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Hey,
Just wondering if anyone here on the forum has much experience of 40s New York Epiphones, I've just become the owner of a 1947 Broadway in good condition. It's does look like a couple of parts are non-original, someone swapped the rosewood bridge top for an ebony one and the nut may not be original. The reason the nut may not be original is that it looks like it's shimmed with a strip of wood and the slots for the E and B are too deep, resulting in the string radius being lopsided and subsequently the E and B strings don't ring cleanly.
Should I look to replace the nut and if so is there a 'vintage correct' alternative? And also the bridge top, should I think about changing to a rosewood top?
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08-16-2023 11:23 AM
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Looks like the original nut that was shimmed. You can either replace it or build up and recut the slots. I'd probably just put a new one on and put the orig in the case pocket, the old one msy not be getting proper contacr since its shimmed.
Is it a sunburst or natural finish? Many natural finish NY built Epis used a light colored pearwood bridge base w a rosewood top.
If you like how it sounds w ebony I don't think rosewood would make any improvement.
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Thanks for your reply. I think the bridge top is non-original because the top has not the B string cut properly.
Originally Posted by wintermoon
I've asked a couple of guitar techs and they've both recommended that I replace the nut, one said that they hated doing back-filling on nuts. I'm keen to keep original parts where possible but if I need to get a replacement nut is there something that is sort of vintage correct?
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Bone is period correct. This is a part that can wear out over decades of tuning strings, etc. Replace when necessary, it does not affect the value of the instrument. It's the same as it is with frets.
Any decent luthier can replace that nut with an appropriate one made of bone. The guitar will play and sound much better. At the same time, have the luthier notch the bridge top correctly. Your guitar will sound much happier.
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I think that's probably sensible!
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I've owned 4-5 40s epiphones and played a bunch more. Love a good broadway.
If its shimmed it's most likely original. The reason people shim is because they don't want to replace the original nut.
If you replace it, get another bone nut.
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Guitar needs a new bone nut and nuts are wear items in most cases originality means nothing. Ebony and rosewood for the saddle sound pretty close I cannot tell most of the time and I make saddles for Gibson tunomatics all the time. The best intonation is a saddle that sits on the post and is compensated with a continual 1/8th inch compensation from treble e to bass e. If you set the high E to be spot on at the 12th then usually with the gradual compensation you get better intonation. I never liked the intonation of the saddle that set the G to be closer. Depsite the theories on compensated saddle just do it like they do on flattops. If you can hear that well then you got some serious ears because no guitar has ever been in tune all over the neck.
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Yeah, my first inclination was to try and keep it, but I think the shim is dampening the tone somewhat. It's definitely a loud and resonant Epi archtop of that era but I think a new nut will bring out more of the guitar's tone. Originally Posted by omphalopsychos
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Thanks, my ears aren't that good! I believe a replacement nut will also help with the intonation as it's a touch out on the E and B strings. Originally Posted by deacon Mark
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My 1953 Epiphone has a shimmed nut. That happened when I had it refretted with larger frets than original, which caused all the nut slots to be too low. The cheapest and quickest solution is a shim, and my repair person didn't even ask me about it. It was well done, and you have to look closely to tell it was done. I can't hear any difference in tone, and it doesn't bother me at all. A new bone nut is certainly reasonable on the OP's guitar, if the slots aren't perfect and the tone bothers him. I see no reason to be a stickler about original nuts, nor original strings. Bridge saddles don't bother me much either. Sometimes parts and pieces just need replacing to get a playable instrument. I'm not a collector.
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BTW, does anyone think that a Stradivarius/Amati/(insert other builder's name here) worth millions of dollars has an original bridge or nut? Perhaps not even an original neck. None of that affects the value at all. I cannot fathom why it affects the value of guitars only a fraction of that age.
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pretty simple, because you're much more limited in selection when it comes to a great violin of that age/caliber as opposed to zillions of guitars where one can afford to be more selective.
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I think it has had a refret at some point, the frets are a little wider than vintage from what I can tell. It makes sense that the nut may have been shimmed as a result. In any case a local luthier had a bone nut that looks very similar to the one on there now. He will install it and hopefully after that I won't need to tinker around for a while! Originally Posted by sgosnell
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Ok so the luthier replaced the nut and did a good job of making it look like the old one. Only problem was that having a new nut identified problems with bridge saddle, as the slots weren't filed correctly and so he's going to have to sand it down and cut it as it should be. The top E string had some pronounced buzzing up and down the neck. Originally Posted by Iced Tea
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Got the guitar back from the tech today, they've replaced the nut and they were able to reshape the bridge saddle and made sure that the slots were cut correctly. Using reference photos of Epiphone bridges it looks like the bridge saddle didn't have enough angle for the strings and this was causing a bit of rattle. All the strings rings cleanly now, although the top E has a slightly thicker tone, it's a got a 0.012 gauge string on there now. The old nut looks like it could be an ivory nut rather than bone.
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