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I'm thinking of getting a set of these to try on my Eastman AR403ce.
Does anyone have any experience with these strings?
Thanks!
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02-11-2024 07:35 PM
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I'm glad you brought this up. With the recent big rise in TI prices, I'm wondering how the Pyramids compare. I now have TI JSs on all 3 arch tops and my tele. I have 4 sets of JS113s left for the archies and 1 set of JS112s, so I'm good for at least 3 or 4 years if all strings live out their useful lives. And I have 2 sets of 12-52 Chromes left from before I switched to TIs.
Originally Posted by Tom Karol
I've been getting from 6 months to a year+ from TIs, depending on the guitar. But even the arch top I gig with about 30 shows a year and practice on about 3 hours a week goes a year on JS113s with no decline in intonation or amplified tone. The Tele gets 3 to 5 hours of practice a week and does about 50 three hour blues shows and 25 jazz or commercial dates a year. I get at least 4 to 6 months from a full set, but I change the E1 and B every 6 weeks or so to prevent breakage because the blues dates are much harder on them from.bending and vibrato.
There have been many posts about the Pyramids, but no.one has offered direct comparisons among Chromes, TIs, and Pyramid Golds. So I hope you get a good response. When a really good sale comes along, I plan to pick up a few spare sets.Last edited by nevershouldhavesoldit; 02-13-2024 at 05:42 PM.
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It’s been a few years but I’ve used them in the past. They are warmer than thomistiks. Like a conventional yesterday flat wound if that makes sense. Still nickel so the tone complexity is there. The gauging is more conventional as well. I tried to revisit them a bit ago but grabbed a set that was defective in a big way. Haven’t tried again. Hope this helps a bit.
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They do not come close to TI's in tone, sustain, and longevity IMO. Brand new they sound like 2 year old TI's.
I have tried to love them but cannot. Much rougher feel too then TI's and have got a lot of sets with defective strings that were DOA right out of the pack.
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I've tried them - they're not bad, I like them better than D 'Addario Chromes, but I still think TIs are worth the extra money. The set I bought had some sort of black residue on the wound strings too.
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Unrelated but I finally tried a set of dogal expressive jazz flats. Steel flatwounds. I’m not even into flats but I checked them out because a player I really like endorses them. They did not disappoint and I much prefer them over TIs. They’re about the same price though.
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Thanks everyone for the feedback.
(Addition: I'm going to try a TI JS113 13-53 set!)Last edited by Tom Karol; 02-13-2024 at 04:27 PM. Reason: Addition
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They've been my standard on all my archtops since I decided to ignore the cost and try them a few years ago when I saw them on sale. They last very well for a year or more, although I use plain steel 13s & 17s because they're several thou thicker than the TI plains and sound a bit less bright to me on both Eastmans and the Ibanez. I carry the unused plated TI plains as spares in my gig bags. Originally Posted by Tom Karol
The durability and longevity are not anecdotal. I posted a blinded, volume matched comparison of a year old set and a brand new set on the same guitar about 2 years ago. Half of the responding forum readers guessed the wrong ones, including me. Intonation was checked with a good strobe tuner, and it had not declined at all.
Given how good they are and how long they stay good, I'll live with the price hike and stay with TIs. No other string gets so much praise and so few negative comments here.
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Did you find the tension higher? Originally Posted by omphalopsychos
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Yes the tension is a bit higher than thomastik, but IMO thomastik strings have too low of tension for me because they use very thin gauges for a given set. Originally Posted by skiboyny
My typical string set for an archtop is a set of 12s with trebles from a set of 13s. Typically this maps to the following gauges: .013, .017, .024w, .032, .042, .052
So if I want to do the same thing with Thomastiks, a set of 12s would get me: 012, .016, .020w, .027, .037, .050. Which feels WAY too floppy, thin. The reason for this is that Thomastik matches a heavy set of trebles with lighter wound strings, kind of like what I do. In theory, then, I should just get a set of 13s from TI that would be the gauges I want. However, in a set of TI 13s here's what you get: .013, .017, .021w, .028, .039, .053. The G, D, and A strings are all way too thin. It might not bother most players, but the weird guages just get in the way for me.
The Dogals don't have this problem. I bought their 12-52 set, put a 13 and 17 on there and that was that. Perfect set.
If you're a fan of Thomastiks but want to try Dogals, I recommend comparing the gauges in the Dogals. For example, if I were a TI JS 12 user, I'd get the Dogal 11-50 set and supply my own 12 and 16.
If there are concerns about the tension from Dogals, it's easy to adjust via the truss rod so that the tension doesn't throw off your setup (i.e. consistent action).
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I haven't done any careful measuring, but I suspect that the reason TI strings have a lower tension is that the cores are slightly smaller than some other brands. It's easy enough to have the same external diameter for wound strings even with different core diameters.
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TIs are made to the old metric standard German "zoll", which is 1.04 inches (26.3 mm). The inch used by the modern world is 25.4 mm. So almost all TIs are a few thou thinner than other strings labeled the same thickness but measured against the standard inch. This accounts for some of the reduced tension. The core is round, which makes it lower tension than the more common hex core. And the cores are apparently a bit thinner than those on many other strings.
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Actually guys I think the reason TI strings have unusual gauges has nothing to do with core to wrap ratios or different unit of measurement for scale length. The scale length argument would imply that there's a consistent relative difference between TI strings and other brands who measure on 25.4. As for the core-to-wrap ratio, there's just no evidence for it.
My understanding of why TI gauges are different is because TI is sold on the concept of "balanced tension" strings. I.e. the gauges should produce a set of strings that all have roughly the same tension in standard tuning. This is contrary to traditional string gauges but other string makes have adopted this as an offering.
Here are the tensions (in lbs) associated with TI Swing and Bebop 13 and TI Swing 12.
SET JS112 medium light P12 22.8 P16 22.7 JS20 24.6 JS27 24.1 JS37 22.8 JS50 23.3
SET BB112 light P12 22.8 P16 22.7 P20 24 BB28 23.8 BB36 22 BB50 22.5
SET JS113 medium P13 25.9 P17 25 JS21 27.3 JS28 27.3 JS39 24.8 JS53 26
SET BB113 medium light P13 25.9 P17 25 BB21 26.7 BB30 26 BB38 24.7 BB53 25.4
As you can see for a given set, Thomastik uses gauges that have roughly the same tension.
In contrast here are D'Addarios EJ21, which is a very standard set of 12s.
ITEM # NOTE DIAMETER TENSION PL012 E 0.012 in 23.36 lbs PL016 B 0.016 23.31 NW024 G 0.024 28.02 NW032 D 0.032 27.63 NW042 A 0.042 25.60 NW052 E 0.052 21.15
And here's the D'Addario 13s.
ITEM # NOTE DIAMETER TENSION PL013 E 0.013 in 27.42 lbs PL017 B 0.017 26.31 NW026 G 0.026 32.76 NW036 D 0.036 33.93 NW046 A 0.046 30.14 NW056 E 0.056 25.22
Just to conclude. "Traditional" strings are not balanced tension, i.e. same tension across all strings. Typically strings have higher tension in the middle. I don't know the reason why. I also don't know why it's an advantage for strings to have "balanced tension". I can understand it sounds nice from a marketing perspective, but I'm so accustomed to "traditional" gauges that when I play something with balanced tension they just feel off. Additionally, there are pickups that have fixed pole piece height. Messing with gauges is going to mess with the relative signal strength of the strings. I already have trouble playing nickel wound G strings with certain pickups; don't need a balanced tension set making this worse.
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Here's more fun: I often measure the actual diameters of many strings because I put together string sets with various loose strings and partial string sets. I have found that actual string diameters are almost always smaller than as stated on packaging/specifications.
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Tried the Pyramid golds, same set. They're "fine." Slightly increased tension is nice though they're rougher than TIs. Acoustically kind of old time twangy sounding if that makes sense, and leave my hands covered in what I guess is nickle residue (which seemed perpetual). Considering the seemingly common reviews of qc problems here and there, and the price, I'll stick with TIs for a nickle wrapped flat.
I am very intrigued by the Dogals Omphalophsycos referenced. I was all in on Labella, (also steel, conventional gauged sets, smooth as glass, thunky yet also lively) but after 2/3 packs had issues, I moved on...or I should say back to TIs.
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I used Pyramid Round Core FWs quite a bit. I had string breakage on installation once. The company asked me to send those strings to them, which I did. They replaced the two strings. It was a small gesture.
I've had no problems for 10 years going through many sets on 24.75 and 25.5 inch scales.
TIs are the gold standard. Chromes very good and bright. Pyramids are a respectable choice. We are lucky to have these choices.
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Put them (TI JS113 13-53 set) on 2 days ago and slightly tweaked bridge, truss rod, and PU polepieces yesterday:
Very good with both Henriksen Bud 6 and DV Mark Little Jazz.
But today: Eastman AR403ce (stock PU), Blue Chip Jazz 60, Henriksen JazzAmp 112 - Dead Solid Pefect!
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