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I’m speaking with Mike from marsh amplifiers about a dumble clone amp. I’ve had my heart set on getting a good dumble clone for a while. Mike seems great and very friendly. I’m about to send a deposit but wanted to find out before I pull the trigger if anyone has experience with his amps? The price is very very fair but want to make sure the quality of build and sound is good as well.
your experience is greatly appreciated thanks for sharing!
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11-23-2023 01:34 PM
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[I'd probably check over on The Gear Page for that input ...]
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Check with Wolfe's Guitars in Jupiter, Florida. He's a Marsh dealer and their site has a Dumble-inspired combo (Clifton 22 Overlord) in stock.
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I have built a number of Dumble-style amplifiers. I looked at the Marsh web site and they have pictures of their "Overlord" amplifier. The rectifier and fet boards look identical to Ceriatone. Neither look anything like a real Dumble either.
Marsh amplifier:
Ceriatone ampifier:
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Real Dumble boards for comparison:
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Of course there are major differences between 'real' Dumbles and knock-offs.
Also, Marsh and Ceriatone amps don't cost $10,000 - $500,000 like real Dumble amps.
Marsh are handmade in the USA and Ceriatone in Asia.
The OP simply wants comments from users of Marsh's version, so I directed him to a source to help him get into.
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There really should be no differences, if the amp is worthy
Originally Posted by Gitfiddler
Of course there are major differences between 'real' Dumbles and knock-offs.
Also, Marsh and Ceriatone amps don't cost $10,000 - $500,000 like real Dumble amps.
Marsh are handmade in the USA and Ceriatone in Asia.
The OP simply wants comments from users of Marsh's version, so I directed him to a source to help him get into.
Most people could not tell my amps from the originals.
Maybe he [Marsh] sources parts from Nik at Ceriatone?
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I have some limited experience dealing with Marsh. On eBay, he sells "reproduction" faceplates for a variety of vintage amps (mainly Fender). I've bought a few of them for some home brew amps I've built and they've all been very high quality and professionally done.
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I know nothing about Marsh amps, but I can tell you that that brand is not as well known other brands such as Bludotone, Louis Electric, Amplified Nation, Two Rock etc. In fact I have never heard of it, and I thought I knew most of them.
As someone said, there is a lot of discussion about Dumble clones at TGP by people who have owned multiple variants. Also, there are several types of Dumble circuits that you should familiarize with to help zero in on what you want. Dumble knowledge is a deep dive.
I would not purchase one of the lesser known brands, they would be harder to resell. And people often change their minds about these amps.
Happy hunting!
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There are two basic Dumble "sounds", the Steel String Singer and the Overdrive Special. There are many conflicting numbers in print now, but it appears to me that Dumble made about 300 amps in all. There were at least half a dozen named models, but his sound fell basically into the two camps of the SSS and the ODS. Dumble set up each amp that he made for the person who commissioned it, with their chosen characteristics of tone, touch, etc. So there's variation in the sound and feel from amp to amp even though they're the "same model". Each has a range of tone and feel within which those of the same name fall. But you can't assume that one amp or pedal trying to emulate a SSS or an ODS sounds even close to another one. You have to try them yourself with your guitar(s), your ears, and your touch. Originally Posted by bluejaybill
The Steel String Singer is a single channel amp that puts out a chimey relatively clean sound with light, smooth overdrive. Here's a video of Eric Johnson playing through his Steel String Singer (Dumble serial number 005):
The second Dumble sound is the seriously overdriven but buttery smooth sound of the Overdrive Special. Here's the classic ODS sound on an interesting album by a Brit (I think) named Marcus Cliffe. Go to the solo at 2:35 on I Put A Spell on You.
And here's Dumble ODS #002 in a video by Mick Taylor. At about 6 minutes, he switches from the "clean" channel to the "not so clean" channel, and he twiddles the knobs to demonstrate the range of this amp:
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Here's Dumble ODS serial # 0022 for some contrast:
And here's an interesting interview with Robben Ford about his love of Dumble amplifiers and how he started using them:
I got into this because I love the chime and smooth sustain for blues, fusion, and a surprising number of pop tunes. Even though the tones of those who inspired me to look into this are different, they share the common thread of smooth rich tone that's not thinned out unless dialed in to be that way. When in the sweet zone, either dialing back the guitar's volume pot or picking more lightly will clean up the sound. I'm a D junkie for sure - I'm just 6 figures short of the purchase price today. So I've tried many of the Dumble clone pedals out there and will post a separate review at some point.
There are a few excellent pedals out there that come very close to a real Dumble (both the SSS and the ODS, although I haven't found both in the same pedal yet). If I were in the market for a combo amp, I'd give serious consideration to the Marsh. I've never even seen one in the flesh let alone heard or played through one. If you want the Dumble sound and feel, I think it's worth a look. At this point, I'm happy with my Smokin Amp Company Zensation pedal through a Vibrolux or a CS PR - it's very very good, but it's not quite a Dumble. If a Marsh is as good as the maker claims and one became available at a decent price, I'd jump on it since they're quite a bit less expensive than Fuchs, Two Rock etc.
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(Their real hellfire model will be called something like AII I suppose?
)
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I had a Marsh Vibroverb clone a good while back. Excellent amp. Did the blackface sound very well. I sold it when I discovered the blackface sound was not what I wanted anymore.
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One important aspect of the SSS, is there's almost no consitency between versions
Dumble Steel String Singer: Notes on 1–7 – Vic Dillahay
They were all made for the specific owner. I think ODS variants are a little more consistent. If if were ordering an SSS, I would ask exactly which schematic is it based on.
Also, for clean sounds only, I don't think the Dumble route is necessary. You can get in the ballpark with a good sivlerface and a few mods or a good eq pedal (if you know how to use one). I love Dumble cleans, but they're nothing more than a "perfected" blackface clean sound. IMHO.
If you also want the overdrive part, that's where I think a Dumble is worth it. No other amp has that good clean and OD sound.
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The mysterious Mr Dumble delivered one of his creations to an idol of mine, about five years after the promise. He wasn't infallible, though. This combo's transformers were for U.S. voltage. Here in Finland, as in the rest of Europe, it's 230V. Although converted, the combo sits in a safe place as a pension fund. My idol has addressed four-digit audiences through Quilter and TC Electronics amps, and cabs that I'm shy to name. All his backline fits in a green suitcase.
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Worth it, if you have the money! I had the great pleasure of playing an ODS at great length in an amp store in Reseda back in the '80's- I remember that it had a brown suede covering. It was absolutely astonishingly great sounding, if that's the sound you are after. Which I was, at the time, but $10K was a bit much for my pocketbook- that was a lot of money back then! Too bad I passed on it. For that matter, too bad I passed on that '59LP for $2K in the early '70's! Oh well... Originally Posted by jorgemg1984
I did however get a Jim Kelly FACS amp, another semi-holy grail amp. I never bonded with it, and sold it on to a famous guy- he let it go as well. But people love those amps now.
BTW I think an SSS is a quite a bit more evolved than a classic Fender BF circuit, but I've never played one. And I'll never need that kindof wattage again!
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I should have been clearer on my post - by Dumble I meant Dumble clones, not actual Dumbles. Even when we're talking about clones, I don't think they're worth it just for cleans - you can get in that ballpark with a Blackface Fender a good use of eq and compressor. I do think they're worth it if you want both - great cleans and great OD! Originally Posted by bluejaybill
And even for OD, lots of blues player just use a Fender wih headroom, like a Super Reverb, and a Zendrive or something like that for the OD tone. Live, it's close enough...
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There were also Dumble models of which almost no one has heard. For example, Jackson Browne and John Mayer (and a few others) used "Overdrive Reverb" Dumbles. The one made for Jackson Browne is said by many to have been used by SRV for the Texas Flood album.
Here's a fascinating video of an ODR showing the incredible sustain it could deliver with very little crunch even on chords (which is why Santana also used one for a while) -
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The only real Dumble I've been up close and personal with was the one he built for David Lindley. I was on staff at the Sound Factory in Hollywood around 77-78.
Dave played lap steel through it.
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Ran across this thread as it was one of the only more recent threads asking about Marsh Amplification. I ordered one of Mike’s amps earlier this year around May. This may be late in terms of your post, but thought I would go ahead and share. To my understanding Mike does source parts or kits from Nik at Ceriatone according to another forum. I can tell you that the FSX-50, which is a Dumble clone, arrived to me packaged very well. It is built like a tank. The fit and finish is outstanding. Mike made every effort to build my amp aesthetically the way I wanted it. See picture. As far as the tone, I would say this. I am not some expert on Dumble amplifiers, but I did a fair amount of research before making this significant purchase. The tone is huge, it’s fat, the clean is incredible and the drive can go from edge of breakup to higher levels of blues overdrive. It’s the most incredible amp I’ve ever played on. People can sit on these forums and say well it’s not a Dumble, Bludotone does it better, etc. The problem is that these things are not accessible. Almost every builder I looked at was either extremely high price $4000+ or had a waitlist a year long or longer. Mike got me an amp within 2 months time. Mike delivered me an absolute monster 6L6 Dumble-style amp with multiple gain stages, usable tone shaping with bright, deep, and mid switches. He added reverb for me as well. Overdrive trim is on the back to help set overdrive. It’s 50w with attenuation to 25w. Footswitch for clean boost and overdrive included. I have been gigging for 6 months with the amp and it has been nothing short of professional. Mike Marsh builds a very high quality product. If you are still on the fence, I can tell you it was worth it. If you already got it, great, but wanted to share my experience. Originally Posted by NYC
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I’m new to group and late to reply but have experience to relate. I own a 1967 Vibrolux and a Marsh Springfield with Overlord. I love Vibrolux when it feels good but it has more bad days than good. But I love the Vibrolux enough to have sought a modern clone which Marsh has. I bought it off Reverb from Wolfe Guitars who got it to me that same week. I’m in Alabama so travel distance was low.
I watched enough YouTubes of the Springfield to know that the Overlord option was a must have. By the way, I bought the Marsh about the same time this thread was started. Back to the Marsh. It has some low level hiss just like Vibrolux which disappears when being played through. The boring channel is phenomenal with overlord mod. There’s a lot packed into the mod so it takes awhile to dial in a sound for each guitar I play. But there are about 8 knobs including the ‘Normal’ switch to change things around. It’s a great complement to the Normal reverb channel.
The Normal channel is great and has the same ability as the 67 Vibrolux-that is it can get ‘raunchy’ when cranked high which is the sound people like from the vibrolux, but it’s different from the overlord channel. When the normal channel is cranked, some pedals lose their musicality at the overdriven level. I don’t use any pedals with Overlord side so don’t have any comment. I will comment on how great the Overlord side is having reverb matching the normal channels level. I use an a/b switch pedal which works great once the channels are balanced.
I play a strat, a PRS P22, and an Eastman jazz guitar through it. All need readjustment of controls to match their respective needs, just wish I could remember the settings….
I’m thinking about a second Marsh, the Clifton with overlord within the next 365 days. PS I don’t get to test many of the amps listed above but will mention I have two Dr Z’s (MAZ18 & EMS) which are phenomenal if needing the English sounds they have, which I haven’t gotten with the vibrolux circuit amps. The Marsh is definitely in the same league as them. The Marsh is also a great choice if wanting a vibrolux that doesn’t have aging issues.
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