What's the downside in buying a guitar that has been restored

[rpjazzguitar]

Pretty sure it means neck reset and nut replaced.

It might. But I wondered if it's a new neck, but the old fingerboard and nut. I understand that's not quite logical, since a new neck isn't technically "reset".

But, OTOH, under the neck column it says replace. If it's just the nut why check replace?

There may be a benign answer, but at $4200 I don't even want to have the question.

[pingu]

Here's a minority viewpoint, at least among gearheads if not over here at JG.be:

P90s are P90s are P90s. The P90 is an incredibly robust design. An A5 / 7800 Ohm P90 sounds the same to me no matter who wound it, or when, or what color the insulation is. IME you won't hear any difference whether Jason Lollar personally licked the stamp on the package, or it's a used Gibson unit, or it's a $35 Chinese special from Guitar Fetish. And double that for jazz, where you're aiming straight for a clean sound.

(And don't even get me started on ancient capacitors.)

All the best with your quest!

Interesting ....
What's your view on Alnico 2 humbuckers ?

[Archie]

It might. But I wondered if it's a new neck, but the old fingerboard and nut. I understand that's not quite logical, since a new neck isn't technically "reset".

But, OTOH, under the neck column it says replace. If it's just the nut why check replace?

There may be a benign answer, but at $4200 I don't even want to have the question.

That guitar has more questions than an episode of mastermind

Gibson ES-175 1951 archtop jazz guitar | eBay

[FredH]

I am continually amazed at the collective genius and wisdom of this group! Thanks to all who responded. My gut instincts from the start was not to buy, but I thought I would seek counsel from this group whose experience far exceeds mine. And that is one of the many things I enjoy about JGF. Hanging out with you folks is like a continuing ed course that gets better with every contributor.

Peace

[Jimmy blue note]

There's one salient argument for not immediately dismissing this or any vintage instrument. I've seen more vintage instruments, repaired, restored, recommended, dissuaded and dismissed more 'old' instruments than I can possibly remember. Granted, I don't have the same perspective as an expert who buys and sells guitars for a living, but maybe that's why I feel differently.

First, I'd say if you can't try an instrument this old out, no matter how "clean" it looks, then you're buying into an unknown quantity with some metric of value that's not one I can speak for. I'm not a collector and I don't make the later resale of a guitar a primary consideration, so be clear about that.

When I say "Play it and see if it speaks to you", I firstly assume you're a good enough player to know some musicality within yourself, and you'll know if something interfaces with and liberates that in yourself. That quality may be one in ten, one in a hundred, once in a lifetime but not every instrument has "mojo", and in my personal experience, it's rare but even more rare in an instrument that hasn't been played in.
IF I find an instrument that DOES have what I call pure music in it, I'll admit that I'll go for it (partly because I can restore it myself and give it the care it needs) because I know if a guitar, that compendium of wood, glue, finish, wear and 'wood memory' has conspired with years of loving play, it can produce something that feels effortless to play and brings out previously untapped musical potential in me as a player.
It's a musical instrument, and it needs to be assessed as such. If it shouts out with magic, I'll say that's a lot more rare than something that looks like an eternal museum piece. Lots of pretty faces, lots of fish in the sea, but that single glorious marlin that has used every day of its long life becoming something no other guitar can come close to, well that's when I ask how long can we have a partnership and how sound are those repairs.

I once came across a 1938 L-10. Cracked heel. Botched refinish. Obvious cracks in the side (but nicely and craftily repaired) and old rusty machines. But OMG the guitar had a woody clarity to it that made every single note sound like a wood paneled concert hall. The seller wanted an appropriate price for such a sad dog, I offered 10% less. We were both excited and I took the guitar and the the vintage case and set about on a year long restoration whereby I rebuilt the neck heel, reset the angle, stripped it to the white, revealed the most outrageous curl and burl figure, put new (not original) machines, and pretty much shamelessly treated it like a princess.
Fast forward 5 years of playing in and loving that big box, and it's a player like nothing else I've EVER played.

All this is to say that in the hands of a player, or in the hands of a luthier, an instrument can be something that the original builder, nor any interim owner never planned on. There are instruments that are not merely guitars or commodities, but musicial mediums.

Perhaps that can be a reason to consider an old guitar, and yeah, it'll certainly make it a lot easier to close the door and walk away if you don't feel it.

Just a thought from the other side.

By the way, I've felt this in a laminate guitar too. I had the opportunity to try out Bern Nix's 175 and yeah, I'd have bought that if it had a 50 caliber bullet hole in it. It had the magic. It deserved all the care and any repair it would ever need.

[omphalopsychos]

Late to the party but to answer the OP. My point of view here is that “restored” guitars look like a deal because they’re cheaper than original ones but they seldom are priced accordingly with respect to the degree and quality of modifications.

Almost always original guitars are the wiser purchase, from an economic perspective. You pay more for them, but when you sell them you don’t have to explain way a bunch of defects and repairs. This allows them to sell quicker and at a higher price.

The guitar in question is a perfect example. Imagine what kind of experience you’ll have when you try to sell it.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

My point of view here is that “restored” guitars look like a deal because they’re cheaper than original ones but they seldom are priced accordingly with respect to the degree and quality of modifications.

The biggest problem for me is the difficulty (impossibility?) of knowing the true extent of the original damage / deterioration and the nature & quality of the repairs / modifications. That piece of paper from Gibson is essentially useless - it contains little factual information and much that serves only to confuse.

[Archie]

There's one salient argument for not immediately dismissing this or any vintage instrument. I've seen more vintage instruments, repaired, restored, recommended, dissuaded and dismissed more 'old' instruments than I can possibly remember. Granted, I don't have the same perspective as an expert who buys and sells guitars for a living, but maybe that's why I feel differently.

First, I'd say if you can't try an instrument this old out, no matter how "clean" it looks, then you're buying into an unknown quantity with some metric of value that's not one I can speak for. I'm not a collector and I don't make the later resale of a guitar a primary consideration, so be clear about that.

When I say "Play it and see if it speaks to you", I firstly assume you're a good enough player to know some musicality within yourself, and you'll know if something interfaces with and liberates that in yourself. That quality may be one in ten, one in a hundred, once in a lifetime but not every instrument has "mojo", and in my personal experience, it's rare but even more rare in an instrument that hasn't been played in.
IF I find an instrument that DOES have what I call pure music in it, I'll admit that I'll go for it (partly because I can restore it myself and give it the care it needs) because I know if a guitar, that compendium of wood, glue, finish, wear and 'wood memory' has conspired with years of loving play, it can produce something that feels effortless to play and brings out previously untapped musical potential in me as a player.
It's a musical instrument, and it needs to be assessed as such. If it shouts out with magic, I'll say that's a lot more rare than something that looks like an eternal museum piece. Lots of pretty faces, lots of fish in the sea, but that single glorious marlin that has used every day of its long life becoming something no other guitar can come close to, well that's when I ask how long can we have a partnership and how sound are those repairs.

I once came across a 1938 L-10. Cracked heel. Botched refinish. Obvious cracks in the side (but nicely and craftily repaired) and old rusty machines. But OMG the guitar had a woody clarity to it that made every single note sound like a wood paneled concert hall. The seller wanted an appropriate price for such a sad dog, I offered 10% less. We were both excited and I took the guitar and the the vintage case and set about on a year long restoration whereby I rebuilt the neck heel, reset the angle, stripped it to the white, revealed the most outrageous curl and burl figure, put new (not original) machines, and pretty much shamelessly treated it like a princess.
Fast forward 5 years of playing in and loving that big box, and it's a player like nothing else I've EVER played.

All this is to say that in the hands of a player, or in the hands of a luthier, an instrument can be something that the original builder, nor any interim owner never planned on. There are instruments that are not merely guitars or commodities, but musicial mediums.

Perhaps that can be a reason to consider an old guitar, and yeah, it'll certainly make it a lot easier to close the door and walk away if you don't feel it.

Just a thought from the other side.

By the way, I've felt this in a laminate guitar too. I had the opportunity to try out Bern Nix's 175 and yeah, I'd have bought that if it had a 50 caliber bullet hole in it. It had the magic. It deserved all the care and any repair it would ever need.

I once bought a 1972 Guild X500 from the US on this site for $250? The tone and volume knobs had been bashed in, there was a single pickup attached between the two humbuckers and there was no finish at all on the neck.
I couldn't get along with the neck as it was thin but it sounded phenomenal. I sold it to a friend who cycles through archtops at quite a rate. He won't sell it back to me; he loves it. I'm actually looking forward to getting it back one day. It would even be worth me putting a new neck on it.

But that was a $250 guitar and something you can take a punt on.