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Hello. I have recently come to conclusion, that I will not ever be satisfied with tube amps for carved archtops.
I want to hear the top wood. I want something more hifi and accurate, and tube amps in my experience are too thick sounding and tend to make various guitars sound similiar as opposed to allowing the tone to get thru.
My application here is for an Eastman Pisano ar880 w/flatwounds, doing fingerstyle arrangements, at home. Moderate or less volume, no drummer.
I'm coming to believe that while I need tubes for many other applications, that only SS will satisfy here. I'm only really interested in the tone. Size, weight, convenience etc. is of zero importance.
Here is what I don't want:
Class D
Modeling
Digital effects
Digital anything.
I play the Eastman thru my various tube amps now, but actually prefer an Ultrasound Pro200 that I have, which is designed for acoustic flat tops primarily. It's ok, but cloudy in the bass, and crappy digital effects.
So, some ideas I have are:
A straight SS amp, Evans, Alfresco, etc.
Something similar to the Ultrasound, but better: AER?
Or, maybe a monitor, like a QSC 10, If I can get a preamp pedal with appropriate tone controls?
And finally - I'm really dependent on good reverb. I'll want a spring, and maybe even tube driven spring, so I'll need an effects loop, provided that the loop allows me to mix the dry and wet signals so that the tube reverb does not spoil my clarity too much.
Well, that's alot of rambling. Any thoughts appreciated.
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01-19-2016 11:34 AM
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The new Henriksen 310/312 amps are excellent, and the prior issues with reverb have been nicely corrected.
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With a carved top archtop you can either go for a more electric sound (like a Polytone) or for more of an acoustic sound, through an acoustic guitar amplifier. For the second option, I have a Phil Jones AG-100:
They are small and may not be loud enough for you (get two?).
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Thanks for the suggestions. I wish that manufacturers would provide more information in regards to the topology, type of effect circuitry, etc.
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If you go to the AER site there's a block diagram for the Compact 60/3. Diagrams shows an Effect Pan control. I think that may be what you were looking for.
? Compact 60-3
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Yes thanks, I think that is what I'm looking for in a loop.
Originally Posted by DanielleOM
However I have just read current AER is class D, so that concerns me. I have no local access to try them.
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Sorry but you can't "hear the top" of a guitar. This leads me to believe your thinking isn't right, you have delusions about your concept of "tone", and you can't be pleased.
That said, I happily use a henriksen 10"
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Out of curiosity, what don't you like about class D amps? My Quilter Aviator Twin Ten is class D and I love it.
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Are you concerned because you think "class D" means digital or somehow more digital than Class C? If so, check out the informative PDF on the topic at the Mambo amps site. Originally Posted by wengr
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Quilter, they sound very good!
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I have the Quilter 101 mini-head and 12 inch cab. And love it. Also my 15-20 year old Polytone mini-brute has never let me down.
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Found a nice article Class D music amps here: What Is Class-D Amplification?
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I have no personal experience with class D guitar amps. I am a busy gigging bassist, and I have a good deal of experience with class D bass heads, in the pursuit of portability. Truth is I have never met one that I liked tonewise, compared to more traditional types. In the end I have settled with a TecAmp Puma 900, which is not bad. It's not good, but it's not unpleasant. It's ok, and the weight and footprint is awesome, so it fills the bill. Originally Posted by entresz
But my jazz guitar fetish is that of a hobbyist home player, and the tone is paramount.
Now maybe the class D revolution is quite different for guitar amps, than I find it to be with bass amplification, but I expect not.
As you know, looking for the tone in your head is challenging, and without access to the gear, well.........
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What I mean is - when I plug in a laminate, and then I plug in a carved top, and they do not sound all that different, it leads me to believe I have the wrong amp. At least for the carved tops. Originally Posted by Toat
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Yes, of this I am sure. But I do hope to move in that direction.... Originally Posted by Toat
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Another Quilter fan here. I like my Quilter Mach II Head very much.
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With all of the things you have rejected out of hand- which are pretty much all features of SS jazz amps made in the past decade- you may want to look at the old Yamaha G50-112 I or II (there is a 100 watt version as well) or a Gibson LAB series amp. They are great amps.
With those class D amps I think that the issues you have experienced are with the preamps, speakers, etc., and not the power section. Class D amps are typically very transparent, which is the reason to use an SS amp with an archtop guitar. The QSC K10 will likely have a class D power amp in it. One of my setups is an Alto TS110a powered speaker with a class D amp; it sounds very good indeed. I use it with a Zoom MS100bt between the guitar and the amp, essentially acting as a DI. Portable, loud enough, clean and really, really easy to hook into a PA and get my sound with a minimum of fussing.
My other main SS amp is a Clarus 2r head through a Raezer's Edge 12" speaker. Something I read here on the forum that was helpful is to set the master volume fairly high and then use the preamp gain ("level") to actually control the volume. I found this added some nice body to the sound compared to my former method of running the level at noon and controlling the volume with the master.
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Originally Posted by Cunamara
I second the AI Clarus 2r I have old one and a old Clarus 1, AI amps are designed for acoustic instruments and that's why so many upright bassists use them. The reverb is usable, but you want tube spring reverb so you going to have to get a old Fender Reverb unit for that. I use the head with Raezer's Edge 10" and Ear Candy 2x8" cabs.
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Yes, I'm thinking of the repro units made by Clark Amplification, Vintage Sound, etc. Originally Posted by docbop
really wondering what a very accurate sound with tube verb would be like. Provided that the verb can be mixed in with the dry signal.
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Originally Posted by wengr
Fender sells a reissue it appears to have mix control, about a $1000 less than the Clark.
Fender '63 Tube Reverb | Sweetwater.com
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I tried an old ss amp last Saturday. Made by Hohner in the Seventies. Really not bad, but the reverb was nothing special. Way back I was familiar with Lab Series and given the opportunity I'll revisit one. Yamaha I have no experience with so I'll look into it. Originally Posted by Cunamara
I don't think so, as in the last three years, 6 iirc micro heads have come and gone. Tecamp, MarkBass. GK, Genz Benz. Same cabs, same speakers, same basses, etc. however all but the Tecamp Puma had a quality that I did not care for. On the other hand, I have some David Eden's, including a cheap model with no preamp tube and the sound in my opinion is clearer and more accurate than any class D that I have encountered. Originally Posted by Cunamara
Interesting to hear. I will take it all into consideration. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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Yes, but I mean a mix or level control on the amp effects loop, so I don't have to hit the front end of the amp with verb. Originally Posted by docbop
Last edited by wengr; 01-20-2016 at 10:39 AM.
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I wouldn't worry with Class D, both Evans and Mambo use it and sound great. I would also not care much about a wet / dry control on the fx loop which is very rare actually on "jazz amps"... most reverb pedals sound great in front these days although they do sound better in the loop. But just a regular loop will do it.
Given this, Mambo and Evans are the best ones I tried, specially the Mambo. Reverb on the Evans is nice, on the Mambo is great, none is a spring reverb. There are some good spring reverb pedals these days though.
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Another vote for a Quilter "Aviator."
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Evans is interesting to me. I do however take note of them describing the sound as tube like on the site, so that's a concern. As far as pedals go I have a Vanamps Sole Mate enroute to me now that should be here by the end of the week. That will be my first spring in a pedal type reverb, so we'll see. Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
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