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Saw three examples of a guitar I'm curious about on the web site of our local GC. It said they had the three, each one was a different finish. So I went in today as long as I was driving by it anyway. Not wanting to deal with the screwy staff there, I looked around myself, and couldn't find even one of the three guitars. So I had to ask if they had any, and the guy said, "Oh I don't think so." So I told him about the three on their web site. He said "Oh don't pay any attention to what the web site says, it's best to call here."
And if that wasn't bad enough, look at this:
Used Ibanez RGDIX6PB BLACK BURL AND NATURAL Solid Body Electric Guitar BLACK BURL AND NATURAL | Guitar Center
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10-10-2025 08:47 PM
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The only reason GC is still in business is because of their return policy,otherwise they would have gone out of business years ago.
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Originally Posted by Woody Sound
LOL!
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Funny, I always thought their return policy was what would put them out of business, but I think you're probably right. I bought a Quilter amp from them which was very nice sounding but just not loud enough; returned it and it took about two minutes, no hassle no fuss no muss. Originally Posted by nyc chaz
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GC has always tried to pawn off used guitars as new even though you paid the new guitar price.It's happened to me 3 times.The best one was in 1997 i ordered a Musicman Luke on a special order and they always charged you extra for the case.I go to pick up the guitar and the case literally had holes in it like it was on the road for twenty years and the guitar had dents and scratches.It took three tries until finally i got the guitar in the new condition i paid for.The fact that they take things back for a full refund is what keeps them in business even though their business model has always been to try and pawn off used guitars as new. Originally Posted by Cunamara
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I haven't counted, but I would guess that a fairly sizable percent of their listings have pictures that don't match the guitar being listed. And even when they match the photos are usually of terrible quality. The return policy (+ sometimes being able to get someone on the phone who will describe the guitar in some detail) is what makes buying from GC online a viable option (for me, anyway). I've been lucky on that front -- two good guitars and one amp bought used at the best prices I could find that worked out fine. But the in-store experience is messed up. At least at the shop near me there just are not enough staffers, and it takes forever to actually buy something. When I've actually gotten someone's attention I haven't experienced the kind of BS'ing they're notorious for, but I don't generally ask then anything beyond "can I try that?", so there's not much opportunity for MSU. Originally Posted by Woody Sound
Yes, in the sense that the return policy makes frequent fliers more willing to deal with them, but I think there's more to it than that. I mean Sam Ash was pretty much the same store with the same policies, but they failed. Only a guess (as I am not in the business), but I think overall financing, website quality (GC's actually pretty good; Sam Ash's was a mess), relations with MFR's, store locations, etc. are all part of why GC is still around. Originally Posted by nyc chaz
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With Sam Ash out of the picture now, I think GC will be around for awhile...
Arnie...
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They may have been "the same store" in appearance and function, but there's great variation in how they're run. What differentiates going concerns from failing ones is usually their financial structure (i.e. debt vs equity), the cost of their debt service, and/or the returns expected by the owners or their investors. In privately held businesses with little debt, the biggest factor in financial stability is often how much the owners are taking out of the business in salary, bonuses, benefits, and options, Another major factor is their business model, from how they pay and reward their employees to how promptly and completely they pay their suppliers. Originally Posted by John A.
Sam Goody was a classic example. I can't confirm this with hard numbers, but the prevailing thought for years before they were bought by Best Buy in 2000 was that they were slow to pay their vendors. There are many stories in the industry that they'd run up a huge bill to a major record label, then offer to pay it if they were given a big discount. I assume the implied threat was bankruptcy, which finally happened in 2005 or 6 after they were bought from Best Buy by Sun Capital. Whether or not this story is true (and I've heard it enough times from enough different sources to believe it is), the point is that we have no idea how any of these businesses are being run and if or how much they're being bled by their owners and investors (and not infrequently by their employees).
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I've returned several things to GC. They were as cheerful and helpful with the refund as with the original sale. Meaning fine, but they might be busy.
Last experience was an Alto TS408 which I bought on line and arrived damaged. The plastic exterior was badly cracked and things were rattling around inside.
I was worried that they'd blame the shipping company and force me to try to get a refund from them -- or some other way to avoid just refunding my money.
But, no. They couldn't have been nicer about it and issued the refund with no hassle whatsoever. Salesman then suggested the JBL Eon One Compact, which is now part of my regular rig. I wouldn't have bought it solely on the salesman's recommendation, but I had already researched it.
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One of the things that hurt Sam Goody's reputation and business was they were caught bootlegging counterfeit records.I bought the Joe Pass Virtuoso album from them and i get it home and open it up and there is a Michael Jackson album inside.Must have been a mixup wherever they were counterfeiting.I thought they would give me a hard time when i returned it but they refunded my money without question which surprised me. Originally Posted by nevershouldhavesoldit
They may have been "the same store" in appearance and function, but there's great variation in how they're run. What differentiates going concerns from failing ones is usually their financial structure (i.e. debt vs equity), the cost of their debt service, and/or the returns expected by the owners or their investors. In privately held businesses with little debt, the biggest factor in financial stability is often how much the owners are taking out of the business in salary, bonuses, benefits, and options, Another major factor is their business model, from how they pay and reward their employees to how promptly and completely they pay their suppliers.
Sam Goody was a classic example. I can't confirm this with hard numbers, but the prevailing thought for years before they were bought by Best Buy in 2000 was that they were slow to pay their vendors. There are many stories in the industry that they'd run up a huge bill to a major record label, then offer to pay it if they were given a big discount. I assume the implied threat was bankruptcy, which finally happened in 2005 or 6 after they were bought from Best Buy by Sun Capital. Whether or not this story is true (and I've heard it enough times from enough different sources to believe it is), the point is that we have no idea how any of these businesses are being run and if or how much they're being bled by their owners and investors (and not infrequently by their employees).
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There were many allegations of bad business practices against Goody over the years, ranging from shoddy to illegal. But Sam Goody was in good company. Many major businesses were caught with a body part in the cookie jar over the years. Leslie Fay, Sunbeam, Crazy Eddie, and many many others were doing the same kinds of things. If you're interested, the book Financial Shenanigans by Howard Schilit details many famous accounting and business practice schemes for which the perpetrators were caught. Originally Posted by nyc chaz
Here's the full UPI article about Goody's federal conviction for selling unlicensed pirated tapes and records from 1981. The meat is in this paragraph:
"The government set up a dummy corporation, manned by an FBI agent, to sell illicitly reproduced recordings. It claimed Goody sold more than $400 million of pirated cassettes and eight-track tapes in 1979. The tapes, prosecutors said, normally sell wholesale for $6, but Goody got them at $2.60 each. Though the defense acknowledged Stolon bought some $23,000 in tapes and records such as 'Grease' and 'Saturday Night Fever,' it insisted he was unaware the records were reproduced without the knowledge of the artists or record companies. Stolon [a Goody VP] maintained he thought he was getting a good deal on the purchase."
It appears that Mr Stolon never heard the old saying "if it's too good to be true, it's not". But that wsn't a sound defense.
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I really try to never buy or go to GC, or any box store if possible. Even Amazon,Walmart,etc. They don’t really help any local musicians , and just hurt local shops.
Sometimes it’s unavoidable,especially small electronic accessories. But I’d rather pay a bit more and support local dealers if at all possible.
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I prefer smaller vendors, but will buy from GC if they have what I want. For certain pedals, accessories, etc., it’s the only option other than buying online.
They may be owned by a large corporation, but they are a local franchise, employ local people, and pay local taxes including sales tax. So it’s not a lose-lose proposition for them to be around.
One of the weaker independent stores in the Omaha area went out of business when GC showed up, but the rest stuck it out and now are thriving, because they offer great service and products. Early on during COVID a shop run by a guy I know couldn’t keep guitars in stock cause they were selling so quickly. Business is still going well for the local guys.
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I'm pretty sure that GC stores are all company owned and that none is franchised. Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
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And supporting Big Box Stores or corporations is exactly what puts Mom and Pop businesses out of business.
Sure you can save few bucks or easily procure an item. But like the proverbial Frog in the Soup being boiled slowly?
Again,sometimes there’s no choice, but try a bit harder and spend a bit more. You get what you pay for and I prefer a local thriving community that invests in their own neighborhood.
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I only buy big box if there's not a choice.
I was in the middle of a major tree job, and a small obscure probably proprietary part broke on my Remington extension pole chainsaw, which rendered it useless. So I looked up the part on Remington's site. It was priced reasonably, but would take a minimum 5 days to get. For the heck of it, I tried googling it for other supppliers, and Amzn came up. Sure enough they had Remington's part, with free next day delivery.
Now let's face it, usually when you need a part for a tool, it's because it broke in the middle of a job. Not just sitting idle. I just could not wait 5 days, so I held my nose and got it from Amzn.Last edited by Woody Sound; 10-13-2025 at 02:06 PM.
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This is kinda funny.
Originally Posted by nyc chaz
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I was told GC and Musicians friend were the same company, is that true? Similar buisness model, painless returns. Questionable provenance of items ordered and recieved.
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I enjoyed my copy of "Joe Pass Plays the Music of Michael Jackson"... Originally Posted by nyc chaz
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I sure hope you kept it, it's a very rare collectors item now! Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
Reminds me of the old joke:
Q. What do Michael Jackson and Jose Conseco (Oakland A's baseball player) have in common?
A. They both wear a glove on one hand for no apparent reason!
(This joke was coined near the end of Jose's career when balls hit to him in the outfield were landing on his head, etc.)
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A Classic! I'd never sell my copy. Originally Posted by Doctor Jeff
I enjoyed my copy of "Joe Pass Plays the Music of Michael Jackson"...
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MF bought GC about 25 years ago. They're the same business with a few exceptions, e.g. you can't use MF points at GC. Most of the used equipment on MF is at GC stores, although I think the "open box" stuff can be either GC demos or returns to MF or GC. You can't negotiate price with MF on used stuff from GC, although you can call the GC store that has the item you want and try to get a reduction. Originally Posted by Rickco
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There really was record called, Joe Pass plays the hits of The Rolling Stones,Lol!
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Originally Posted by jads57
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Released in 1966. Sounds like a real winner, AllMusic gave it 1.5 stars, but I'd still like to hear what he did with the songs. Satisfaction? Having trouble even imagining him playing that!
This one sounds interesting, haven't heard it:
Roy Clark & Joe Pass Play Hank Williams | AllMusic
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