Favorite single coil

[SimplyTH]

I have a cheap project guitar (bullet mustang) that I am looking to swap the pickups in. Has a big swimming pool rout so I can put anything in just have to recut the pickguard. Looking for some single coils (I am not really a fan of humbuckers I'm learning). Hoping for a full but clear and bell-like tone. Something along the lines of Mclaughlin's tone with Miles is what I am hoping for (not looking for an exact recreation just more of a reference). Any input would be appreciated and I would like to keep prices low since this is just a budget project guitar.

[Skip Ellis]

I like the Fender 'No Casters' a lot, and, if you have room in the neck position, the Vintage Vibe Charlie Christian from Pete Biltoft is a great pickup.

[Jimmy Mack]

A good P 90 is one of my favs.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

I like the Fender 'No Casters' a lot, and, if you have room in the neck position, the Vintage Vibe Charlie Christian from Pete Biltoft is a great pickup.

I do not know how "Charlie Christian" type pickups relate to the McLaughlin sound you are after, but if you want to go into that direction you could try a Roswell Charlie Christian pickup in humbucker size for a fraction of the price of the Pete Biltoft one which probably more suits your search for something budget. I haven't tried them myself but I am planning to put two of them in a Yamaha tele in the nearer future.

[339 in june]

+1 for P90
If you want to keep this cheap, I have been surprised by the sound of the Roswell P90-like in my Harley Benton

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

+1 for P90
If you want to keep this cheap, I have been surprised by the sound of the Roswell P90-like in my Harley Benton

The Rosswell stuff really seems to have a good quality to price ratio from what you here all around

[James W]

John McLaughlin mostly played a Fender Mustang with Miles, FWIW.

With a humbucker as the neck pickup from the look of it.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

+1 for P90
If you want to keep this cheap, I have been surprised by the sound of the Roswell P90-like in my Harley Benton

Off-topic: You have this one IIRC from that "cheapo guitars" thread, right? So it is really worth it? I was looking at an offer for a used one this week.

[Mick-7]

Off-topic: You have this one IIRC from that "cheapo guitars" thread, right? So it is really worth it? I was looking at an offer for a used one this week.

Telecaster brands compared:

[SimplyTH]

John McLaughlin mostly played a Fender Mustang with Miles, FWIW.

With a humbucker as the neck pickup from the look of it.

His hand is in the way, can any confirm if that is a humbucker?

[ThatRhythmMan]

His hand is in the way, can any confirm if that is a humbucker?

Seems like it could be either.






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[SimplyTH]

Thanks for pulling those up, do you know when the pick with the humbucker is from roughly?

[ThatRhythmMan]

Thanks for pulling those up, do you know when the pick with the humbucker is from roughly?

I don’t. It was posted on the forum a couple of years ago.


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[jazzshrink]

I did a little research and quite a few people believe the guitar in question is a Fender Duo-Sonic, likely fitted with two P90s.

[AllanAllen]

I like these. Have them in my Broadway.

G.M. P90 DOG EAR NECK PICKUP CREAM ALNICO 2 MAGNETS | eBay

A clip from a gig.

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[Bobby Timmons]

Fwiw, the SD antiquity mustang is a really beautiful pickup. You sound like you're tuning the sound not necessarily to the mustang, but I thought I would chime in since you did say single coil. It sounds so warm, tone rich, authentic and springy. Pretty cool pup.

[Boss Man Zwiebelsohn]

Keep in mind folks that the OP wants a budget PU and to sound like John Mclaughlin with early fusion Miles Davis instead of throwing all your favorite PUs at him LOL.

[Cunamara]

Bear in mind that some of McLaughlin's recording with Miles was done on a Gibson flattop guitar with a DeArmond soundhole pickup, some was done on a rented Les Paul.

[James W]

Just to clear up some confusion: McLaughlin mostly played a Fender Mustang with Miles (not a Duo-Sonic) the picture of him with Miles above is at a gig from February 1970, which is about the same time that he recorded the album Devotion, which is where the big close-up picture posted above is from.

More info on McLaughlin's guitars here: WBTG -JmL Gears - JmL Guitars Over The Years (italway.it)

[James W]

From the research I gathered Mr.McLaughlin used a stock 1966/1967 Fender Duo Sonic II probably with the 25” scale length neck for the “In a Silent Way” recordings. The Duo Sonic II is the guitar he brought with him from England in 1968/1969 when he became a member of Tony Williams’ band “Lifetime”.

McLaughlin used the same Fender Duo Sonic II on the first Lifetime debut/double album “Emergency” in 1969 on BlueNote as the recording for Davis’ recording of “In a Silent Way”.

The p/u’s were stock Bakelite covered fender single-coil pickups with gray bottoms and balanced avg outputs of 6.35k neck and 6.30k bridge.

If you can find a copy of the February 2004 Guitar Player Magazine, it has a in depth retrospective /interview with John McLaughlin on the gear he used for “Silent Way”.

Here is a pic of a stock 1967 Fender Duo Sonic II

All wrong. This is based on the Guitar Player magazine from 2004 you mention: WBTG -JmL Gears - JmL Guitars Over The Years (italway.it)

[James W]

Negative. JM used the Duo Sonic II in 1969 with Davis and Tony Williams’ “Lifetime” trio. The Gibson Hummingbird acoustic with a p/u that he states he used on IASW he replaced with the Duo Sonic II at first.

John McLaughlin does state in a Guitar Player interview from 1994 that he used a Gibson Hummingbird acoustic with a p/u for the IASW sessions:

“ You played an acoustic with Lifetime?!
In the beginning, but it was tough because Tony's such a powerful drummer and Larry was pulling these weird sounds out of the organ. It was loud and sometimes would start to feedback, and it's hard to play when the guitar is freaking out. But, for example, [Davis'] In A Silent Way -- that's a Hummingbird, just a pure acoustic with a pickup. But as time went by Miles wanted a louder guitar, and I did too. It was in the air: The end of the '60s, early '70s was a pretty wild period, so I went with a solidbody, and especially when the Mahavishnu started, because it was so loud. But we featured acoustic guitar in all the recordings, onstage. And in the hotel there was always an acoustic.”

Exactly! McLaughlin used an acoustic with a pick-up for In a Silent Way and the first Tony Williams Lifetime album. This is not what you said - you said he used a Duo-Sonic -

From the research I gathered Mr.McLaughlin used a stock 1966/1967 Fender Duo Sonic II probably with the 25” scale length neck for the “In a Silent Way” recordings. The Duo Sonic II is the guitar he brought with him from England in 1968/1969 when he became a member of Tony Williams’ band “Lifetime”.

McLaughlin used the same Fender Duo Sonic II on the first Lifetime debut/double album “Emergency” in 1969 on BlueNote as the recording for Davis’ recording of “In a Silent Way”.

Here he is in the studio at the sessions of the first Lifetime album, Emergency -

Robben Ford who played with Davis had this to say in an interview for Vintage Guitar Magazine:

Question: “ It seems odd that you’d own a Fender Duo-Sonic?

Answer: “There were times when I felt like having something kind of small would make it easier to play in a certain way, particularly in a jazz context. Also, John McLaughlin used one of those guitars on [Miles Davis’] In A Silent Way and when he was with Tony Williams Lifetime. And they have wonderful pickups in them; they sound really good. But ultimately, the bridge leaves a lot to be desired, and makes the guitar pretty unplayable.”
From this interview: Robben Ford | Vintage Guitar(R) magazine
Last

Pics of JM with his Fender Duo Sonic II in 1969 playing with Tony Williams in his first “Lifetime Trio”.

So, Robben Ford mistakenly thinks McLaughlin used a Duo-Sonic on In a Silent Way. No big deal.

Anyway, I know from a interview with McLaughlin himself that it was a Fender Mustang that he used on Bitches Brew, Jack Johnson, Live-Evil and other records - read this = WBTG -JmL Gears - JmL Guitars Over The Years (italway.it)

But I can't be bothered arguing with you about whether it was a Mustang or Duo-Sonic, since they look more or less identical.

[339 in june]

Off-topic: You have this one IIRC from that "cheapo guitars" thread, right? So it is really worth it? I was looking at an offer for a used one this week.

Yes, and yes. I was quite surprised by the quality,of the guitar when receiving it, and I remember thinking that I'll probably have to do a lot of set-up when it "dries" over the weeks/months. That was nearly 3 years ago and didn't have to adjust anything on it.
Have I been lucky on this one ? I don't know as I haven't tried another HB guitar but I, for sure, don't regret this purchase.
If one day I want to spend a few € for a guitar, I'll consider buying its blue sister with humbuckers Harley Benton TE-90QM HH Trans Blue – Thomann France
And what is the risk for less than 200€ ? Go for it !
To stay in line with OP's question, these Roswell pickups are loud and clear and worth a try
Sorry for a bit of thread derail (Bop Head's fault !)

[jazzshrink]

...Anyway, I know from a interview with McLaughlin himself that it was a Fender Mustang that he used on Bitches Brew, Jack Johnson, Live-Evil and other records - read this = WBTG -JmL Gears - JmL Guitars Over The Years (italway.it)

Would you please provide a link to the McLaughlin interview? I'd love to read it (can't get enough of IASW & BB-era Miles). Thanks in advance.

[James W]

Would you please provide a link to the McLaughlin interview? I'd love to read it (can't get enough of IASW & BB-era Miles). Thanks in advance.

I'd love to read it too, but google is no help.

If you scroll to the bottom of this link, it says it's from Guitar Player Magazine, February 2004 - WBTG -JmL Gears - JmL Guitars Over The Years (italway.it)

[jazzshrink]

In an interview with Robert Fripp in the July 1982 issue of Musician, John McLaughlin mentions playing a "well-seasoned, psychedelically repainted Fender Jaguar" during his time with Tony Williams. The plot thickens, the mystery remains.