D'Angelico EXL-1 vs Howard Roberts Custom

[jazzbow]

This kind of sucks for me, due to the fact that with my severe nickel allergy (discovered by a dermatologist back in 2014, when I got dermatitis so bad, I wound up with a major infection) makes trying out guitars a thorny proposition. If it isn't the nickel strings on electric guitars that beat me up, it's the nickel frets on all guitars. Washing my hands off after playing, doesn't even help me. I've had it where I've tried out guitars (knowing I was going to pay the price for doing so), only to be driving home afterwords, have my legs start itching like crazy, and end up with skin breakouts as a result of my little guitar test driving session, due to me getting a (immune) systemic related reaction (I get the dermatitis everywhere else, but on my hands, despite them touching the strings - my immune system goes bonkers). People say I should try playing while wearing rubber gloves, but it would be my luck they would break, and I would wind up with my bare fingers touching the strings. Nowadays, the closest I can get to trying an electric guitar, is to grab the neck near where the nut is, so I can put the price tag over the strings, grab onto the the neck, and at least check out how thick it is (I don't like thin necks). It adds to the dilemma of buying new guitars for me.

Now that's horrid. How do you cope? Stainless steel strings?

A work colleague had really bad dermatitis, bathed his hands in cream and wore rubber gloves over the cream for some respite. What worked for him was acupuncture. He would have to go every 6-8 weeks but the severe reactions went and he would just have flare ups every now and then.

[Cavalier]

Good choice on the guitar! The 135 is a nice alternative to the HR, this thread was very educational for me.

[EllenGtrGrl]

Now that's horrid. How do you cope? Stainless steel strings?

A work colleague had really bad dermatitis, bathed his hands in cream and wore rubber gloves over the cream for some respite. What worked for him was acupuncture. He would have to go every 6-8 weeks but the severe reactions went and he would just have flare ups every now and then.

Nope, I can't do stainless steel strings, due to also having an allergy to chromium (especially the hexavalent kind), which is a major component of stainless steel. I use Ernie Ball Cobalts (which like Rotosound British Steels, are free of both nickel, and chromium). As for the frets, I have them replaced with Jescar EVO Gold fretwire. Jescar EVO Gold is are marketed as being hypoallergenic fret material (its an alloy of iron and tin). Frets made with this material, are almost as tough as stainless steel frets.

Good choice on the guitar! The 135 is a nice alternative to the HR, this thread was very educational for me.

Thanks! I'm looking forward to playing the guitar, once it's been refretted.

[Max405]

Gtrgrl,
Without question, you made the right choice.
I had a 135 a while back and loved it to death. The thicker natural sound will perfectly balance the P100 out.
Oh, what a nice guitar. I am very surprised more people don't perform with them.
Did you get stainless frets or EVO's?
That sucks about your nickel allergy. I couldnt live without my TI Jazz Swings.
Joe D

[EllenGtrGrl]

Gtrgrl,
Without question, you made the right choice.
I had a 135 a while back and loved it to death. The thicker natural sound will perfectly balance the P100 out.
Oh, what a nice guitar. I am very surprised more people don't perform with them.
Did you get stainless frets or EVO's?
That sucks about your nickel allergy. I couldnt live without my TI Jazz Swings.
Joe D

Thanks. I can't do stainless steel Joe, due to me also having a major allergy to the chromium that is a part of stainless steel. As with my other guitars, the '135 is getting refretted with EVO Gold.

[GNAPPI]

You did good on buying the 135, I L-O-V-E my 1993 cherry model with P-100's.

I'm pretty sure Gibson uses EVO wire on their Les Paul Supreme. My LP Supreme has a gritty feel if I stretch strings. The finish is smooth but it has a quality that I do not like. I'm not sure if it is a fret finishing / polish issue but it feels smooth to the touch. I really don't bend or stretch much so it's not a biggie for me, but if I did and further polishing did not help, I'd either sell the Supreme or re-fret it.

There are other options on hypo frets too...

Gold GD6150 Fretwire for Guitar or Bass

I do not know if they are sourced from Jescar, but keep us posted on the fret wire update.

[Max405]

Thanks. I can't do stainless steel Joe, due to me also having a major allergy to the chromium that is a part of stainless steel. As with my other guitars, the '135 is getting refretted with EVO Gold.

Thank God someone invented EVO's..
I am getting the EVO frets on my Johnny Smith 1st week of January. I can't wait.
Play on Ellen. I'd love hear your 135 one day..

[neatomic]

nice looking soapbar 135, and it'll hold its value better than your other considerations...so good move...congrats

cheers

[citizenk74]

Congratulations on an excellent choice. I'm looking forward to your NGD!

[EllenGtrGrl]

You did good on buying the 135, I L-O-V-E my 1993 cherry model with P-100's.

I'm pretty sure Gibson uses EVO wire on their Les Paul Supreme. My LP Supreme has a gritty feel if I stretch strings. The finish is smooth but it has a quality that I do not like. I'm not sure if it is a fret finishing / polish issue but it feels smooth to the touch. I really don't bend or stretch much so it's not a biggie for me, but if I did and further polishing did not help, I'd either sell the Supreme or re-fret it.

There are other options on hypo frets too...

Gold GD6150 Fretwire for Guitar or Bass

I do not know if they are sourced from Jescar, but keep us posted on the fret wire update.

The actual fretwire used by the luthier who refrets my guitars is available from Allparts as Hypoallergenic Fret Wire.

Hypoallergenic Fret Wire | Allparts.com

I assume that it's Jescar EVO Gold, but I could be wrong. I was told that it's gold colored, but it polishes out to a silver color. I haven't noticed it as having a gritty quality playing feel wise, but then again, in almost 38 years of guitar playing, I've never been much of a string bender, so who knows, maybe it does feel gritty when you bend strings.

[Doctor Jeff]

Wow, another 135!

It is a great guitar. I used to have a 175 and got the 135 on a whim because it was a good price and I wanted to get back into the Gibson family. I was playing a Peerless Sunset at the time, which I still like and play, but the Gibson is a more versatile guitar and has a better defined sound.

I agree I don't know why it hasn't been more popular--like the Tele, it's a Swiss Army knife guitar.

[Longways to Go]

Congrats on the new 135!

My '92 has P100's and a beautifully thick neck and it is just great!

Cool guitar

[EllenGtrGrl]

Thanks everybody!

[avantgarlic]

I ended up getting a deal on an EXL-1 this summer as part of a GAS situation that started to get out of hand. I wasn't really in the market for an archtop but it sounded good and I got it as part of a trade in addition to a solid body axe.

I play a lot of jazz gigs lately and have always mostly played Teles and an old Gibson Semi, a 347 that I traded as it was pretty run down and not real stable. It had more collector value than I though but it was not very playable.

So I took the EXL-1 for some gigs and I had a couple of issues. The first issue is my problem. Having never owned an archtop but have been playing for years I started to feel like the guitar was playing me. Rather, it kept speaking to me and telling me to sound more like Wes Montgomery. Or so that is how it felt. I was so used to genre hopping in my playing moving from jazz to more blues funk sounds that it felt like a big constraint on me. Not really a good fit for now.

The other issue (and I have heard others on this topic) is that I had very nice tones in the low end but the higher end and middle seemed flat to me. It was an uneven vibe. It was with round wounds too. I asked my local guitar guru about the EXL-1 and he said (again I am assuming its a copy from Korea at about 1200 or so) that the earlier ones had better build quality but that he thought he could address the issue. Given I paid very little for it I am going to give it a shot and try to wrap my head around playing it again.

Having missed my semi hollow vibe I ended up trying out a Montreal Premiere by Godin. I dug it. I searched online and found a fantastic deal at Geralds online in Canada. They buy factory seconds with minor finish issues. Mine is in mint and was about 40% off retail. I can genre hop now with it very nicely but still getting used to it. It has a bit smaller neck so if you don't like that it could be a drag. Otherwise the build quality and tone are great. Very playable.

[Little Jay]

The 135 is a great all round workhorse. If I could have only one guitar, I think it would be a 135. Congratulations with the purchase, I am sure you will enjoy it!

[GNAPPI]

Ellen,

When you tried the 135 / P100 model did you try it in a SS or tube amp? Also are you using a SS or tube amp for personal playing?

I ask because I know for a fact that the P100 sounds sterile and weak in every SS amp I tried it in but mellow in a tube amp. My 30 watt SS amp is nowhere near up to the task that my little 30+ watt tube amps give me.

I wonder if this is cause for many folks not liking the P100's when they get them home... playing in a nice tube amp in a store, and SS for personal use.

[EllenGtrGrl]

Ellen,

When you tried the 135 / P100 model did you try it in a SS or tube amp? Also are you using a SS or tube amp for personal playing?

I ask because I know for a fact that the P100 sounds sterile and weak in every SS amp I tried it in but mellow in a tube amp. My 30 watt SS amp is nowhere near up to the task that my little 30+ watt tube amps give me.

I wonder if this is cause for many folks not liking the P100's when they get them home... playing in a nice tube amp in a store, and SS for personal use.

Hi Gary,

I didn't get a chance to plug the '135 in, due to the fact that I didn't have any gloves with me, to wear while playing it (the whole nickel allergy thing). I examined the neck, found it to meet my criteria for what I consider to be acceptably chunky, and having owned and played a lot of Gibsons in the past, took a leap of faith, and bought it. I'm between amps at the present time, but have pretty much decided to get another tube amp (I'm still trying to decide which one to get). As I mentioned earlier, if the P100s don't work out, I'll replace them with P90s, or P90 sized humbuckers.

Ellen

[skykomishone]

Ellen,

Congrats on the 135. It's a nice guitar. Thanks for the post. It's been educational for me regarding the frets and strings thing. I'm curious about the gold frets though, and why Joe thinks their so great. I'd like to bank the info for future consideration when I need a refret. I also like the P90's. I have zero to barely discernible hum, it's no problem on my '55 175. It has 2 of them. It's one of the things I love about the guitar. I think you've made a great choice and it was very thoughtful.

S

[EllenGtrGrl]

Ellen,

Congrats on the 135. It's a nice guitar. Thanks for the post. It's been educational for me regarding the frets and strings thing. I'm curious about the gold frets though, and why Joe thinks their so great. I'd like to bank the info for future consideration when I need a refret. I also like the P90's. I have zero to barely discernible hum, it's no problem on my '55 175. It has 2 of them. It's one of the things I love about the guitar. I think you've made a great choice and it was very thoughtful.

S

Thanks.

[Longways to Go]

Hey EllenGtrGrl,

Even though its "common knowledge" my suggestion is that you don't assume right away that P100s are second rate.

Personally, I'm not that big a fan of P90s --- not a hater, just not my favorite Pickup.

The P100s are different for sure, very nice that they are quieter, and they get along really well with some of my amps.
I did a gig recently with the 135 with the DV Mark Little Jazz and the tone was just perfect

I heard the whole "you'll want P90s to replace your P100s" threadz when I got my 135 too, but I haven't taken that pill. It's pretty much the only the story you'll hear on the internet.

I'm wondering if 20 years from now P100s will be some kind of retro thing. . . .

[EllenGtrGrl]

Hey EllenGtrGrl,

Even though its "common knowledge" my suggestion is that you don't assume right away that P100s are second rate.

Personally, I'm not that big a fan of P90s --- not a hater, just not my favorite Pickup.

The P100s are different for sure, very nice that they are quieter, and they get along really well with some of my amps.
I did a gig recently with the 135 with the DV Mark Little Jazz and the tone was just perfect

I heard the whole "you'll want P90s to replace your P100s" threadz when I got my 135 too, but I haven't taken that pill. It's pretty much the only the story you'll hear on the internet.

I'm wondering if 20 years from now P100s will be some kind of retro thing. . . .

I fully intend to give the P100s the benefit of the doubt, and give them a chance. Like you stated, down the road, they might end up becoming sought after pickups like P90s have become again, after decades of many players thinking "meh", whenever a P90 was, mentioned. They probably sound different in the same way that stacked Fender-style humbuckers sound different from regular Fender single coils - close but not quite the same, which is no big deal to me. My only deal breaker is microphonics. I normally only change pickups, if the ones in the guitar are excessively microphonic, and/or sound absolutely godawful (which hasn't been the case for me in a long time).

[Max405]

I'm curious about the gold frets though, and why Joe thinks their so great. I'd like to bank the info for future consideration when I need a refret.
S

Sky,
Through my research, not many luthiers want any part of doing fret jobs that involve Stainless Steel. They say its devastating to their tools, Difficult to work with and doesn't retain the proper bend radius of a fret board. Some guys say, they are stubborn and sometimes even pop out.
I had a guitar with fret job done using Stainless steel frets. I must say, I adored the super slick, polished feel of the frets. If the neck was deeper, I'd absolutely still have that Guitar.
The same luthiers who will not do a stainless fret job, absolutely adore the EVO frets. They say they are dream to work with, they polish up just like Stainless and they last a lot longer than regular Nickel/Steel frets.

That's why I want them on my Guitar. I hope that helped.

JD

[GNAPPI]

JD,

You made up my mind, I am going to buff up my LP Supreme frets and see if that helps its scratchy feel.

Gonna get that Dremel, buffing wheel and white rouge out this weekend.

[Max405]

Gary, 3 big time east coast luthiers told me those frets take a supreme polish.
To me there is nothing like frets that look like little diamond bars running across the fretboard.
Do you have those metal templates that cover up the fretboard and allow just the fret be exposed?
Joe D

[Doctor Jeff]

JD,

You made up my mind, I am going to buff up my LP Supreme frets and see if that helps its scratchy feel.

Gonna get that Dremel, buffing wheel and white rouge out this weekend.

The Dremel with the buffing wheel and compound is the secret weapon of refretting. Great idea.