Gibson L-5 tone on small gigs

[gianluca]

I read in another thread:

"if the amp and venue are loud enough you couldn't tell a ES175 from an X500 from an L5 from a Golden Eagle. However, playing at low volumes in a small space you hear the guitar, your amp, and the space. This is where most of us spend most of our time and where the guitar makes a difference"

I have just one guitar and I play it at home and at the few gigs I do every month (small jazz club).
I never go in a studio recording, I'm just an intermediate player.
the guitar is a gibson L-5 CES: I love the tone I get at home but I'm always frustrated when I play gigs because the tone there is anything special.

So I'm wondering if it is a good idea owning an L-5 when you can recognize its tone only at home: I have a 5/6000 euro guitar that sounds like a 200 euro one, on stage.
I often put it for sale thinking to go for a lower budget guitar but every time I stop the trade and keep the L-5.

It's just me?
any thought?

[disco~juice]

It's hard to sound the same everywhere. Do you play a different amp onstage?

[jasaco]

I think there's no doubt that in the small space you are hearing a combination of the guitar's acoustic tone and its amplified tone, while in a larger venue, at louder volume, you are mainly (and sometimes exclusively) hearing it's amplified tone. I think you should sell me the L-5 and be done with this irritating problem.

[Jabberwocky]

gianluca, don't do it, man. just don't sell your L5CES (and may you never need the money). you'll simply go right out to buy another.

[gianluca]

It's hard to sound the same everywhere. Do you play a different amp onstage?

no: just one amp, always the jc120

[jasaco]

gianluca, don't do it, man. just don't sell your L5CES (and may you never need the money). you'll simply go right to buy another.

Scram! I'm workin' this beat...

[Jabberwocky]

Scram! I'm workin' this beat...

[vinlander]

I have listened to some of your playing on youtube channel and I can hear an L5 tone there.
I also guess it is the mixture of nice vibrating carved top at home volume that can't compete at high volume on stage with the pickup.
You have one of the quintessential jazz guitar many are drooling on, I would definitely not sell that great guitar for an el cheapo...
Something you can do is to buy a cheap alternative like a used Epi Broadway for 400$ go on stage and experience if it is the same...you can always sell it back for the same price you pay and and not having made the mistake of selling your L5...

[fritz jones]

laminates feed back a lot too.

[Broyale]

Scram! I'm workin' this beat...

HAHAHAAHHA!
I ain't mad at ya, playboy!

[GoergeBenson]

Yeh what your saying is true to an extent, although if I may....

I have a Guild X-700 and it sounds far better than most anaemic budget Ibanez etc.
Even when played loud!

I've had pretty much all the different types of archtop you can buy and I would say, yes you don't need a $10,000 at a loud gig, it will give diminishing returns and 'if' you don't like the tone of your L5 loud, then it would be good to have a second archtop that performs well in these situations.

Having a cheap guitar that will fill 75% of your L5 needs will be very hard. SO get a second cheaper box to play at loud gigs and keep your main axe for the other 75%.

Trust me, getting a guitar that does it all, is nigh on impossible.

[ESCC]

I suggest trying some different amps, I would change the JC120 before changing the L-5.

[SuperFour00]

If you're independently wealthy, keep the L-5 ... but used guitar prices, at least for high level instruments, aren't going up, they may even be going down. There are many examples in these threads of quality Asian instruments available for a fraction of the value of your L-5. Some of these are great sounding instruments. You are wise to consider recouping some money from your guitar before it's used price goes even lower, and investing some of that back into a Japanese or Korean instrument and maybe a smaller amp, so that you have a choice of amps for different purposes.

[Greentone]

I agree with the previous comment. I used to use the JC120 but migrated away from it. It is a great, bulletproof amp, but it doesn't get the classic jazz tone that the L5CES deserves. For jazz gigs a Twin Reverb, a Polytone, Clarus with RE cabinet, etc., will give you a good tone from the CES.

[2bornot2bop]

The solution is a no brainer for some of us...simply buy a Gigmaster, or even a Monarch, and install the pickup of your choice for an affordable gigging guitar. At the price of the Euro vs. $, and if inventory in Europe is in short supply, I'm sure some forum member could secure a state side Gigmaster for you and simply ship it to you directly via USPS.

L5's are everywhere, and easily replaceable, in my opinion. I'd not be reluctant to sell an L5 on the premise it's hard to replace.

Here's an experiment video, although in a home environment, based upon a Korean built Peerless Gigmaster, a Chinese L5 knockoff, and an original Gibson ES175. Each guitar has been prepped with a '57 classic in the neck position:

btw, great playing...the billie's bounce duo is smokin!

[rpguitar]

Well, I think a guitar is worth more than its tone and whether that tone can be heard well in different environments. It's an instrument that responds physically to your inputs. A well set up L-5CES melts like a pat of butter dropped into a piping hot baked potato. You practice on it, so gig on it. Have a backup for dodgy venues, but don't get rid of the better guitar. Would you ditch the great looking girl because you can't see her as well when the lights go out...??

[mr. beaumont]

Is tone the only qualifier as to why a guitar is enjoyable to play?

You say the L5 is nothing special in a big room...so a Peerless would be?

[kamlapati]

Simple, gianluca, it is always a good idea to own an L-5. And if you own one, it is really fun to play one too.

[Pat Clare]

Do you use any effects?

[coolvinny]

I think with any hollow-body / large-ish amp combination, it takes some time to figure out how to get a decent tone at jamming volumes. Guitar / amp / body / wall placement can make a big difference. With my mambo 8" closed back amp it was easy to get a decent tone anywhere, but when I got my 12" open back tube amp I had to experiment quite a bit before I could find a sound I was happy with. This included playing with my pickup too...both the overall height, the treble/bass side angle and the individual poles. Also, on a hollow body, I find that for gigging volumes if my strings are dead then the sound can get too muffled. At home I don't notice, but cutting through the mix...other people do notice (which really surprised me, actually).

But more generally, if you like the L5-CES at home then keep it unless you need the money. You spend most of your time practicing so having an enjoyable instrument to practice on is worth something. And you just know you'll itch for something like the L5 later...you'll end up wasting time and money chasing it later. Keep what you got and just choose the right tool for the gig depending on all relevant factors.

[SuperFour00]

Is tone the only qualifier as to why a guitar is enjoyable to play?

You say the L5 is nothing special in a big room...so a Peerless would be?

Here's an analogy. My Corvette looks great and makes points with my friends, but it doesn't handle any better than a Renault at high speeds, and can't outrun an old RX7. Do I need it? Should I keep it?

I'd rather insure the Renault.

[Jabberwocky]

Here's an analogy. My Corvette looks great and makes points with my friends, but it doesn't handle any better than a Renault at high speeds, and can't outrun an old RX7. Do I need it? Should I keep it?

I'd rather insure the Renault.

I'd ride the bus...and I do.

[SuperFour00]

I'd ride the bus...and I do.

What kind of a guitar is the bus?

[Jabberwocky]

What kind of a guitar is the bus?

Is that a riddle? You can't play a bus but you can play a guitar.

[wintermoon]

Is that a riddle? You can't play a bus but you can play a guitar.

maybe, but you can't tuna fish