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Which Jim Hall tone? His tone was different with his ES-175 with the P90 compared to the same guitar with a Guild humbucker and the fingerboard replaced with ebony; his tone was different from that with his D'Aquisto, and different again with his Sadowsky. And yet it all sounds like Jim Hall...
Originally Posted by rpjazzguitar
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06-24-2026 07:09 PM
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I saw Jim Hall live many times from 1974 until the 2000's (I saw him that last time he played the Kuumbwa Jazz Center in Santa Cruz.). He was playing his 175 with the Guild Bucker, his D'Aquisto and his Sadowsky in different shows, always through a Polytone amp. And he always sounded like Jim Hall, which to say he always sounded like one of the legends of jazz guitar. Originally Posted by Cunamara
Which Jim Hall tone? His tone was different with his ES-175 with the P90 compared to the same guitar with a Guild humbucker and the fingerboard replaced with ebony; his tone was different from that with his D'Aquisto, and different again with his Sadowsky. And yet it all sounds like Jim Hall...
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I was thinking about the mid 60s albums with Paul Desmond. Also Concerto de Aranjuez Originally Posted by Cunamara
Which Jim Hall tone? His tone was different with his ES-175 with the P90 compared to the same guitar with a Guild humbucker and the fingerboard replaced with ebony; his tone was different from that with his D'Aquisto, and different again with his Sadowsky. And yet it all sounds like Jim Hall...
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If you seriously want warm, fat, and thick, these are the ones. Fralin makes 3 levels: Pure PAF - low, Modern PAF - med, High Output PAF - high. And you can choose your output level for the first 2. They're $175 and really worth it.
Traditional Humbuckers - Fralin Pickups
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I have never tried a Fralin Humbucker, but I have a Fralin pickup in my Boutique Thinline Tele (His Steel Pole 43), and it is a great sounding pickup. I would bet that high output PAF would be a great jazz guitar pickup. Originally Posted by Strat-itis
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Fralin makes an excellent pickup. I tried some humbucker's in a friend's Epi 335 recently and it was a great sound for blues/funk/rock/etc. I've never heard a lousy sounding Lollar pickup either. Nor Gibson come to think of it. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
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I like all the Gibson Buckers except the Burstbuckers. They have an edge that while great for rock, Country and blues do not get me into the jazz tone in my head. Originally Posted by DawgBone
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Originally Posted by Strat-itis
Originally Posted by Stringswinger
Originally Posted by DawgBone
I have Fralin Pure PAFs in my Sadowsky Semi and they are great sounding pickups for everything really.. Also have Fralin vintage hots in my strat.
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IMHO, probably, any good quality Alnico 2 HB will do warm, fat, thick. If you know how to use EQ.
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Yes Fralins are great. Vintage correct and super pleasing and usable to play. I bet the high output would be a great immoderate jazz pickup. Originally Posted by Stringswinger
Yes, there are a good number of outstanding pickup builders. Originally Posted by DawgBone
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I've compiled the DCRs for the 3 output levels of the vintage style Fralin humbuckers:
Pure PAF
Neck: 7.5, 7.8
Bridge: 8.0, 8.2, 8.4
Modern PAF
Neck: 8.0. 8.5
Bridge: 8.0, 9.0, 9.5
High Output PAF
Neck: 11.3
Bridge: 13
So I'm sure you could find one that fits your taste for fat.
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You can't go by DCR alone. For example, the Bendetto B6 has a DCR of 12 but a very moderate output of about 500 mV max. There's a lot more to tone than DC coil resistance, e.g. resonant frequencies and their Qs, magnet strength, pickup design, etc. Originally Posted by Strat-itis
I've compiled the DCRs for the 3 output levels of the vintage style Fralin humbuckers:
Pure PAF
Neck: 7.5, 7.8
Bridge: 8.0, 8.2, 8.4
Modern PAF
Neck: 8.0. 8.5
Bridge: 8.0, 9.0, 9.5
High Output PAF
Neck: 11.3
Bridge: 13
So I'm sure you could find one that fits your taste for fat.
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Ok, then please post all pickups' output in millivolts so we can be accurate :P. I'm aware that DCR isn't a direct indication of output, but Fralins aren't on the thin side - they're on the punchy side. So if you get 8 or 9k range it will probably be quite fat. The 11 or 13 ones will probably blast air with the amp on 2.
Last edited by Strat-itis; 06-25-2026 at 06:30 PM.
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I guess I would go for a 8k and Alnico 2 magnets for specs. Some good brands mentioned in the threads already.
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Indeed, my Biltoft CC style pickup had a DCR around 4.5 and was loud. ISTR the originals had 38 ga windings or something like that. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
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On the other end of the spectrum is something like the DeArmond 1000 - 15.4k DCR, but actual output is more like a low wind humbucker. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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From Chatgpt, so it might be right.
So, to get that high resistance but still keep it (sounding) thin, you might do a few things. For one, you can use fewer or thinner gauge wire so it still picks up a lot of turns, which raises resistance, but it doesn’t beef up the low end. You can also use a more powerful magnet, which can tighten up the low frequencies and reduce the bass. Or you could keep the coil arrangement so it’s not as inductive—like spacing out the windings or using a flatter coil shape—so even with a high turn count, you don’t get a lot of low-end boost. That keeps it bright and cutting, even with that high resistance.
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These last few posts are interesting and informative for me.
I had no idea that you could have a high DCR, but a comparatively low output....
I had always believed it was purely how high the DCR is.
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And, the reissue DeArmond 1000 sounds great too. Originally Posted by entresz
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so all else being equal you would get less bass with alnico V than III ? I have a pair of KA pafs one is V and the other III, Kent said use the III at the neck which sounded backward to me but it was Kent so thats what I did. Needless to say they sound great but wondered what the V would do at the neck havent tried it yet but what stuck with me is that one of the most famous pickups is the gibson Alnico V staple mainly installed in fine archtops like L5 S400 Byrdland etc which to my ear sound very "clean" like a hi fi p90 which would be consistent with rpjazz post. I have a p90 with 250k pots in my L5 and its one of the most Wes like "jazz" tones ever, more so than a "paf type" with 500K pots...go figure
great thread, I know even less than I realized
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A5 has more bass than A3. A3 has a similar middy, rich profile as A2, but it is more snappy and has less bass.
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For sure. DCR ballparks output of pickups of the same build, it is not a direct measurement of output. If the wire gauge and material is known, DCR gives the length of wire on the coil. The amount of wire on the coil is positively correlated with output, but other factors affect the end result also. Originally Posted by jazzyfan
Other factors that affect output are:
Pickup type such as humbucker, single coil, P90, mini humbucker, single coil size humbucker. The aperture, structure, and possible series connections affect output. To be able to ballpark best based on dcr you have to compare the same type of pickup. There are also wildcards like stacked single coils or p90s where the 2nd coil adds dcr but not output. So they'll be like 20k and have the output of a 7k true single coil.
Wind pattern. Different builders with different techniques get noticeable different punch levels with the same DCR.
Magnet type and strength. Mags have vastly different strengths, like A3 as the weakest to double thick ceramic at the strongest (used for rock not jazz).
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Fat, girthy, and thick? No doubt, the "Fat Diane" set from Manlius pickups... IMO
He makes them when you order them, and you can even customize for the same prize..
You rarely find any pickup makes that do that.
Fat Diane PAF from Manlius Pickups – Manlius Guitar
Thanks,
Arnie...
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