Archtop string issues - anyone use a plain third on their archtop?

[Meggy]

I use DAddario Chromes 30-40-50 from a standard set, and combine that with plain coated Elixirs (single strings) 12, 14 and 18. All my archtops have that string configuration. I do not like a wound 3rd. That has something to do with my solid body background. ANd I do like an unwound 3rd. A little benefit is that in this way, I can replace the high 3 strings before I replace the 3 bottom strings. Disadvantage is that I buy complete sets of chromes and only use half the set.

Cheers hotpepper01 - I can see where you're coming from with those gauges, speaking also as someone who has played jazz on solidbody and semi-solid guitars, using 11s round wounds - that's kind of a flatwound version of an 11s set, and then just the high E beefed up a bit to a 12. I think a lot of the reason I'm not so keen on flatwounds is the guitar I use - if it was a carved top, built for acoustic response/volume as a major factor, then I suspect flats would be better. But as a small-ish laminate top, it just seems to be better with the half rounds.

Man, i thought my set up was slightly odd, but your,s takes it to a whole new level, it works for you so good on ya, but i play mostly fingerstyle and that would throw my game out the window.
Cheers John.

You're setup is really odd John (but great of course, and more power to you I say).

Packet attached

Cheers, those look good!

[Lobomov]

I've been using a set of chromes with a plain g-string forever. My wrists have forced me down in gauge over the years, so currently it a set of 11s with a .019 plain g-string.

[Meggy]

I've been using a set of chromes with a plain g-string forever. My wrists have forced me down in gauge over the years, so currently it a set of 11s with a .019 plain g-string.

Thanks Lobomov - personally, I doubt you lose very much, if anything, by going to a lighter gauge. I say that in view of my own recent experience dropping from 13s to 11s - the tone is a little different perhaps, but no worse - if anything, the clarity and note separation seems improved.

[Cunamara]

As I get older I seem to be losing my knee-jerk prejudice against lighter strings. I haven't yet actually dropped down a gauge or two on most of my guitars yet, since I am well-stocked with strings to use up first. But listening to players like Bickert, Hall, Abercrombie who sound so good with light strings makes me think that there may not be as much- if anything- lost as I thought.

With the nonadjustable blade of the CC pickup, I did find I had to do some mixing and matching to get a good string balance. Currently I am using Vinci round wound nickel plated strings in a custom set of .013 - .017 - .024w - .032 - .042 - .050 on both my archtop (with floating CC pickup) and Tele (with CC neck pickup). Vinci's wound strings are bright but they balance well tonally against the plain strings, which makes it pretty easy to get a sound that's consistent across the neck. You (Meggy) might be having the same sort of result with the Brite Flats. Vinci makes flats too, have not tried those; I tend to find that I am a round wound guy.

FWIW Vinci will make up a custom set for you at a very reasonable price. IIRC I paid about $4 a set for half a dozen sets a couple of months ago- if I had gotten them with a spare E and B I think it would have been about $6 a set.

[Meggy]

As I get older I seem to be losing my knee-jerk prejudice against lighter strings. I haven't yet actually dropped down a gauge or two on most of my guitars yet, since I am well-stocked with strings to use up first. But listening to players like Bickert, Hall, Abercrombie who sound so good with light strings makes me think that there may not be as much- if anything- lost as I thought.

With the nonadjustable blade of the CC pickup, I did find I had to do some mixing and matching to get a good string balance. Currently I am using Vinci round wound nickel plated strings in a custom set of .013 - .017 - .024w - .032 - .042 - .050 on both my archtop (with floating CC pickup) and Tele (with CC neck pickup). Vinci's wound strings are bright but they balance well tonally against the plain strings, which makes it pretty easy to get a sound that's consistent across the neck. You (Meggy) might be having the same sort of result with the Brite Flats. Vinci makes flats too, have not tried those; I tend to find that I am a round wound guy.

FWIW Vinci will make up a custom set for you at a very reasonable price. IIRC I paid about $4 a set for half a dozen sets a couple of months ago- if I had gotten them with a spare E and B I think it would have been about $6 a set.

Thanks @Cunamara - that is extremely friendly pricing for those Vinci strings I must say. Very pleased to learn about them anyhow, and I had a look on their website. It appears that what they call their "flatwound" sets may actually be half-rounds, as the description says:

"Thomas Vinci Electric Strings are favored by most musicians worldwide. These strings are ground down to precision manufactured to ensure consistency, optimum performance and long life.
Real smooth strings that all can love."

So are you able to confirm if they are the ground smooth, half-round type of string, or more standard tape-wound strings? If they are half-rounds, then I'm very interested indeed.

I've just got a new CC pickup installed on my own guitar, which I love more and more, and with the GHS brite flats 11s set, the balance across the strings is actually very good indeed. As to string gauge, I'm sure it is possible to go too light - I don't think I'd want to try a set of 9's , but with the 11s I still seem to be getting the arch top sound working, and the amplified tone still seems satisfyingly full-bodied.

[coder]

When you guys switch between wrapped and unwrapped G, do you adjust your intonation?

The factory carved archtop bridges from Eastman are intoned for a non-wrapped G, as I recall.
Tends to sound pretty horrible intonation-wise with a wrapped G. Maybe that is the real reason
why some folks like to switch to a non-wrapped G?

An unwrapped G requires the intonation point to be pulled back, to form a more or less strait
slanted line for the top 3 unwrapped strings.

This is because wrapped strings behave differently from unwrapped.

A wrapped G-s intonation point needs to be pushed forward (towards the head)
to form a strait slanted line with the other wrapped strings.
E.g.: wrapped G intonation ( for illustration purposes)

E xxxx
B xx
G xxxx
D xxx
A xx
E x

Non-wrapped G intonation (for illustration purposes)
E xxxx
B xxx
G xx
D xxxx
A xxx
E xx

A well-intoned instrument has a pleasant gestalt to it, all kinds of chords
just sound good anywhere on the neck.
Many players do not pick up on the intonation being off (or spot on), they just
perceive a gestalt overall "goodness" to the guitar.

[oldane]

When you guys switch between wrapped and unwrapped G, do you adjust your intonation?

Not news to many here, but anyway:

I don't use unwound G strings but if I did, I would certainly have to adjust the intonation at the bridge. It's easy with a TOM but with wood bridges the bridge top has to be replaced. The ebony bridge tops Sadowsky sells comes in two versions, one for wound G and another for unwound G. Another solution is to have a luthier custom cut a bridge top. I had Irish luthier John Moriarty do that a couple of times. Sadly, due to an overwhelming work load he was forced to stop offering that service.

BTW some of the compensated wood bridges sold are actually overcompensated which is just as bad as too little compensation.

And BTW, intonation up and down the fretboard can also be put off by too high nut grooves (playing sharp in the lower part of the fretboard) and excessive neck relief.

[don_oz]

I pretty much use D'adarrio 0.11s to 0.49 or 0.48. They have plain G and i think its fine. I also have newtone archtop strings 0.11 to 0.49 on my carved top which is double wrapped and has a mellower sound with a wound g, also nice.

[pingu]

sorry to revive the thread folks
————-

anyone using TI jazz flats 11 with the 19
wound 3rd ?

can you bend the 3rd string up a tone easily for bluesy type things ?

or will i need to change to a plain 3rd

thanks

[Peter C]

You're going to get a wound G when you buy the set anyway. Try it and if you don't feel comfortable with it, swap it out.

[nopedals]

Full step bends on the G string, especially the Chuck Berry thing, used to be my favorite lick. But even if you're strong enough to do it with a wrapped G, you can't get the same sound.

As my playing style evolved, and I went to heavier strings, I just started sliding to the note on the G string instead of bending to it. Once I made that tradeoff I never looked back.

[SoftwareGuy]

Try the D'Addario NYXL rounds with the wound 3rd. Great strings.

Yeah, me too, on my Collins Eastside. I have tried flatwounds, but feel I loose to much acoustic quality of the CC pickups and guitar. But that is just my taste.

[citizenk74]

sorry to revive the thread folks
————-

anyone using TI jazz flats 11 with the 19
wound 3rd ?

can you bend the 3rd string up a tone easily for bluesy type things ?

or will i need to change to a plain 3rd

thanks

With a wound 0.019 I would be more concerned that a whole-step bend would sooner or later be interrupted by a broken string. Not a good thing at any time, but also a time-consuming embarrassment if you happen to be onstage. Just sayin'. On my archtops with tune-o-matics I usually use a plain G, 0.018 or so. With a wooden bridge, I use a wound G and avoid bending more than a half-step. Good luck!