D'Angelico Style A. and Excel

[Max405]

Dennis, that was great. On another post Stringswinger said he talked to a friend of Tony Markus who played the Excel that's coming to me and he said it sounding great.. thats really good to hear.
I was on the phone with Darren for an hour just now going over details about the guitar. He told me its Parallel braced, stamped #1155 on the inside. He said action with acoustic strings the action goes down to .10 in the bass side before buzz. I am thinking with TI13's the action can go down even more because of the flat wound strings and lower tension. I might even put 12's on it. He said the neck has a healthy relief on it and it intonates perfectly. He said the neck is chunky. 1-3/4 at the nut and 2-3/16 at the 12th. That will take some getting use to but I am up for it.
There is just under 1/2" clearance under the strings so there's not much room for a floater under there. Hopefully the rhythm chief 1000 will fit.
Joe D

[neatomic]

just for info sake-

j d'angelico was an advocate of 80/20 bronze strings...he worked with the family that are now known as d'addario strings! to develop better strings..his major concern was to move away from round core (which were prone to kinks and unwinding) to the development of hex cores..

cheers

ps- not that i don't love thomastik pure nickel flats..my fave strings!!! haha

pss- the beauty of the monkey on stick dearmond pup is, if there's not enough clearance at the 24th fret you can slide it to the 29th or 31st

[Max405]

I'm getting pumped..

[neatomic]

i'm stoked from afar!

hah

cheers

[Dennis D]

Dennis, that was great. On another post Stringswinger said he talked to a friend of Tony Markus who played the Excel that's coming to me and he said it sounding great.. thats really good to hear.
I was on the phone with Darren for an hour just now going over details about the guitar. He told me its Parallel braced, stamped #1155 on the inside. He said action with acoustic strings the action goes down to .10 in the bass side before buzz. I am thinking with TI13's the action can go down even more because of the flat wound strings and lower tension. I might even put 12's on it. He said the neck has a healthy relief on it and it intonates perfectly. He said the neck is chunky. 1-3/4 at the nut and 2-3/16 at the 12th. That will take some getting use to but I am up for it.
There is just under 1/2" clearance under the strings so there's not much room for a floater under there. Hopefully the rhythm chief 1000 will fit.
Joe D

" Parallel braced " is interesting.......

What's the scale length ?

[Max405]

" Parallel braced " is interesting.......

What's the scale length ?

Hi said it is 24-3/4

[Stringswinger]

My 1937 Style A is parallel braced with a 1 11/16 nut and a 25 inch scale. I find it plays very well with Thomastic 13 flats.

[Max405]

SS, how is your action?
i like mine low. If I can't get it low, I'll learn to like 1/10th inch.
Gettin pumped.
Joe D
ps, SS, your the best. I couldn't/wouldn't have done this without you. You stayed with me every step..

[Stringswinger]

The action is low on my Style A (2mm at the 12th fret, high E) , but not electric guitar low (1.5 mm at the 12th fret, High E), nor should it be. It is an acoustic guitar. 1/10th of an inch is 2.5 mm. That would be a medium acoustic action.

[Jabberwocky]

I can't open till Christmas?? Ok, Next week, I'm Jewish! Oy!

And I'll be Sum Dum Goy.

[travisty]

And I'll be Sum Dum Goy.

Was that meant to be Sum Dum Goy or Sum Dim Goy?
Or Sum Dim Gui?
I'm usually called the last...
Sorry gents. Asia jokes.
I'm waiting for Joe's guitar to show up so he can take drool-worthy pics and I can put copies on my wall and my smartphone wallpaper and can subsequently wallow in a quagmire of longing, self-doubt, and regret that I can't play well enough to reasonably acquire one when someone else who can play better should. More practice it is!

[Jabberwocky]

Was that meant to be Sum Dum Goy or Sum Dim Goy?
Or Sum Dim Gui?...I'm usually called the last...Sorry gents. Asia jokes.

Dim Sum Guy?



Non-kosher.

Joe's incoming D'Angelico Excel should be quite a feast for the eyes...and ears.

[travisty]

JW,
gui = 鬼 (in cantonese it is 'gwei')

[rpguitar]

Trying to avoid being an armchair quarterback before you even get the guitar, but by all means, do fit 12-53 bronze 80/20s as your first string, Joe. This is not a guitar that was meant to be strung with flats. If you've never had a purely acoustic archtop before, it is a different creature in some ways from the usual amplified suspects. It is, first and foremost - perhaps even only - an acoustic guitar. It's not "acoustic in character but typically played amplified."

Also resist the urge to put on giant strings (hence the 12-53 suggestion). If you are planning to play rhythm in an orchestra, then okay, sure. But I don't think that's your thing. If this is a lightly built guitar, you and your soft touch (as demonstrated in video) will thank me.

[Max405]

The action is low on my Style A (2mm at the 12th fret, high E) , but not electric guitar low (1.5 mm at the 12th fret, High E), nor should it be. It is an acoustic guitar. 1/10th of an inch is 2.5 mm. That would be a medium acoustic action.

SS, Good info. I'll play with it. I have a good setup guy who is convenient (Close by, he works while I look over his shoulder) who can probably level the frets out.

I'm waiting for Joe's guitar to show up so he can take drool-worthy pics and I can put copies on my wall and my smartphone wallpaper and can subsequently wallow in a quagmire of longing, self-doubt, and regret that I can't play well enough to reasonably acquire one when someone else who can play better should. More practice it is!

Travisty, your doing ok pretty good there my friend. My iPad desktop is adorned with a pic of the Sharks headstock on your BEAUTIFUL house boat, freshly coated wood and pristine body of water in the background.. I am jealous.

Joe's incoming D'Angelico Excel should be quite a feast for the eyes...and ears.

Jabbs, thanks for making the whole experience better. Your advice is always well considered and spot on.

Trying to avoid being an armchair quarterback before you even get the guitar, but by all means, do fit 12-53 bronze 80/20s as your first string, Joe. This is not a guitar that was meant to be strung with flats. If you've never had a purely acoustic archtop before, it is a different creature in some ways from the usual amplified suspects. It is, first and foremost - perhaps even only - an acoustic guitar. It's not "acoustic in character but typically played amplified."

Also resist the urge to put on giant strings (hence the 12-53 suggestion). If you are planning to play rhythm in an orchestra, then okay, sure. But I don't think that's your thing. If this is a lightly built guitar, you and your soft touch (as demonstrated in video) will thank me.

RP, your advice is priceless. You live this stuff, I am still learning. I'll admit that right now, I wanted this guitar because of what it is. Not because I played one and couldn't live without it. So your advice is tailor made to what you know about my style, which by the way is dead on. Which 80/20 do you recommend? The coated elixir strings look nice. They would subdue the string noise that I despise. Do you think the RC 1000 will be a good pup for those strings?

[Stringswinger]

Joe,

RP offers good advise about strings. You should try bronze first to hear the guitar as the maker intended it to sound. At some point, like me, you will probably gravitate to Thomastic flats because that is what our fretting hand is used to and likes. Thomastic 13's are for the most part the same gauge and feel as Bronze 12's. Going one step farther, I would stay away from the coated strings as they kill some of the frequencies, and again, you should HEAR this guitar. Your Heritage DA and Heritage Johnny Smith, while carved guitars with a floater, were designed to be electric guitars. Your 35 DA is an acoustic guitar of the highest caliber.

For me, the Thomastic flats feel better and I am so used to the loss of high frequency from nickel flats, that I have come to prefer that sound, along with the feel. I suspect that you will too. I do admit that with Bronze strings, my DA's sound more "lush".

You may experience some string balance issues using bronze strings with the Dearmond 1000 (that is why they created the Dearmond 1100) but the Dearmond 1100 is available as a reissue at a very low price if you need to go that route. The Dearmond 1000 sounds great with nickel strings.

DR Sunbeams or DR Rare would be my string choice for Bronze (12-54) on an archtop.

[Max405]

The guitar is strung with a fresh set of 80/20's. 12's
i get the sense I will keep them on for an hour, and then when I detail it, the strings will come off and on the TI's go!

[rpguitar]

Cool discussion about strings. It's good to get mentally prepared while you are wringing your hands in anticipation!

My personal favorites for acoustic archtop are all 12-53 80/20 sets, uncoated/"normal":

La Bella Criterion Golden Alloy
John Pearse
D'Addario

I have used them all on my prized '28 L-5, '33 L-12, '47 L-5, and '47 S400. These are all acoustic guitars.

I mounted a reissue 1100 on the Super 400 recently, so that and the '47 L-5 (vintage 1100 equipped) now have nickel roundwounds to get a bit more electric sound. They're great acoustically, too, though. In fact I can't help but recommend this nickel round wound string:

John Pearse acoustic electric set 2700

Anyway, you'll find that the 80/20 strings are actually pretty smooth, especially the La Bellas that I listed. They aren't smooth like TI Swings, but they are not rough phosphor bronze 13's either.

I like a pretty low action on my acoustic archtops because I play lightly, and I often play fingerstyle with nails. I am not a believer in the big strings/move the top style; that's for dudes punching out four to the bar behind a line of horns. I don't have that opportunity very often (i.e. never!).

Bottom line, just an opinion but it's my perspective - approach this guitar for what it is. Don't try to make it be like your other axes. In time, you may begin to really love the different mode it puts you in musically, and you will probably develop a voice on it that's just slightly different than your other instruments. That's all good.

[Dennis D]

My 1937 Style A is parallel braced with a 1 11/16 nut and a 25 inch scale. I find it plays very well with Thomastic 13 flats.

...I think I'd start there too, FWIW.

[neatomic]

the only type string of that era thats been left out are monel strings..that was gibsons mona-steel strings...

currently, rotosound make a set of 12 flats...and martin and pyramid make monel roundwounds...

they are more nickel than 80/20's.. but have more added copper than pure nickel...so kind of in between

cheers

[nopedals]

> just under 1/2" clearance under the strings so there's not much room for a floater under there. Hopefully the rhythm chief 1000 will fit.

Archtop.com says 7/16" for both the 1000 and the 1100 ... but I recently bought a reissue 1100 and the treble E fretted out at about the 15th fret (with no screw adjustment; I assume they were down all the way). An RI 1000 fits the same guitar fine (and I previously had a vintage 1000 on the same guitar with no issues). Mine was about 1/2 inch. So if it is just under half an inch the 1000 will likely fit fine, but perhaps not the 1100.

[vinnyv1k]

IMO pole adjustment screws are a must for making string volume equal on all strings. Archtop string volumes can vary extremely when amplified. This is one reason I dislike the Gibson BJB pickup as found on LeGrand's not to say you can't get lucky on a specific archtop without them. I have found though as a general rule you need to tame the B string and beef up the high E and G string.

[Cunamara]

Why stop with those? Johnny Smith's own D'A is for sale:

https://reverb.com/item/415868-d-ang...l-1957-natural

Plus there are photos of an envelope from Johnny showing his street address in Colorado Springs. Turns out the house, a modest 3 BR ranch, is on the market for $200k. Why not go all out and own a piece of jazz real estate!?

I am not sure you're chasing a coherent dream here, Joe, or if it's just a whisper of a jazz guitar fantasy riding a unicorn near the end of a rainbow. I'm thinking those particular guitars won't do for you what your Heritage D'A has done. But such is the nature of the quest...

Just looking at this today in light of reading Lin Flanagan's book. I think there is a discrepancy- the guitar is listed as a 1957 Excel but the letter refers to Johnny Smith's 1955 Excel. The latter was a sunburst with 20 frets; the ad lists the guitar as having 22 frets which Flanagan specifically states Smith did not like because of the change in tone caused by shifting the pickup closer to the bridge.

There may be a mismatch here- the guitar in the ad may not in fact be Johnny Smith's famed 1955 D'angelico referred to in the letter. It may be a fabulous guitar in it's own right but it does not appear to be Johnny's famous guitar- which he used for nearly 30 years- as implied. Scgim referred to that '55 as the greatest guitar ever built and he may have a point there...

[wintermoon]

Just looking at this today in light of reading Lin Flanagan's book. I think there is a discrepancy- the guitar is listed as a 1957 Excel but the letter refers to Johnny Smith's 1955 Excel. The latter was a sunburst with 20 frets; the ad lists the guitar as having 22 frets which Flanagan specifically states Smith did not like because of the change in tone caused by shifting the pickup closer to the bridge.

There may be a mismatch here- the guitar in the ad may not in fact be Johnny Smith's famed 1955 D'angelico referred to in the letter. It may be a fabulous guitar in it's own right but it does not appear to be Johnny's famous guitar- which he used for nearly 30 years- as implied. Scgim referred to that '55 as the greatest guitar ever built and he may have a point there...

he had at least 2 DA's that made it onto record covers, an Excel shown on the Mosaic box set and his famous '55 New Yorker Special shown on the Roost lps
the latter had his name engraved on a a blockmarker in the fingerboard

[sgcim]

Yea, that 1955 D'A is the only guitar I would gladly pay an astronomical sum of money for, and not think twice about it.