Eatsman AR480ce Disappointment

[Skip Ellis]

Been looking for one of these because of the single Seth Lover pickup and ebony fingerboard (don't like rosewood at all - instant deal breaker) and found a 'mint' pre owned one on Reverb but, in looking at the photos, the workmanship/fitment didn't seem to be as good as I would expect from them. In particular, the joints in the flamed maple binding (which I like) didn't meet up like it was supposed to - several places where it was short. I've done a lot of binding in my day and would never let something like this out of my shop. On top of that, the seller mentioned that he picked it up at the estate sale of a 'collector' and was asking the same price as CMI and others were pricing a new one for 'pre-order'. Someone may jump on this because they are hard to find (for a while anyway) but not me - I'll wait a couple months.

[jazzshrink]

Am I correct in thinking this is the area you're describing?



Interestingly, the binding with gaps is missing from the picture on the Eastman website.

[skiboyny]

Am I correct in thinking this is the area you're describing?



Interestingly, the binding with gaps is missing from the picture on the Eastman website.

If it is it seems on purpose. They all seem to be like that. I don't think I'd give it a second thought. I've always considered myself fussy.

[jazzshrink]

If it is it seems on purpose. They all seem to be like that. I don't think I'd give it a second thought. I've always considered myself fussy.

They all seem to be like what? My post illustrates a discrepancy between Eastman's photo and the photo provided by the seller. One has binding where the other one does not. I'm not making a value judgment, just an observation. Is this practice commonplace? Of course, I agree that the additional binding was installed on purpose. But what purpose? Is it hiding a minor imperfection or providing some functional benefit? I'd like to hear some builders weigh in with some theories.

[EastwoodMike]

For what it’s worth, my 380ce does not have this binding strip. Not that I have ever really noticed its absence. I would point out that the binding has a small black binding lamination layer which could be the visual cause of the ‘gap?’

[jazzshrink]

For what t’s worth, my 380ce does. It have this binding strip. Not that I have ever really noticed its absence.

Did you mean to say "It [doesn't] have this binding strip", because for the life of me I can't see it.

[skiboyny]

They all seem to be like what? My post illustrates a discrepancy between Eastman's photo and the photo provided by the seller. One has binding where the other one does not. I'm not making a value judgment, just an observation. Is this practice commonplace? Of course, I agree that the additional binding was installed on purpose. But what purpose? Is it hiding a minor imperfection or providing some functional benefit? I'd like to hear some builders weigh in with some theories.

The op mentioned the fit. I assumed he was talking about the spaces. They seem to be on all I’ve seen. I didn’t see the heel piece that looks lifted. That may be something unusual possibly added by someone other than the builder.

[EastwoodMike]

Did you mean to say "It [doesn't] have this binding strip", because for the life of me I can't see it.

Noted and corrected - thank you. Damn you autospell!!!

[bluenote61]

Another variation on an Eastman...

[Skip Ellis]

They got it right on that one....

[EastwoodMike]

They got it right on that one....

Maple binding down the neck as well. Which model is that bluenote? Looks flash!

[ccroft]

Might be worth noting that Eastman does change their binding schemes from time to time. My 2007 Pisano 880 has unbound f-holes and a bound headstock. Current model photos show bound f-holes and unbound headstock.

Mine also has binding running down the neck heel, and they did it as perfectly as it can be done.

[bluenote61]

Maple binding down the neck as well. Which model is that bluenote? Looks flash!

It's an AR905CE from 2005.

[jazzshrink]

Might be worth noting that Eastman does change their binding schemes from time to time...

For sure, but the discrepancy I noted between the "disappointing" AR480CE and the image I posted from the Eastman website is the same model and the same year (and a short one at that - 2023). That's what I found odd.

[LifeOnJazz]

There's one selling on Reverb now with a couple close-up pictures of the neck joint. You can see it doesn't have the same binding. Weird that Eastman would vary this detail on a new model.

EASTMAN AR480CE-SB John Pisano 30th Anniversary Edition EASTMAN AR480CE-SB John Pisano 30th Anniversary Edition | Reverb

[WilliamScott]

Might be worth noting that Eastman does change their binding schemes from time to time. My 2007 Pisano 880 has unbound f-holes and a bound headstock. Current model photos show bound f-holes and unbound headstock.

Mine also has binding running down the neck heel, and they did it as perfectly as it can be done.

My Pisano 880 has no binding in any of those places.

[2bornot2bop]

The 2023 model is without the horizontal maple section entirely. But I’d prefer the horizontal maple bar even with the slight vertical gaps. That’s not a big deal to me, and frankly, the gaps are even, so I’d not hesitate to purchase that guitar for their going price of $1599.

[SandChannel]

For 1500 bucks, you want binding like an Custom Shop L-5. Man, you are gonna be even more bummed when you find out they dye the ebony.

[Skip Ellis]

For 1500 bucks, you want binding like an Custom Shop L-5. Man, you are gonna be even more bummed when you find out they dye the ebony.

Don't mind dyed ebony, but I would never have let that binding out of my shop - it's just sloppy and there are examples shown here that show it done correctly. Either QC was asleep or it was a Fri afternoon or Mon morning.

[2bornot2bop]

Don't mind dyed ebony, but I would never have let that binding out of my shop - it's just sloppy and there are examples shown here that show it done correctly. Either QC was asleep or it was a Fri afternoon or Mon morning.

You can’t compare an AR480CE to an AR905CE, which sells for more than twice as much. Of course they spend more on the more expensive guitars, therefore you can’t expect the identical QC on both guitars.

[Woody Sound]

Here's my 803 with the traditional "ivoroid" binding.

[nevershouldhavesoldit]

You can’t compare an AR480CE to an AR905CE, which sells for more than twice as much. Of course they spend more on the more expensive guitars, therefore you can’t expect the identical QC on both guitars.

Quality of design may differ from model to model, line to line, etc. But quality of conformance to design specs should be uniform regardless of cost. Specs may differ, materials may differ, labor requirements may differ, level of trim may differ, finish may differ etc. But the level of conformity to specs should be the same throughout the line.

Gibson was a great example of this into the 1960s. A 125 was made to the same standard of manufacture as an L-5. An LG-1 was as well made as a J-200. Simple 1 layer binding was placed as well as 5 ply. The basic headstock logo was applied as accurately as the inlaid decoration on high end models. What was done to a guitar differed greatly with cost. But how well it was done did not (within the limits of hand vs mechanized production).

In my experience, Eastman is doing it well. There was a period (early 2000s as I recall) of poor QC during which good dealers were rejecting half or more of the guitars they received. But for the last decade +, I’ve not encountered any common quality issues in them. I first tried them when Ed Roman started selling them. We went to Vegas a few times a year back then for business, and visited his shop almost every time. I must have played every model he had in stock over the course of a few years. Even back then, I never played one that wasn’t a well made guitar at a very fair price. I’m still impressed - my two best guitars today are Eastman.

[jads57]

I think people get way too hung up on aesthetics vs actual quality and tone of the actual instrument. And while I’m as vain as the next guy, if it feels great and sounds great what else matters?

Eastman definitely delivers an extraordinary amount for their low prices. No doubt a Buscarino, Campellone, etc. are the Gold Standard but look at the asking prices.

[bohemian46]

'hung up on aesthetics". The maker is proud of their clumsy aesthetics. To include, Jr High School, failed woodworking class "vintage" and "violin" finishes.

[jads57]

I would say to you, name another brand that offers as much at their asking price?