1959 D'Angelico Excel

[fws6]

Thats a nice story sgcim !

there was a pic on here a while back, of John, Jimmy Dq, and Johnny Smith together having lunch in a typical Little Italy restaurant, but I cannot find it anymore

[Max405]

I hear you Pepe. I have never heard that John D'Angelico gave special preference to customers of Italian origin. Two of his best Customers were Mel Bay and Johnny Smith, both of whom got very special treatment and neither were Italian.

Come on man.. I find it hard to believe that Johnny Smith didn't have some Italian in him..

Speaking from experience, we don't stick together like most people would think. In fact, there are different groups of Italians, (Napolitano, Siciliano, Calabrese, Piedmontese..) and generally don't get along with one another. My parents were both Napolitano and I always wondered why they had a feud brewing between the Sicilians downstairs. It was just a way of life.

My guess was John only cared about making a great guitar. And he worked on customers guitars that weren't even his own. That's how he and Ron DeMarino met. John used to fix Rons L5..

One thing is for certain.. Around Johns Shop in Lower Manhattan are some of the greatest restaurants you will ever experience. Not only Italian restaurants and bakeries, but just down the block is Chinatown. Try a couple of places there one day. And Jewish deli's.. Oh my god. One time I had a huge fried egg roll that was filled with the potato from a knish and it had a hotdog inside of it.. With some Hebrew national mustard, You eat it and you will realize how great it is to be alive..

Thanks Joe, I'm starving now..

[john_a]

Fantastic instrument, I get the idea that all my other guitars could go away if I had that one.
Not my usually reaction to seeing a great guitar (where I get a desire to add it to my six string arsenal)

And that pickguard came out great! Thanks for the story and pics.

John

[wintermoon]

Thats a nice story sgcim !

there was a pic on here a while back, of John, Jimmy Dq, and Johnny Smith together having lunch in a typical Little Italy restaurant, but I cannot find it anymore

[Max405]

This could have been Umbertos Clam house.
Its on Mulberry Street, basically right around the corner from where Johns Shop was. I remember the small tables. No good for me. I order too much food.
JD

[sgcim]

Come on man.. I find it hard to believe that Johnny Smith didn't have some Italian in him..

Speaking from experience, we don't stick together like most people would think. In fact, there are different groups of Italians, (Napolitano, Siciliano, Calabrese, Piedmontese..) and generally don't get along with one another. My parents were both Napolitano and I always wondered why they had a feud brewing between the Sicilians downstairs. It was just a way of life.

My guess was John only cared about making a great guitar. And he worked on customers guitars that weren't even his own. That's how he and Ron DeMarino met. John used to fix Rons L5..

One thing is for certain.. Around Johns Shop in Lower Manhattan are some of the greatest restaurants you will ever experience. Not only Italian restaurants and bakeries, but just down the block is Chinatown. Try a couple of places there one day. And Jewish deli's.. Oh my god. One time I had a huge fried egg roll that was filled with the potato from a knish and it had a hotdog inside of it.. With some Hebrew national mustard, You eat it and you will realize how great it is to be alive..

Thanks Joe, I'm starving now..

I'm sorry Joe, but now that I've found out you're Napolitan, I'll have to put you on Ignore. The Sicilian Brotherhood would be very upset to find out that I've been responding to posts from a Napolitan, so I'm gonna have to delete any of my posts that responded to yours, and take back all the likes I've given your posts.
Like my Sicilian father used to say to me, "Kid, we're friends to the end- but this is the end".

The best restaurant in Little Italy that I used to gig at was SPQR. I used to take it for granted back then that I was eating at the best Italian restaurant in NYC for free, and also being paid.

[Stringswinger]

Umberto's Clam house? I remember that place. IIRC, Joey Gallo had a meal there that he came to regret.

[Max405]

I'm sorry Joe, but now that I've found out you're Napolitan, I'll have to put you on Ignore. The Sicilian Brotherhood would be very upset to find out that I've been responding to posts from a Napolitan, so I'm gonna have to delete any of my posts that responded to yours, and take back all the likes I've given your posts.
Like my Sicilian father used to say to me, "Kid, we're friends to the end- but this is the end".

The best restaurant in Little Italy that I used to gig at was SPQR. I used to take it for granted back then that I was eating at the best Italian restaurant in NYC for free, and also being paid.

See what I mean... Actually I was deleted when I sold my Excel.

S.P.Q.R was always known for shit service. They closed a couple of years ago I think. I remember the big red sign..

I'll take my Carmines any day..

If John D'Angelico ate at Carmines, he would have made more 18, 19 and even 20" guitars!

Joe D

[Max405]

Umberto's Clam house? I remember that place. IIRC, Joey Gallo had a meal there that he came to regret.

You know I think you might be right. I know one of them was killed there. I thought it was Anastasia. But I get them confused. I think because Albert Anastasia's real 1st name was Umberto.. That's what my family said any way..

[Max405]

I am sorry Fsw6, I didn't mean to take over your post. I tend to do that on occasion. Back to the wonderful guitar you have..
You've owned and played them all.. How does this rank? Especially against the L5 that it was modeled after?
I never knew John made a guitar like that. Like I said, you see don't something like that every day..
Joe D

[fws6]

Thats Okay Joe, Dangelico even built guitars for the mobsters (actually, a mando)

[sgcim]

See what I mean... Actually I was deleted when I sold my Excel.

S.P.Q.R was always known for shit service. They closed a couple of years ago I think. I remember the big red sign..

I'll take my Carmines any day..

If John D'Angelico ate at Carmines, he would have made more 18, 19 and even 20" guitars!

Joe D

Nah, that was just the D'A Club. Ask our two leaders, Frank and SS if they'll let you back in.
Frank, my 1st guitar teacher had a blonde Excel just like yours, exquisite!

[Stringswinger]

And as far as I am concerned, JD is an honorary member of the DA club at the JGF for life.

[citizenk74]

And as far as I am concerned, JD is an honorary member of the DA club at the JGF for life.

Hear, hear!

[rabbit]

fws6.

Very Beautiful, congratulations!


Max405,

My mother's people were from Naples!

[GNAPPI]

Jeez, I'm hungry. There should be a thread in the "Everything Else" side on Italian food, restaurants, and Italians in general :-)

[Max405]

And as far as I am concerned, JD is an honorary member of the DA club at the JGF for life.

Thank you brother. One day, when my ship comes in.. it will have a Rolls Royce Wraith parked on the rear deck. When you open the door, there will be glass case where the backseat use to be. Inside the case, will be a 1955 D'Angelico New Yorker. Mint.. I will pick you up in Monterey and a week later, we will be cruising around the streets of Fiji. We can even get some of that fancy water while we are down there..

fws6.
Max405,
My mother's people were from Naples!

Coniglio, I've never been there. My Mom was born there and my father was made there. One day..

Jeez, I'm hungry. There should be a thread in the "Everything Else" side on Italian food, restaurants, and Italians in general :-)

Gnappi, often misunderstood, our people are more than just mobsters. Passionate, Creative, Loving and Strong. It is said that every Italian is born with a song in his mouth. Number 1, I am proud to be an American. But I am also honored to represent my Heritage whenever I can.

Joe D

[fws6]

You've owned and played them all.. How does this rank? Especially against the L5 that it was modeled after?
I never knew John made a guitar like that. Like I said, you see don't something like that every day..
Joe D

To my ears the guitar is definately a bit different sounding from my L-5 still (I have two L-5ces's both from the same age 1959/1960; one will be for sale shortly)

I think D'Angelico intended this Excel to be an electric from the beginning, so the top was carved to be a bit less repsponding as an acoustic. I mean, it is very nicely balanced but lesser loud accoustically than the Excel with a floater I have. But maybe what i think to hear is also caused by the way the pickups are mounted.

The original Franz pickups were mounted directly onto the top with just a smaller hole for the leads underneath. On an L5ces, the pickups are suspended hanging in the top from the pickup rings. Now whoever installed the Gibson humbuckers on the Dangelico also did wisely, at least in my opinion. In stead of reaming pickup holes all the way to humbucker size - and likely cutting through the bracing in the process - he bent the humbucker feet sideways, clipped off the ends, and then mounted them directly on the top again. So you cannot adjust the pickups other than by the pole pieces in that way, but keeping the braces intact is worth 10x more to me.

I think having the pickups directly on the top also accounts a bit for the fact that the guitar is responding less like a full acoustic and more like an electric-acoustic, a bit less loud in volume, and aslo a bit 'tighter' if that makes any sense. And in contrast to the L5ces there's no rattling too ;-)

with an amp of course the duifference is minimal if any. And maybe it is all subjective anyways.

[Max405]

FWS6,
That was a brilliant explanation. Obviously someone used a lot of care not to mutilate a guitar that has legendary status. I understand what you mean by the rattle caused by the Gibson method of mounting pickups. The solution for your guitar was well thought out and elegant.
I think John would have been proud of the way one of his babies has been treated. And I am sure he is glad this one ended up in your hands. You have done a lot to maintain the exclusitivity of these ultra rare, incredibly fine instruments.
Thanks for sharing this guitar with us.
By the way, you absolutely kicked ass on the pickguard..
Joe D

To my ears the guitar is definately a bit different sounding from my L-5 still (I have two L-5ces's both from the same age 1959/1960; one will be for sale shortly)

I think D'Angelico intended this Excel to be an electric from the beginning, so the top was carved to be a bit less repsponding as an acoustic. I mean, it is very nicely balanced but lesser loud accoustically than the Excel with a floater I have. But maybe what i think to hear is also caused by the way the pickups are mounted.

The original Franz pickups were mounted directly onto the top with just a smaller hole for the leads underneath. On an L5ces, the pickups are suspended hanging in the top from the pickup rings. Now whoever installed the Gibson humbuckers on the Dangelico also did wisely, at least in my opinion. In stead of reaming pickup holes all the way to humbucker size - and likely cutting through the bracing in the process - he bent the humbucker feet sideways, clipped off the ends, and then mounted them directly on the top again. So you cannot adjust the pickups other than by the pole pieces in that way, but keeping the braces intact is worth 10x more to me.

I think having the pickups directly on the top also accounts a bit for the fact that the guitar is responding less like a full acoustic and more like an electric-acoustic, a bit less loud in volume, and aslo a bit 'tighter' if that makes any sense. And in contrast to the L5ces there's no rattling too ;-)

with an amp of course the duifference is minimal if any. And maybe it is all subjective anyways.

[fws6]

FWS6,
By the way, you absolutely kicked ass on the pickguard..
Joe D

i love to make gibson and Epi guards but tne DA are terrible to do, with the mitres in the stairsteps. I really dislike making those but glad it came out okay. When someone else asks me, I always say I cant...

[sgcim]

i love to make gibson and Epi guards but tne DA are terrible to do, with the mitres in the stairsteps. I really dislike making those but glad it came out okay. When someone else asks me, I always say I cant...

When Roger Borys saw the pick guard I had on my D'A, he almost got sick!
He asked me for a picture of my father playing the guitar back in the 30s, and he tried to find the guard that came closest to it.
He finally came up with a beautiful L-5 guard that he installed for next to nothing, because he loves that guitar.
He even made a copy of that model for someone using Bucky's Snake Head as a model.
I got him to attach the Guild copy of the DeArmond RC-1100 to it, but I took it off when I realized it didn't sound as good as my D'A sounded with an original RC-1000, and it also affected the acoustic sound of the instrument too much.
I think it was a combination of the D'A, the original RC-1000 and a PV Vintage with two 12" SRO EVs that gave it that huge, sonorous sound.

[deacon Mark]

I have made a number of D'a pickguards they can be a pita. You have to do a number of them together and use a good jig. I have couple I made that are less than perfect, I get lazy and in a hurry. If someone wants one cheap PM and I will let them go cheap. Normally to do a 7 ply New Yorker guard I need. $275 in black. A tortoise can be $350. Once did a 9 ply that was the whole frosting and cake.

[fws6]

it also affected the acoustic sound of the instrument too much.

the placement of the pickup altered the acoustic sound ? Is that what you are saying ? Or do you mean it did not keep enough of the acoustic sound when amplified ?

[Groyniad]

look i know this is not allowed - but i'm just too curious and i can't help it

how much (roughly) was that?

i bet it sounds unbelievable - i had no idea such a guitar existed

[sgcim]

the placement of the pickup altered the acoustic sound ? Is that what you are saying ? Or do you mean it did not keep enough of the acoustic sound when amplified ?

The placement of the pickup altered the acoustic sound.