Compressor Pedal - Help or Hurt?

**blille** · 12-04-2016, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by medblues

So a hypothetical advanced question for the pros:

The Empress Compressor has a side chain. Empress ParaEQ can supposedly work as a notch filter. Can I apply compression only on the feedback causing frequency connecting these pedals with the side chain ? That would be a nice jazz application of compression since many of our guitars like to feedback.

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Afaik a feedback eliminator is a limiter focused on feedback frequencies (4.5k?) so it may work to identify and limit the feedback. But I'm not sure how you were thinking about adding it back up?

**medblues** · 12-04-2016, 01:59 PM

Originally Posted by blille

Afaik a feedback eliminator is a limiter focused on feedback frequencies (4.5k?) so it may work to identify and limit the feedback. But I'm not sure how you were thinking about adding it back up?

I am not sure either, too complicated for me. Maybe someone else knows. I don't have a limiter (which I think is a type of compressor function). I have an Empress ParaEQ and an Empress Compressor (which has a "side chain"). If I isolate a frequency that is feeding back and cut it with the ParaEQ, then that frequency completely disappears if played at a low level whereas if I can take that frequency only and compress it it would sound OK when played at low volume but gets squashed at feedback causing levels. Can that be done with these two pedals ?

**citizenk74** · 12-04-2016, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by JazzNote

I a

ways figured that compression would help making picking easier by "evening out" inconsistencies in dynamics caused by uneven stroke power. Maybe i'm wrong with this belief, but this would be the only reason i'd use a compressor in a live setting as i don't think it improves the pure quality of the sound. So if someone could tell me if i'm right ..... thanks!

You are correct. At various stages of my performing life, I utilized compression. At first I used a pedal for a while. I was an early adopter of the Rockman (at least in my area) and used it and then the Rockmodule (which was more practical for live performance). Both of these Tom Scholz (sp?) products enabled me to provide a fully-produced signal and a usable variety of tones to the board without fuss, muss, or stage footprint. In one band, the bass player and I used Scholz products so that onstage, there were just the drummer/drumset, the singer, the bass player, and myself, mics, and guitar stands. No amps. Interestingly, in four years, no-one - not one person, ever asked about the absence of amps.

The fullness of time (and a different sort of band) brought me back to the use of tube amps and their intrinsic compression and their inherent joys and head- (and back-) aches. Nevertheless, compression and peak-limiting will always play a part in recorded music, as far as I am concerned. Besides, if God didn't mean for us to have fun twiddling knobs, he wouldn't have given us opposable thumbs, or inquisitive,restless minds....

As to inconsistencies and unevenness - "practice, practice, practice"!

**blille** · 12-04-2016, 06:32 PM

Originally Posted by medblues

I am not sure either, too complicated for me. Maybe someone else knows. I don't have a limiter (which I think is a type of compressor function). I have an Empress ParaEQ and an Empress Compressor (which has a "side chain"). If I isolate a frequency that is feeding back and cut it with the ParaEQ, then that frequency completely disappears if played at a low level whereas if I can take that frequency only and compress it it would sound OK when played at low volume but gets squashed at feedback causing levels. Can that be done with these two pedals ?

You would need something to isolate the frequency and then compress that frequency. So the side loop should be on the para eq, not the compressor?

Those are amazing pedals though.

**destinytot** · 12-04-2016, 08:36 PM

It's been a bit frustrating not having a separate reverb control for each channel on my AER Compact III. The only thing I don't like about that amp is the fact that the same type of reverb gets applied in equal amounts to both channels at the same time.

Today, however, I've learned what an effects loop is for - and how to use it (along with the AER's 'efx-pan control' and a reverb pedal) to solve that problem.

I've found a cheap octave pedal, which I''m going to put after the amp simulator pedal and before the reverb in the effects loop.

I'm thinking that the compressor would go into the amp's main input as part of this chain:
guitar > wah pedal > compressor pedal > looper pedal > amp

Does that seem OK?

Thanks in advance!

**blille** · 12-04-2016, 08:51 PM

Originally Posted by destinytot

It's been a bit frustrating not having a separate reverb control for each channel on my AER Compact III. The only thing I don't like about that amp is the fact that the same type of reverb gets applied in equal amounts to both channels at the same time.

Today, however, I've learned what an effects loop is for - and how to use it (along with the AER's 'efx-pan control' and a reverb pedal) to solve that problem.

I've found a cheap octave pedal, which I''m going to put after the amp simulator pedal and before the reverb in the effects loop.

I'm thinking that the compressor would go into the amp's main input as part of this chain:
guitar > wah pedal > compressor pedal > looper pedal > amp

Does that seem OK?

Thanks in advance!

So what would be the whole chain (with Reverb and octave)?

**destinytot** · 12-04-2016, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by blille

So what would be the whole chain (with Reverb and octave)?

Back of amp, via effects loop send and return:
amp send > amp simulator pedal > octave pedal > reverb > amp return

Front/top of amp, via channel 1 input:
guitar > wah pedal > compressor pedal > looper > amp input

**blille** · 12-04-2016, 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by destinytot

Back of amp, via effects loop send and return:
amp send > amp simulator pedal > octave pedal > reverb > amp return

Front/top of amp, via channel 1 input:
guitar > wah pedal > compressor pedal > looper > amp input

Looks good, it's like you're chaining amps

Usually you want the octaver at the beginning or right after comp so you can try that (mostly to improve tracking) but if it's working and you like it there, keep it

**citizenk74** · 12-04-2016, 09:44 PM

Personally. I would put the compressor first in any signal chain, as otherwise line noise will be unavoidably ampified. Just a suggestion.

**blille** · 12-04-2016, 09:51 PM

Originally Posted by citizenk74

Personally. I would put the compressor first in any signal chain, as otherwise line noise will be unavoidably ampified. Just a suggestion.

I like it after (my Vox) wah to tame out some peakiness and now even after dirt to keep the gain dynamics I but spent most of my career putting it first too.

**destinytot** · 12-05-2016, 08:21 AM

Originally Posted by citizenk74

Personally. I would put the compressor first in any signal chain, as otherwise line noise will be unavoidably ampified. Just a suggestion.

Thanks for this tip!

I can't believe that it's taken me a year to realise that the AER 'efx pan' is what will give me control over the distribution of reverb between the channels. EDIT: It controls the blend with external effects - I had no way of knowing because I didn't know how to use an effects loop - but I do now!

I've just spent the morning using the effects loop for the first time. Love how clean it sounds. I think I'm beginning to appreciate 'true bypass' (which the Vox 845 wah doesn't have).

Two more firsts today: using the bridge pickup - as well as neck, which is all I've ever used - and also using delay instead of reverb. In my mind, I was getting that Weekend in LA tone.

(Too much sitting - off for a swim before work!)

PS I need to know how to use compression before I can reasonably choose not to use it.

**AlsoRan** · 12-05-2016, 10:14 AM

Here is a link to a website that addresses this item. It captures much of what was stated in this thread.

electric guitar - What Does a Compressor Pedal Do? - Music: Practice & Theory Stack Exchange

**christianm77** · 12-05-2016, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by destinytot

Thanks for this tip!

I can't believe that it's taken me a year to realise that the AER 'efx pan' is what will give me control over the distribution of reverb between the channels. EDIT: It controls the blend with external effects - I had no way of knowing because I didn't know how to use an effects loop - but I do now!

I've just spent the morning using the effects loop for the first time. Love how clean it sounds. I think I'm beginning to appreciate 'true bypass' (which the Vox 845 wah doesn't have).

Two more firsts today: using the bridge pickup - as well as neck, which is all I've ever used - and also using delay instead of reverb. In my mind, I was getting that Weekend in LA tone.

(Too much sitting - off for a swim before work!)

PS I need to know how to use compression before I can reasonably choose not to use it.

That's good to know... I have been pretty confused about the use of that

**destinytot** · 12-10-2016, 04:40 PM

I think the missing link here is a Tele. Tried a Squier with 10s and loved it.

**destinytot** · 12-10-2016, 05:04 PM

Tried a Mooer Yellow Compressor - and a Mooer Tender Octaver, too (looking into these on the web, they seem to be hard to find).

Loved both -especially with he Alnico 5 pick-up on the Squier - and they're in stock locally (which is a rare thing), so I'm going to pick them up on Monday.

**destinytot** · 12-10-2016, 06:58 PM

Just finished a solo set - used the modelling pedal through the effects loop and really enjoyed the 'tube-like give'.

**destinytot** · 12-10-2016, 07:30 PM

Just bought the last one in stock! Mooer Tender Octaver Pedal

**blille** · 12-10-2016, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by destinytot

Just bought the last one in stock! Mooer Tender Octaver Pedal

Hope you like it!

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**destinytot** · 12-10-2016, 09:11 PM

De rigueur:

**destinytot** · 12-17-2016, 10:09 AM

Thanks for all the great tips. Love the compressor - used it to play chords on this bossa nova (and don't think the pudding was over-egged):

**AlsoRan** · 12-17-2016, 01:45 PM

That sounded good, nice and even chords, just like a compressor is supposed to produce.

I would like to add that I recently read on of my old bass guitar study book from Billy Sheehan, a hard rock bassist with many years in the game, currently playing with the winery dogs.

He spent a chapter discussing compression and what it meant to him. He wrote how he would play his bass at home and do all sorts of things unplugged. But once he got on stage and was plugged into his amp, he could not reproduce much of his lines and other figures.

He said he could notice this when other musicians were experiencing this and said that it was because amplification greatly increased the bass' dynamic range. Louder notes were so much louder now. Consequently, the bass "felt funny" in his hands and was not reacting the it would in his practice at home. He had to tame the louder notes and/or increase the sound of the quieter ones that were not keeping up. Not to mention the millisecond lag that amplification creates.

So by using compression, he wrote the dynamic range of the bass stayed closer to what he had at home, and thus reacted closer to how he expected.

To be honest, I always thought at times, I thought his tone was a little strange and processed, and this was probably part of the reason - the way the compression keeps everything so neat and perfect.

I am pulling out my compression pedal right now.

**AlsoRan** · 12-25-2016, 01:57 PM

Wow!

My first attempt to try using a compressor again was abysmal. Notes were bouncing all over the place!

There is definitely an art to using one. I am going to research setting for my Boss CS-1 and try again another day. I am thinking that the reverb on my amp somehow did not mesh with the compressor settings.

**AlsoRan** · 12-25-2016, 02:01 PM

OK....

I am not the only one that finds this Boss CS-1 as being a little problematic to use. Check this review out:

Boss CS-1

Anybody own a Boss CS-1

I am starting to think this pedal is not very good.

**blille** · 12-25-2016, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by AlsoRan

OK....

I am not the only one that finds this Boss CS-1 as being a little problematic to use. Check this review out:

Boss CS-1

Anybody own a Boss CS-1

I am starting to think this pedal is not very good.

It's not that it's not good. It's a squish machine.

I would encourage an optical and an mxr for two classic flavors and depending on what feels better you can go from there.

**Frank67** · 12-25-2016, 03:08 PM

I agree. The Boss CS-1 is problematic. I find it way too squishy. I like compressors per se but not the Boss one. In General I gravitate towards optical compressors.