Gibson ES-165

[Max405]

Hi Everyone,

After seeing this guitar, I had to have it. I had to sell an outstanding ES175 in order to buy this. Once the 175 sold, I pounced on it. I'm glad I did.

I owned a 165 before. And I loved it. It was essentially a 175D with a sensible space left in the position where a bridge pickup normally goes. It is a great guitar. Now onto this one..

I am shocked. This guitar is so radically different than the 165 designed for Herb Ellis. It is more Heritage Johnny Smith than ES175. So, I am officially renaming this guitar. From now on, it is the Gibson ES170IMD, Joe DeNisco Signature model. Why?

-Its pretty
-It is a chord melody machine
-It has the most comfortable 24-3/4" scale length.
-It has a floating pick-up that begs you to plug in at low volume so you hear it acoustically and electrically at the same time.
-It is an unbelievably lively Gibson. Kinda like the Eastman clones.
-Its not bright (just like me). It is just very clear and defined.
-Its a strong sturdy guitar, but very lightweight.

I said the guitar is more HJS than 175 because its really a great acoustic guitar. When plugged in with the right volume balance, the confluence of electric and acoustic sound is heavenly. I hear things in this guitar that I've only heard in the HJS. And, it plays Johnny Smith perfectly. The 3-1/2" depth really brings out the drop D tuning and turns the guitar into a baby grand piano. My wife said this guitar sounds better than all the other guitars. My son said, it looks like "fire".

No guitar comes without issues. And it seems, most Gibsons I've had were static monsters. The static that I generate with my right hand on the pickguard is borderline ridiculous. It clicks like crazy through the amp. So I will need to get use to the smell of dryer sheets. Also, the neck on this guitar is a bit chunkier than any other Gibson I've had, except for the maybe 135. The neck heel is really big. Almost "obstacle" big.. I'll figure it out. No problem.

The slightly downsized headstock is adorned with the Gibson Logo and Crown, in Mother of Pearl. The Gold Grover tuners are Kluson-like smooth. No play at all. The fretboard material is Rosewood (not as Brazilian looking as my previous 165) and the inlays are the same material that is found in the 175. Gorgeous, luxurious, simple and divine. The frets are medium medium. The dead straight neck takes low action beautifully.

The case that came with this guitar is something I wouldn't mind living in. Its an Emerald Green fur lined faux alligator affair, complete with the sexy satin shroud.

Video to come, (of course) but for now I have a few pictures.

Thanks everyone.

Oh, by the way.. For those wondering what "IMD" means.. it means, "In my Dreams". The Gibson ES170 In my dreams Joe DeNisco Signature model. This is it and I wouldn't change a thing about it, except maybe I would make the label inside the body the shape of a stuffed artichoke or a pizza. And I would hand sign the 1 or 2 that they would sell (probably to my relatives).

[mr. beaumont]

Well, shoot, I never thought much of these ("Who'd put a floater on a laminate?" and all that) but after hearing your review, now I'd like to try one!

Sure is gorgeous. Nice find!

[skykomishone]

Very cool Joe, Congrats on the NGD my friend! When was it made? I've never seen one like this. Looks incredible. I love it. Can't wait to hear a clip.

[Longways to Go]

Happy NGD!

That 165 reminds me so much of one that haunts me, only yours is a lighter colored burst. Lovely.

[NSJ]

Well, shoot, I never thought much of these ("Who'd put a floater on a laminate?" and all that!

George Benson ? Howard Roberts ?

my HR sounds incredible after I refretted per Joe D 's experince with the Gold EVO stainless

[QAman]

Congrats Joe !! It's a gorgeous guitar. Glad it has that magic we all seek in an instrument.

[lawson-stone]

Theory... you say the body seems lighter. I also know my VOS1959 is very noticeably lighter even than "your" (now my) ES165, even thought he VOS1959 has more hardware.

I wonder if they used the same body (surface woods excepted) for these 165s as they did for the VOS1959 ES175? I've come to really like the lightness and liveliness of the VOS model. It eliminates my thinking "Why do I have two very similar guitars? The 165 and 175?" Because the VOS is such a different animal, I feel like I have the best of both worlds.

Can't wait to hear you play this one. I'm thinking of learning the Berkley chord melody arrangement of "Here's That Rainy Day" and using your clip as my reference... maybe you could record yourself playing that one!

[Stringswinger]

Congrats JD. I would wish you years of inspiration, but you do not seem to keep them for very long. May you enjoy this guitar as part of your "guitar-tester" avocation.

My 2008 ES-175 had the giant heel and chunky neck. I could not bond with it, but unlike you, I like slim 60's style necks. I hope you adapt to all that wood.

[BigMikeinNJ]

Drop dead gorgeous Joe, and that volume knob on the pick guard is very JS single pickup similar. Reading the text I didn't know what hue it would be but when I saw the pictures I went SCHWINNNNGGGGGG !!!! over it.
You did good young man.

And floater on a laminate GB and HR of course !!

[mr. beaumont]

George Benson ? Howard Roberts ?

my HR sounds incredible after I refretted per Joe D 's experince with the Gold EVO stainless

Well, the HR's I've played have always had a pretty good acoustic tone. I remember even playing a cheaper Epiphone one from the 90's. I've never played a modern era 175 that sounded like much.

Bensons are just NOT for me. They sound great in the right hands, those hands are not mine.

[Greentone]

Joe,

Congratulations! Seems as if the right guitar ended up in the right hands. The ES-165 with floating pickup begs to be played fingerstyle, or at least chord-melody style...a perfect small JS engine.

If you don't have a dog or cat loose in the house, it's the right guitar to have out on a stand next to the amp with everything ready to just switch on--already at the preset, perfect level for an acoustic/electric balance.

GT

[Marty Grass]

Well, how can you top that beauty? Not possible.

Nice one, Joe.

[Bobby Marshall]

If I had an ES175, I don't think I would have sold it to get an ES165, but I am glad you did as it seems you have found one that you connect with and that is what matters. It's so much better when it feels right.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[rio]

Well, shoot, I never thought much of these ("Who'd put a floater on a laminate?" and all that) but after hearing your review, now I'd like to try one!

Sure is gorgeous. Nice find!

Same here and now I am curious as well.

That is quite a looker - congrats!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[neatomic]

"floater" pickup makes no contact with body...therefore top wood is less relevant..for purely electric tone!!! of course the acoustic tone has a great deal to do with the "playability" of the guitar..how the player reacts to what he hears...so some may prefer a louder acoustic tone mixed with their amp sound..while others like the more purely electric tone

the design of pickup/floater, guitar setup and strings would affect the tone of the 165 more than the solid vs lami top....thru an amp!!

cheers

[Max405]

Thanks everyone.
Just put another 2 hours in. Definitely the clearest sounding guitar I've ever played. Not a dead spot on the entire neck. Every note has definition. Almost like my JP20. But this guitar has a unique deep throaty sound. I thought I would get use to this guitar immediately, but It's going to take a little time. Im not sure why. Timing is off a hair. But it continues to remind me of the HJS.
Joe D

[citizenk74]

That's a beautiful guitar, and that sunburst is extra-nice. Congratulations on bonding with a fine guitar, and make it sing in good health!

[Lobomov]

Is this different than the herb ellis 165 with the floater or is it the herb ellis?

[JazzNote]

Joe, when i saw this guitar a while ago i was very much tempted to buy it myself. What a beauty! Congratulations! I hope you will get used to it soon.

[Bflat233]

That is a truly unique and beautiful guitar! You are fortunate and sound so grateful to have found a soul mate.

What you said about static electricity ... I had a 1998 165 Herb Ellis with a set-in pick-up in mint condition and a wonderful tone. But most days I played it, in most rooms, you could literally see the sparks fly from my fingertips to the strings. I tried dryer sheets, and they helped some. As a last ditch effort - I swapped out the electronics - but that didn't help. Perhaps most frustrating, I asked my teacher and a friend play it and ... no static popping whatsoever. It was the way my body chemistry was reacting to that guitar. So reluctantly, I sold it.

I replaced it with an Eastman 371 and have played it happily for a next couple of years, and though a great sounding guitar, it didn't quite scratch my itch for the Gibson. I now have a 2016 1959 ES-175D and love it. Static? yep, a tad bit now and then with both guitars, but nothing close to the electrical storm I experienced with the 165.

All the best with yours, looking forward to a recording. I second Lawson's request for Here's That Rainy Day.

[Max405]

Well, shoot, I never thought much of these ("Who'd put a floater on a laminate?" and all that) but after hearing your review, now I'd like to try one!
Sure is gorgeous. Nice find!

MB,
You would be surprised if you tried one. If I was blindfolded, I would think its a 175 variant. Very different.
JD

Very cool Joe, Congrats on the NGD my friend! When was it made? I've never seen one like this. Looks incredible. I love it. Can't wait to hear a clip.

Thanks buddy. The un-filled out warranty card and cert says it was born on 12-4-2003. It really looks like it was born a month ago. Crazy..

Happy NGD!
That 165 reminds me so much of one that haunts me, only yours is a lighter colored burst. Lovely.

The lighter color burst is very caramel in color. I kinda wish it was a little darker around the edges. But it is beautiful.

George Benson ? Howard Roberts ?
my HR sounds incredible after I refretted per Joe D 's experince with the Gold EVO stainless

NSJ, I am glad it worked out for you bro. Its amazing how refretting scares people. I was mortified. By my Johnny came back virtually untouched.

Theory... you say the body seems lighter. I also know my VOS1959 is very noticeably lighter even than "your" (now my) ES165, even thought he VOS1959 has more hardware.
I wonder if they used the same body (surface woods excepted) for these 165s as they did for the VOS1959 ES175? I've come to really like the lightness and liveliness of the VOS model. It eliminates my thinking "Why do I have two very similar guitars? The 165 and 175?" Because the VOS is such a different animal, I feel like I have the best of both worlds.
Can't wait to hear you play this one. I'm thinking of learning the Berkley chord melody arrangement of "Here's That Rainy Day" and using your clip as my reference... maybe you could record yourself playing that one!

I will do that for you Lawson, my pleasure.
As for the body, I don't want to mislead anyone. This guitar is not a lightweight. Its still a sturdy, Gibson build. Its lighter because there is less hardware on it. Not because it was made to be lighter. I will weigh it.
Its not a runner. Its more Jeep than Lotus. I think it has TI-13's on it, I am not sure. And once I put the Tunomatic back on it, I think it will feel different.

Joe,
Congratulations! Seems as if the right guitar ended up in the right hands. The ES-165 with floating pickup begs to be played fingerstyle, or at least chord-melody style...a perfect small JS engine.
If you don't have a dog or cat loose in the house, it's the right guitar to have out on a stand next to the amp with everything ready to just switch on--already at the preset, perfect level for an acoustic/electric balance.
GT

GT, You hit it on the head. A perfect small JS.
But, as Vinny has said, the 170 will live in a glass coffin. Its too perfect for those pesky dust particles to land on it, and too beautiful to not be seen.. Thanks bro.

Well, how can you top that beauty? Not possible.
Nice one, Joe.

MG Thanks bud. I really don't think I can top it. I outkicked the coverage on this one. Maybe that's why I am not 100% comfortable with it yet. I don't want to ruin it..

If I had an ES175, I don't think I would have sold it to get an ES165, but I am glad you did as it seems you have found one that you connect with and that is what matters. It's so much better when it feels right.

Bobby, I was waiting for that one. And you have every right to feel that way. Before I did the deal, I thought the same thing. But I don't see the 165 as being less than the 175. I bought this one because conceptually, I was intrigued by the floater and because of its beauty. I have a feeling, there is at least one more 175 in my future, if not an L4ces. But surprisingly, this one is not anything like a 175 or a 165 for that matter. And its certainly not lesser version of a 175.

Same here and now I am curious as well.
That is quite a looker - congrats!

Thanks Rio!

Is this different than the herb ellis 165 with the floater or is it the herb ellis?

No sir, its a Herb Ellis 165. For some reason unknown to me, Gibson changed the spec on this guitar. If anyone actually knows why they put a floater on a Herb Ellis 165, I'd love to know why.JD

[Bobby Marshall]

I wasn't thinking the 165 was "less", just that the es175 is one of the iconic jazz guitar models and, if I had one that I liked, I would not sell on the chance I might like something else more. Having a reliable instrument that I connect with musically is the goal. I don't have this connection on an archtop (yet). Again, no matter the brand or model, if you find a connection, then it is the right guitar (for you). You have chosen wisely. Cheers.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[Max405]

Joe, when i saw this guitar a while ago i was very much tempted to buy it myself. What a beauty! Congratulations! I hope you will get used to it soon.

As you know if a guitar is in QAMan's past, its going to be as pristine an example as you will find. I hope I get used to it soon too!

That's a beautiful guitar, and that sunburst is extra-nice. Congratulations on bonding with a fine guitar, and make it sing in good health!

C74, I'm not there yet with the bonding, but hopefully it will come. Thanks buddy.

"floater" pickup makes no contact with body...therefore top wood is less relevant..for purely electric tone!!! of course the acoustic tone has a great deal to do with the "playability" of the guitar..how the player reacts to what he hears...so some may prefer a louder acoustic tone mixed with their amp sound..while others like the more purely electric tone,
the design of pickup/floater, guitar setup and strings would affect the tone of the 165 more than the solid vs lami top....thru an amp!!
cheers

Neatomic, I see what you are saying. I hope when I do record, I am able to capture the sound I hear when I play it. The sound of this guitar just blows me away. The clarity is top shelf. And I am not trying to find a nice way to say it is bright. I am not. It is full. Deep. High and low and mid. The clarity is the best I've ever heard. Thanks Buddy.

Drop dead gorgeous Joe, and that volume knob on the pick guard is very JS single pickup similar. Reading the text I didn't know what hue it would be but when I saw the pictures I went SCHWINNNNGGGGGG !!!! over it.
You did good young man.
And floater on a laminate GB and HR of course !!

Big Mikey, You gotta be careful. If you SCHWING, you could potentially knock over some very expensive guitars over there.. Thank you bro.

Congrats JD. I would wish you years of inspiration, but you do not seem to keep them for very long. May you enjoy this guitar as part of your "guitar-tester" avocation.
My 2008 ES-175 had the giant heel and chunky neck. I could not bond with it, but unlike you, I like slim 60's style necks. I hope you adapt to all that wood.

yep, you know me SS. My quest, landed me 2 keepers. Hopefully this will be a 3rd. So far it checks most of the boxes. But the BIG one at the end is most important, the BONDING box. I got my sharpie ready. Gotta try a couple of things.

Congrats Joe !! It's a gorgeous guitar. Glad it has that magic we all seek in an instrument.

Like I said, if a guitar has been in QAman's past, it is sure be a perfect example. Thanks for finding this guitar. You are right, its as if it hasn't been out of the case in 10 years. Unreal. Thanks bro.

Thanks everyone!
Joe D

[Max405]

That is a truly unique and beautiful guitar! You are fortunate and sound so grateful to have found a soul mate.
What you said about static electricity ... I had a 1998 165 Herb Ellis with a set-in pick-up in mint condition and a wonderful tone. But most days I played it, in most rooms, you could literally see the sparks fly from my fingertips to the strings. I tried dryer sheets, and they helped some. As a last ditch effort - I swapped out the electronics - but that didn't help. Perhaps most frustrating, I asked my teacher and a friend play it and ... no static popping whatsoever. It was the way my body chemistry was reacting to that guitar. So reluctantly, I sold it.
I replaced it with an Eastman 371 and have played it happily for a next couple of years, and though a great sounding guitar, it didn't quite scratch my itch for the Gibson. I now have a 1959 ES 175 (2017) and love it. Static? yep, a tad bit now and then with both guitars, but nothing close to the electrical storm I experienced with the 165.
All the best with yours, looking forward to a recording. I second Lawson's request for Here's That Rainy Day.

3WR, I am glad you posted this. Static drives me crazy. Last night, even with a dryer sheet stuffed under the PG after I laid it on top of the PG for a bit, it was poppin like crazy. Like really bad. Then, the rim jack came loose. So I tightened it down, just with my finger. And low and behold, the guitar didn't pop that much for almost 2 hours.
I am gonna crank it down tonight, in the same rotation that it is in right now. Hopefully, that will do it.
I will let you know.
Joe D

[Max405]

I wasn't thinking the 165 was "less", just that the es175 is one of the iconic jazz guitar models and, if I had one that I liked, I would not sell on the chance I might like something else more. Having a reliable instrument that I connect with musically is the goal. I don't have this connection on an archtop (yet). Again, no matter the brand or model, if you find a connection, then it is the right guitar (for you). You have chosen wisely. Cheers.

Thanks for clarifying that. Im sorry I was wrong.
I am waiting for the connection to snap into place. I am really praying it does. Because, on paper, this guitar should be in my "Gallery of the Greats".. We will see.
Thanks Bobby!