-
I think it depends on what guitars you are looking at. Any examples?
Originally Posted by GNAPPI
I don't particularly see remarkably low prices on guitars I would want to buy. I usually don't even see them on the market.
I've seen quite expensive guitars and amps still get sold very quickly. Lots of people are still buying Gibson's Signature Les Paul's - just a regular Historic with a name attached, like the Mike McCready. $6699! And there is the 'nouveau rare' class of gear that get sold very quickly probably by people who don't want to get into vintage e.g. Collings archtops, certain amps from small builders, etc.
Vintage gear is still strong and small pockets are jumping in value like small brownface and blackface Fender's.
-
01-03-2017 03:37 PM
-
There is a lack of good wood of certain species. Good luck finding some straigh-grained, quarter sawn Brazilian big enough for a dreadnaught for a decent price. Originally Posted by Archtop Bill
Many of the top builders have been using stumpwood. Wildly figured - maybe can be passed as good looking, but it's less stable.
Madagascar rosewood is getting more expensive. Builders are using Spanish cedar in place of Honduran mahagony.
That said, vintage instruments aren't really priced based on their sound despite what their owners would say. A lot of it is strictly collectability. A flatter necked 1960 ES-335 is going to command way less than a fatter necked 1959. Fatter necks are popular now. Not really any other difference in the two guitars. Thin necks were the rage for a bit back in the 80s-early 90s. Fads...
It's not even rarity in a lot of cases. There are way less ES-345s than ES-335s. The Varitone isn't popular though, despite being easily removable and transforming a 345 into a 335 with fancier appointments
The Patent Applied For sticker on a pickup will raise the price by $1-2k over its early patent number sticker sibling. Identical construction (though some PAFs had long magnets early on).
Those 50s-60s Guild's were as good or better than their Gibson counter-parts, but Guild's aren't anywhere as pricey.
-
Or, when those tax returns hit in spring - you'll see more buyers. Originally Posted by blille
You'll also see people saying they're selling, in an ad, to cover taxes, but it's usually a ploy, imo as they aren't pricing as aggressive as somebody who needs to pay Uncle Sam. The ad just sits for weeks.
You know I've been on the prowl when those overpaid taxes come, but I don't recall finding Uncle Sam deals these past years.
-
Another possible factor... those of us baby boomers who are nearing or just entering retirement. I'm retiring in 16 months and I've spent the last 5-7 years gathering the guitars, amps, cabs, and gear I want to take into retirement. I'm not planning on any major music purchases then. Unlike some, I just hope to be able to rent a modest apartment, pay my monthly expenses, keep my head down, and make some music with other musicians. The time of dreaming of guitars I want to buy someday has now past. Simplify, stay alive, and enjoy life.
-
While there will always be music which supports entertainment Movies,Singers, etc. the way music is made is unimportant to most people. In the early days accomplished musicians were entertaining for the audience. Possibly the last of those were Rock players like Eddie Van Halen.
Shows like The Voice, American Idol, etc. are only concerned with selling the Singer. And now that technology allows for an instant band/backing track, kids have little interest in learning what it actually takes learn actual music or even an instrument.
In fairness, we should have all seen this comming when the "One Note Organ" came into being in the 1960's,LOL!
-
It might be all three, but I think that it is indicative of the stat that something like 1 in 10 people that buy a guitar actually sticks with it to learn how to play. So there are at least 10 times more guitars that are produced than are necessary. Couple that with those of us that do play and own multiple guitars. The result is that there are way too many guitars available compared to those of us that can only play one guitar at a time. Originally Posted by GNAPPI
-
I'm retiring in 16 days, but moving in the direction of a one-guitar/one-amp future (hence selling my Collings I-35, but keeping my newly built Campellone). Now I'm on a mission to figure out the one amp part! Originally Posted by vernon
-
It can be more complicated than just looking at the guitar market as a whole. Archtops in particular might be slowing right now. I buy guitars when I find good deals and resell them as the right buyer comes along.
For the archtops that can take a while, but certain solid body guitars are in much higher demand among younger players, who by the way are very much into solos. Brands like PRS, Knaggs, Mayones, and Suhr have been very hot with younger players. I've done very well with some Gibson Custom Shop Les Pauls.
I bought a brand new Charvel Guthrie Govan for $2400, played it for a year and sold it for $3000 in less than 2 weeks after listing it. I don't think the market is currently dying, but it may be changing.
-
I suppose there are all sorts of factors at play - China, huge production capacity, drops in production costs for mass market instruments, changing tastes in popular music, economic conditions, specific market shortages or over-supply, aging boomers, whatever. IMO, that is all about the business of the guitar, not the guitar itself.
I think we are going through a fundamental change in society (I'm speaking mostly of first world society) from a mostly analogue relationship to a mostly digital relationship with the world. Work and play are increasingly related to computers and other digital media. This will continue and intensify over time, and will profoundly change how we interact with the world, far beyond what we have seen to date.
A side effect of this will be a longing for analogue experiences which I believe are part of a basic sensory diet. The physical sensation of making a guitar vibrate in one's hands and the resulting noises providing feedback directly to one's ears will become a very precious thing to someone whose interactions with the world largely involve pressing buttons, working a joystick, using a touchscreen, or whatever is next.
The more we are removed from our senses by technology, the more we will need gratifying analogue sensory experiences. It will be a long time before we are able to transcend our physical selves and the need to feed our senses as well as our bodies. Until then, we remain wet, sentient meat, regardless of technology. And until then, I'm not worried about the future of the guitar.Last edited by Hammertone; 01-03-2017 at 07:03 PM.
-
Dunno about Boyer, but Collier comes from a family of world class classical musicians, and sang Britten as a boy treble, and Bach Chorales around the house. He's something of an outlier. Originally Posted by Jim Soloway
-
Two amps, at the same time. Ooo-Lala! Originally Posted by bmw2002
Congratulations on your retirement!
-
Thanks very much -- I'm excited, Mrs. bmw2002, not so much.
-
Here's my example. I'm almost 60, and I started buying guitars when I was 9. So in 50 years, I collected about 18 (if you count non-guitar stringed instruments like a bass, mandolin, lap slides, autoharp, etc.) Originally Posted by HeyNow
Which is ridiculous. I'm not a pro, and I've never lived in a place bigger than 1100 sq. ft. And I don't have time to play them all. I love them all, but I decided it was time to start paring down.
So I put five guitars on Reverb about 9 months ago. Three sold. Took months. Two are hanging on.
The best: my 1957 ES-225. Still with me!
I thought this would sell first. It is a really good playing specimen, but it's a player's guitar. The tuners and bridge have been replaced. But it's solid otherwise.
There are about 28 of these ES-225s on Reverb!!!!! The prices are all over the map. I've always priced mine about the 2nd or 3rd lowest. (There's often a real beater or a husk.)
Granted, the ES-225 is sort of a transition guitar. Many players would prefer either an ES-335 or even an ES-150. And mine has just one pickup. (The more desirable model has two.)
I've lowered my price four times!
I won't point at it because I don't want to make this post about my sale. It's just an example. But yeah, the market is a whole lot softer than I thought it wold be when I decided to sell. I'll be lucky to get 75% of what I thought I might.
Could change though. Look at the price of American muscle cars over the last several decades.
And to be fair, I paid only $375 for that ES-225 back in 1983...and I've definitely squeezed $375 worth out of joy out of it already, so who knows...Last edited by Flat; 01-03-2017 at 09:29 PM.
-
Mike McCready signature Les Paul?? Is it a joke? The guy never passed the high school level!
-
I think this is so spot-on and I feel better for reading it. Thanks, Hammer. Good thoughts. Originally Posted by Hammertone
-
i disagree. In fact, there's been a charvel govan listed on the gearpage for months at $2400
Originally Posted by ThatRhythmMan
-
You can disagree all you want, but it's still true. I had a lot of interest in this guitar from multiple buyers when I put it up for sale. Multiple examples have sold for more than $2400 on eBay in the last three months. Originally Posted by agentsmith
I'm basing the rest on personal experience YMMV.
-
I'm of the opinion that guitars aren't selling because prices are unrealistic. I'm considering selling an ES-335 and just checked eBay and Reverb for prices - there's 1 on each site of the same model and they are $1k - $2k above what I'm considering for my starting price.
I've made a couple purchases in the past year at very good prices but the few that I bought were about the only guitars I've seen that were reasonably priced. One guitar I bought and returned (undisclosed damage) was bought by someone else and is now listed for almost 2x what I paid for it. I've seen this a number of times over the past couple years - when a guitar is fairly priced someone buys it and re-lists at a ridiculous price and it sits and sits and sits.
-
You know what's odd? I've noticed recently on eBay that there is occasionally one guitar for sale (the one I'm thinking of was an Ibanez GB-30) from Japan, but there were 4 or 5 different auctions up for it. Maybe 80% of the pictures in all the auctions are the same, with maybe one or two different poses in each. Often, the serial number is shown in a few of the auctions, so you know its the same guitar. Prices for the one I saw recently went from about 1700 to 2500. Literally the same guitar! Has anyone else noticed that? I understand this may be an old thing but it caught me by surprise.
-
AFAIK duplicate listings on the same item are not allowed as more than one buyer can "win" the same item. I am surprised Ebay has not pulled them all.
Last edited by GNAPPI; 01-03-2017 at 10:52 PM.
-
Checking your numbers against an inflation calculator, if you sell the ES-225 for $816 you'll break even. I'd be happy to give you that plus cover paypal and shipping. I'll even throw in a few extra bucks - call it an even $1,000 plus costs! Originally Posted by Flat
Coolest ES-225 I ever saw was at a small guitar show in upstate NY - a very clean one-pickup model that had been immaculately converted inthe a three-pickup guitar and wired up like an ES-5 - genius! I'm still kicking myself for not buying it.Last edited by Hammertone; 01-04-2017 at 02:58 AM.
-
Now that's a thought. I considered for a while moving the pickup to the neck position and adding a bridge pickup--and a big ugly wood patch in the middle to plug the hole. Then it would be a bit more like an ES-330, and that's something I could use. Originally Posted by Hammertone
But three P90s...hmm...Last edited by Flat; 01-04-2017 at 03:49 AM.
-
The Dean Palomino, Epi Riviera, and Peerless Wizard come ready to play without surgery. Should you want to change pups or replace a trem it's far easier and less expensive than modding a one or 2 pup git.
-
One thing that US sellers (Ebay and stores) could change is to raise the ban on shipping outside USA if they have one. On several occasions when my eye fell on a nice archtop, the US seller states not to be willing to ship outside the USA. Most change their mind upon kind asking and guitar knowledge exchange, but too many hold on to their policy. They are of course entitled to do so, but I think they miss the opportunity to sell and I miss an opportunity to buy. Originally Posted by GNAPPI
-
I had been meaning to post this also. While these are only very crude measures of guitar values, Reverb's data for 2015 and 2016 show an overall upward trend in vintage guitar prices. They defined vintage as 1985 or older.
Reverb's 2016 Vintage Guitar and Bass Index | Reverb
How did the vintage market fare in 2016? Find out here.
Reply With Quote
Recommandations for Hollowbodies for $600 and under?
Today, 05:20 AM in Guitar, Amps & Gizmos