Where can I buy a Charlie Christian Pickup?

[Jasper6120]

Hey all. I put this message out to the gifted and able people of this forum to ask if any of you have advice for me on how I can get my mitts on a traditionally mounted Charlie Christian Pickup? I really need one for a project that I have just about completed. Seymour Duncan was making them, but not any more. CC Pickups in the UK are probably making them, but for some reason will not return my emails (even though I sent them my money...), but other than that I have no idea.
Can anyone help?

Kind regards

J

[Jabberwocky]

Jason Lollar Charlie Christian Pickup for Archtop Guitars .

Pete Biltof of Vintage Vibe.

[Jasper6120]

Ahh, I see he's made a bracket to use traditional mounting. When mounted I suppose it'll look just as good as an old one.

[neatomic]

the thing about the original cc pup was that it used a weaker magnet…it was pre all these modern ones..so they had to use a giant sized one to get decent inductance…nowadays with alnico 5 magnet you can miniaturize it..but the actual magnetic field is not quite the same..in terms of sheer size/dimension..so not really the same tone..also they used thick #38 wire to wind the pup…#42 has pretty much been the standard since the 50's…

lollar, vintage vibe and curtis novak…would all be of help, i'd bet..if in europe contact rautia pickups

kinda surprised seymour d custom shop wouldnt tackle original cc 3 screw mount…did you send them a request?

luck

cheers

[Jasper6120]

I've shot Marciela from SD an email about the CC pickup. Awaiting a response. I wouldn't be surprised if they can, even though a sales rep has already told me they couldn't. MJ should be able to tackle it I would think. We'll see.

[rpguitar]

Also, if you are in UK or EU, these folks are making them available. Daniel Slaman uses them on his excellent CC-inspired guitars, once of which I own:

Charlie Christian Pickups - CC Pickups

[bananafist]

RP - speaking of Daniel Slaman guitars, and in particular, the Pat Metheny model (ie-yours!) how about a review? Enquiring minds would love to know your thoughts on it.

[Jasper6120]

CC pickups are not replying to my emails. I got in contact with Daniel Slaman. His guitars look wonderful but I'm not sure that he would be interested in selling me the individual component, rather just a whole guitar. We'll see. It looks like the Lollar is the only feasible option unless Seymour Duncan are willing to make one.

[ozzeng]

Isn't the CC pickup made by Vintage Vibe Guitars an option as well?

Vintage Vibe Guitar Pickups: Single Coil Pickups
Charlie Christian Style Pickups

[oldane]

Just a heretic comment from someone who has actual experience with the original CC pickup:

I happen to have two guitars with Pete Biltofts HCC pickup (an approximation to the original CC pickup, just in humbucker disguise so it can be mounted in a traditional humbucker mount). It's a very, very good pickup. It doesn't sound exactly like the original CC - but still a most excellent pickup. It's available with your choice of magnet strength. Jason Lollar also makes excellent modern CC pickups.

I also have a guitar with an original 1938 Gibson CC pickup (the one with the notch under the B string). The pickup itself sounds great but it's unbalanced and very noisy. (The modern producers of replicas may have done something about that). In addition, the three point mount system is heavy and the screws are at some distance from the heavy pickup. It tends to work itself loose, so the shims under the screws buzz. One can tighten the screws but they will loosen again in a short time (hours to a few days). And you can't do without the metal shims because the unit is so heavy that without the shims the screw heads will dig into the guitar top with time. I have seen pictures of Barney Kessel with his ES350 with its retrofitted CC where he has inserted a folded sheet of paper between the CC pickup and the guitar top - likely to stop annoying buzzing/rattling.

So ..... While I love the sound per se of the original CC, from the point of view of the working guitarist, a modern CC approximation with a modern mount system (for example humbucker) would be more practical in daily use. My guitar with the original CC is more like a museum piece for me while I play one with the Biltoft HCC daily. There was a reason Gibson replaced the CC with lighter pickups with simpler mounts as soon as possible.

[campusfive]

Try buying a UK CC pickup through a middle man, such as djangobooks.com. Also, definitely try Slaman. I'm guessing the UK guys are so small that they might be backed up or otherwise unable to deal with the incoming.

[robertm2000]

i will vote for Pete Biltoft of Vintage Vibe Guitars. Pete has excellent knowledge about all aspects of pickups, and his big point is his willingness to talk with purchasers till he knows exactly what they want. Pete answers his own phone. And then he will build what you decide you want. I would talk with him (at "www.vintagevibeguitars.com") and see what he has to say. I'll bet he could come up with a very close approximation of the old Charlie Christian style - Pete can custom build any pickup format you could ask for. And there are, of course, the interchangeable magnets that Pete provides - Alnico 2, 3, 5, and ceramic. Those can make a huge difference in the sound. I've had two of his pickups in the electric guitar that I use almost exclusively. You can tell I'm fan of Pete Biltoft and Vintage Vibe Guitars pickups

[old tube]

When I was sourcing a CC pickup for the 1963 custom ES-175 I posted a couple of weeks back, I had quite a few problems like you.

First I decided to go with CC as I am in the UK. I emailed but no response. Purchased one through a retailer in the UK and had to return it as it was so poorly made, coil wire was bulging out of the wrap at the top, magnets were loose etc. really was a disgrace.

Next choice, Seymour Duncan who's antiquities I like and he seemed to make the CC to vintage specs. Placed my order and three weeks later they returned my money with a note saying that they were no longer doing them! I phoned and spoke to Mr Duncan's son who informed me that they had too many returned with damage, clearly sustained at installation. I can vouch for how hard these pickups are to mount!

I then went to Lollar. The pickup arrived in 10 days (to the UK) and was very well constructed. He suspends the magnets underneath making the pickup very deep and uses a perspex plate to fit the traditional mount and allow adjustment of height and pickup angle. He does use 38 gauge wire and demagnetised alnico 2 mags I believe.

Suffice to say that I am delighted with it, it really does have the CC vibe I was looking for and is not a noisy pickup, no worse than a P90. Also the string balance is very good on it.

[neatomic]

in jason lollar we trust..no doubt!!


he's a stickler for detail..and that's good..and he knows a lot of details when it comes to pickups of allsorts…good to hear his trad cc is good, tho not surprised…

sorry to hear sd's problems

there are some great cc 3 screw installation clips on youtube…there was one done by an irish luthier that was just fantastic..

cheers

ps- to oldane…try putting beeswax on any screw or moving part..it will stop them from moving and yet still be noninvasive enough …so that they can still be adjusted later

[jazzbow]

Whatever CC maker you go with definitely opt for AlNico 2 magnets. Softer sound, real nice. Better than AlNico 5. AlNico 5's sound harsh to me.

[neatomic]

alnico III has even less gauss…but as i stated the mass of the original magnet structure contributed to the sound..the orig cc magnets were under a larger portion of the string..which changes point of focus, frequency etc etc

btw, reason for notched b cc originally was because guitar strings had wound b!!!…when they went to unwound..the unwound b was now too loud..so the notched b bar cc to compensate

cheers

[entresz]

I have a Pete Biltoft floating CC pickup, I asked for it to be wound with 38 gauge wire and to be voiced as close to an original CC as possible. I've compared it to an original CC and it is very close... obviously two totally different guitars are going to not sound the same, but the tone was very similar.

[Jasper6120]

So much great information on this thread. Really great. Do you think Pete Biltoft would make a 3 screw variant of the p'up?

[neatomic]

So much great information on this thread. Really great. Do you think Pete Biltoft would make a 3 screw variant of the p'up?

he very well might..worth an email!!!

and curtis novak as well…another great vintage informed pup maker..google'm


cheers

[entresz]

I'm sure that Pete could make on with the traditional mount. He makes a massive range of pickups, his Facebook page is full of interesting pickups that he has made.

[jazzbow]

So much great information on this thread. Really great. Do you think Pete Biltoft would make a 3 screw variant of the p'up?

This is on his F/B page...


It's a double blade but wow!

[neatomic]

don't quite get that photo?? where are the 2 huge bar magnets??..



cheers

[oldane]

don't quite get that photo?? where are the 2 huge bar magnets??..



cheers

They are replaced by magnets at the underside of the PU (not visible in the photo) like on most moderne PUs. That's why I consider the 3 point mount an anacroism on those modern CC approximations - it's only there to make it look like the original CC PU.

[neatomic]

exactly!..the pup (looks like it) is built like the humbucker mount pickup but with the faux trappings of the 3 screw mount


the pic i supplied is from the uk company cc… he gets it right!

cheers

[jazzbow]

don't quite get that photo?? where are the 2 huge bar magnets??.


cheers

The Vintage Vibe has the bar magnets in the pickup body. You can unscrew the pickup and change out the magnets yourself. As for the adjustment area of the traditional looking CC p/u I posted earlier, that looks to be made of 3 ply fibre flatwork.