker in my Stealth 10 was also an Eminence Beta. I replaced it with an Eminence Cannabis Rex and I much prefer the tone. I don't think the weight changed much though. I haven't bothered to worry about saving a couple or three pounds because mine seldom moves, other than occasionally across the room. I bought a pair of the CR speakers to put in my Vibrolux Reverb, and discovered that putting the Beta from the RE cab in the VR along with one CR, and the other CR in the RE cab improved both units. Neither goes further than across the room, sometimes into the closet. The DV Little Jazz gets used the most, even at home.

How would you describe the tone difference that the Eminence Cannabis Rex made?

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

promised an update, well…..
Grrrrrrr
Went to install the Eminence DeltaLite into the block dock.
no sound.
check everything, assume I screwed up somehow.
(not a lot here to screw up)))
DOA … cone is frozen in place!
And i even bought it from a five star pro audio dealer on reverb at new price “brand new”. Waiting to see how they handle this.
jk

Like WOW, Dobie!

[sgosnell]

How would you describe the tone difference that the Eminence Cannabis Rex made?

The Cannabis Rex is tighter, more treble, more defined. The Beta sounds mushier, not as clear. It's not a dramatic difference, but I certainly hear it. Not everyone will prefer the CR, it depends on one's taste. I like it.