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Any good touch sensitive response modelling amps.
I've only used a Pod and demoed a few others in music shops, but are there any reasonably priced Guitar amp modellers, that have the touch sensitivity response of a good Tube/valve guitar amp in the clean/slightly overdriven range.
The Axe FX and Kemper are too expensive, but are there any other less expensive choices.
Thanks
Guy
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02-01-2014 11:25 AM
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axefx, kemper. 32 bit processing. Haven't really had much luck with anything else but now that yamaha owns line6 there's some hope.
have you tried an ethos pedal or zendrive clone?
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+1 for the Ethos- they really shine when recording direct & even though tonally they're very versatile, that slight breakup thing you want is their bag. Touch wise, it's solid-state so that's what it'll feel like, not a valve amp obviously - but it won't have that dull response/very slight latency that low to mid-range digital modelers have.
My guess is that 2-5 years from now, modelers in all price ranges will be competitive with traditional designs in terms of touch response and tone, but atm mid-level gear like line6 does a lot of things 'pretty good' but 'not quite'.
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i wouldn't call the ethos' touch solid state. I think it's solidly on the tube side of the halfway point between SS and tube. The clean channel is very tube-like. I've had a lot of folks fooled with the tone and touch of this thing.
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I only use the clean channel on mine - it's got the immediacy of solid-state which I happen to like, without the harshness. I haven't owned a valve amp in years, but when I occasionally play through one, it takes me a minute to adjust to the sag. Solid-states can vary a bit - a jazz chorus hits you in the face pretty hard, whereas a henriksen has a nice cushion to it.
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i don't agree 3625. I feel that the clean channel in the ethos has a decidedly valve feel to it. Very unlike SS. When I kick it on with my corus or quilter, the difference in tube-like feel is pretty drastic.
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I hear what you're saying - I really dig mine - but you gotta admit, it doesn't sag anything like a twin or princeton, does it? You could say it has it's own thing going, but it's a solid state device so...
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if you get sag with a twin you are playing damn loud.
Sag is an artifact of the power section and even a princeton doesn't sag unless you're playing humbuckers through it and playing really loud.
The jfets in the ethos are very close to tubes in their response. It doesn't feel exactly like a tube amp but it's not because of sag. That doesn't even come into play for the kinds of stuff I do. Even the loud fusion stuff...
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ping pong lol - I'm talking about low volume playing - valve compression (if that's more correct terminology?) to me is quite noticeable even when playing quietly - for you no?. So with all this kit, there's a spectrum from say - jc harshness to twin cushion. But to me, the Ethos essentially feels like a solid state device, although tonally it's more valve-like in character.
However - I will admit it feels very different whether you're running it into a 'normal' combo or a frfr set up. frfr's naturally feel wider, and as a consequence 'spongier' - so when I did some gigs using the Ethos into a pa, that did feel very valve like. But running it into the front of an SS combo, it still feels very SS to moi.
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i feel exactly the opposite. Through a FRFR system (which i think is internet hype) it sounds more hifi like and less like a real amp. Anyway, no problem. Agree to disagree.
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Agreed!
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Most touch response amps I've ever experienced were Marshall Silver Jubilee (Printed Circuit Board) and any true Class A type of amp AC 30, Champ,Matchless,etc. Never have found solid state amps to feel anything but immediate w/out the sag.
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I have Scuffham S Gear and for about 100$, I found the feel/response better than many others in the same price category.
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Hey 3625! I never got a chance to try the Ethos and the only time I got to Sydney last year was for a Friday lunch and flight straight back. (because you kindly offered to let me hear yours whenever I was up that way).
But I did end my search for a "slight break up OD pedal" when I tried a Fuchs Valve Job. That pedal is on my board for good.
Andy Fuchs is on to something. IMO that guy has great ears…..and feel.
Anyway I was going to ask you or Jack Z if the clean channel of the Ethos is similar to a Barb Eq pedal…. I am under the impression that they both emulate a Fender tone shape.
oops….OT again!
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Phil - I've never tried the Barb so can't comment there. I googled the Valve Job - looks the business for that style of pedal, when I've got time I'll check out the rest of his products on the website for kicks.
Originally Posted by Philco
Re: Ethos - whether or not the tonal character is preferable/same/worse than a barb eq, or that mambo prototype pedal and the like - I guess that's in the ear of the beholder. I personally dig the Ethos more as a swiss army knife vibe - really versatile. For example, I just did a month housesitting for my bassplayer and practiced through his acoustic image combo using the Ethos to colour the tone. Similarly, had a jam with a bassist and just brought the Ethos and used his amp. I've gigged with it straight into a pa, and at home I practice with it going into a cheap set of Behringer monitors, or chuck it in front of the jazz chorus. I don't use the dirt, but took it to a friends place for him to try - he's more into amps and pedals (mods both on his own) - and we compared the Ethos to a pair of fulltone overdrives he had. He was impressed, though I guess the market for overdrive is saturated (pun not intended) with lots of fine options atm.
Perhaps, I could try the Barb and like it marginally better than the Ethos? or not? I guess it comes down to how far you want to jump down the rabbithole. I'm not overly fussy with amps - as long as it's a good quality balanced clean tone without harshness then I'm basically happy. I wouldn't mind either way plugging into a twin/henriksen/Ethos into a p.a., as long as it sounds good with an archtop. But I can dig how players like yourself really chase after a particular sound that they're hearing in their head. I get real detailed with how picks sound though...
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Originally Posted by 3625
……and that's why I keep going back to a Fender Medium! (but did you know that the multi coloured ones sound different to the brown ones……and that there a 2 different shapes of a Fender Medium….depending on when it was made?) but I digress.
Anyway thanks for the detailed reply 3625 and apologies to the OP for taking this OT.
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l'll answer your question since i actually have owned both. Originally Posted by Philco
No, the ethos is totally different than the barbeq . The barbeq is just a tone stack that mimics the fender tone stack. The ethos actually uses jfets to simulate the tube voicing and reacts like a tube amp. It gives you that spongey, tube feel. The barbeq just gives you eq. The clean channel of the ethos sounds like the clean channel in a dumble amp. It's fendery but more middy and has a much tighter and more focused bottom end. Plus, it's got a real presence control which is great.
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Thanks Jack. I'm very interested in those Ethos qualities. Seems to me that I need to have one and do some experimenting. From what I've heard I could sell it easily if I didn't need it. Originally Posted by jzucker
Jack, seeing you have an Ethos, have you ever compared it to the Zendrive?
These are pedals we don't get to audition over here.
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confetti ones are warmer aren't they? Originally Posted by Philco
premium celluoid sound real posh like
white/black good but not super wow
and the brown tortoiseshell with a bit more cut and vibe (my fave)
Something about the early ones having straighter edges? (I don't know what that means exactly, but have heard it around the traps)
My worst derail performance on a thread yet... sorry Guy!
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yes, I was an early endorser for zendrive and I love it. The ethos dirty channel is more dynamic and amp-like than the zendrive. I'm currently using a wilson dual lotus which is a 2 channel zendrive. Basically, 2 in one housing. My favorite overdrive sound is the clean channel of the ethos driving the zendrive...err...wilson dual lotus. Originally Posted by Philco
In terms of clean and semi-clean tone and amp-like tone the ethos is way superior to the zen
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The Studio Devil/Atomic Amps AmpliFIRE looks promising. Debuted at NAMM last month. Not much information out on it yet.
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heard great things about that also Originally Posted by barrymclark
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do you gents suppose there will be a clean channel only version of the ethos? what would give that sort of experience without the crazy price tag (transforming a jc77 into something clean, tubey and fendery)? is the barb eq the only other way to go? i'm not entirely displeased with what i got, but i'm always curious.
extra bonus points if something can pull of the same trick in front of a vox.
the rack eleven is cheaper than the axe/kemper stuff and the line 6 rack is cheaper still. not tried either, but i suppose they'd be worth a looksee.
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Yes. There will be a clean only Ethos pedal. He's already spoken about it publicly. It will still be pricey but substantially less than the current version. Originally Posted by feet
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I own a eleven rack, which has touch sensitive response in a modeling amp but without the price of a Axefx or Klemper. Worth checking out.
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